D7000 Discussion Thread II

[daredevil123]

heh man. I am not sure how to live with it if it appears on every of your night shoot photos and u need to edit them all.
It is not something that you need to zoom it at 200% to see the hot pixel. It is a flashing bright point at just 35% view on my 15.6 inches laptop.

of course if u are saying iso200 LE > 4 mins.. gosh. i will not complaint at that point. coz I will not take 1 or 2k photos at one night for LE > 4 mins and edit them all after that.

if it is not something obvious, I can accept it. Just like my current d7k exchange set after remapping, still some points if I want to really scan pixel by pixel, but it is not a bright one that I need to remove from my every photos.

as a consumer, you should know your right on getting a good product to suite u.

Just bring it in to NSC and get it remapped and the hot pixels will be gone. What is the big deal?

On the topic of your rights.

This is your rights.

1. You have to right to warranty service. Bring the camera to NSC to get it re-mapped for you.

2. You have the right not to buy the camera.

What are you expecting? Nikon already tells people to bring it in so they can fix the problems. If you brought it in once and and still some hot pixels showing, bring it in again.

There is always sample variation, be it Nikon, Canon, Pentax or Sony. There will still be sample variation be it D3100, D90, D7000, D300s, D700 or D3s. Even the US$40,000 Hasselbald digital cameras has problems from time to time. Are you expecting that everything is perfect the moment you open the package 100% of the time? If that is the case, buy a fully manual film camera. There is no sensor or electronics for you to worry about.

The warranty is there for a reason. It is there to take care of any variations in quality. There is NO SUCH THING as 100% defect-free product. The important thing is for the manufacturer to stand by their product and fix the problems during warranty period. Which Nikon is clearly doing (and has done for you by giving you an exchange set). So what more do you want?

Maybe you should sell your D7000 and buy a 7D. After which you should look at the pictures from the 7D and see if you see the same problems. I see it too in the 7D for the limited times I saw the RAW output. BTW, I would be happy to buy your D7000 off you 2nd hand.

I think people just expect too much from the D7000.... and if you look closely.. the people complaining the most are the newbies. Stop pixel peeping and start shooting.

 

[PaulKami]

Just bring it in to NSC and get it remapped and the hot pixels will be gone. What is the big deal?

On the topic of your rights.

This is your rights.

1. You have to right to warranty service. Bring the camera to NSC to get it re-mapped for you.

2. You have the right not to buy the camera.

What are you expecting? Nikon already tells people to bring it in so they can fix the problems. If you brought it in once and and still some hot pixels showing, bring it in again.

There is always sample variation, be it Nikon, Canon, Pentax or Sony. There will still be sample variation be it D3100, D90, D7000, D300s, D700 or D3s. Even the US$40,000 Hasselbald digital cameras has problems from time to time. Are you expecting that everything is perfect the moment you open the package 100% of the time? If that is the case, buy a fully manual film camera. There is no sensor or electronics for you to worry about.

The warranty is there for a reason. It is there to take care of any variations in quality. There is NO SUCH THING as 100% defect-free product. The important thing is for the manufacturer to stand by their product and fix the problems during warranty period. Which Nikon is clearly doing (and has done for you by giving you an exchange set). So what more do you want?

Maybe you should sell your D7000 and buy a 7D. After which you should look at the pictures from the 7D and see if you see the same problems. I see it too in the 7D for the limited times I saw the RAW output. BTW, I would be happy to buy your D7000 off you 2nd hand.

I think people just expect too much from the D7000.... and if you look closely.. the people complaining the most are the newbies. Stop pixel peeping and start shooting.

I find your post rather astonishing... For a start, how do you define newbies?

Customers right should not be mixed up with photoshoot itself, be it talking about passion, experience or style. Please get this right.

Last but not least, I understand what you're putting through in your post (by telling people to care more about photoshoot than the technical defects itself). However, I'd be strongly disagree with you if you call someone a tech savvy (esp those particular about the performance of the camera and defects behind it), a newbie in photography. That also means you (intentionally or unintentionally) calling a photography expert, a tech idiot.

 

[daredevil123]

I find your post rather astonishing... For a start, how do you define newbies?

Customers right should not be mixed up with photoshoot itself, be it talking about passion, experience or style. Please get this right.

Nothing to do with customer rights. And I did not say it has anything to do with customer rights.

I just said a simple statement.

Most of the people complaining are newbies. If you do not believe me, you are welcome to look at all the complain posts and see how many of them have been shooting for more than 2 years.

 

[daredevil123]

I find your post rather astonishing... For a start, how do you define newbies?

Customers right should not be mixed up with photoshoot itself, be it talking about passion, experience or style. Please get this right.

Last but not least, I understand what you're putting through in your post (by telling people to care more about photoshoot than the technical defects itself). However, I'd be strongly disagree with you if you call someone a tech savvy (esp those particular about the performance of the camera and defects behind it), a newbie in photography. That also means you (intentionally or unintentionally) calling a photography expert, a tech idiot.

At no point did I call anyone a photography expert.
At no point did I call anyone a tech idiot.
At no point did I call anyone tech savvy.

Newbie just means people new in DSLR photography.

Do not put words in my mouth. Don't try to read between the lines when all that is there is empty space.

And like I said in my previous post, you are welcome to make a statistical count of the complaints and prove me wrong.

 

[PaulKami]

Nothing to do with customer rights. And I did not say it has anything to do with customer rights.

I just said a simple statement.

Most of the people complaining are newbies. If you do not believe me, you are welcome to look at all the complain posts and see how many of them have been shooting for more than 2 years.

I can sense that this is going to look like some argument exchange, so let me clarify first before I continue, I'm not arguing with you in anyway regarding the term 'newbie' in particular. I'm only keen in commenting about your point of view, and not intending to change your thoughts in anyway.

Alright, straight to the topic. Your point of view is that someone who've been taking photo for less than 2 years a newbie? Maybe so. However, that doesn't means he or she doesn't have the rights to own an ideal piece of equipment.

That also means that he or she have the right to comment, or to demand for a service that would otherwise justify on the money he or she spent on the gear.

Now, if you would wanna say that an experienced photography would not complain too much about their gear, cause they understand it inside out (eg. it's normal to have hot pixel), then you're right in a way, ethically. However, being a customer, there's no wrong to demand a service which we deemed to be right (eg. remapping of pixels to resolve the issue).

I hope you don't mix up being a 'newbie' in photography, against customer's right, and last but not least, against those who're more particular about the tiny bit of details (such as pixels), and start grouping them together. (Cause your "the people complaining the most are the newbies" sounded like "all people complaining, be it tech savvy or people who demanded customer's right, are newbie in photography). You can compile the statistics and prove yourself right if you want

 

[HELLOSTEVEN]

Just bring it in to NSC and get it remapped and the hot pixels will be gone. What is the big deal?

On the topic of your rights.

This is your rights.

1. You have to right to warranty service. Bring the camera to NSC to get it re-mapped for you.

2. You have the right not to buy the camera.

What are you expecting? Nikon already tells people to bring it in so they can fix the problems. If you brought it in once and and still some hot pixels showing, bring it in again.

There is always sample variation, be it Nikon, Canon, Pentax or Sony. There will still be sample variation be it D3100, D90, D7000, D300s, D700 or D3s. Even the US$40,000 Hasselbald digital cameras has problems from time to time. Are you expecting that everything is perfect the moment you open the package 100% of the time? If that is the case, buy a fully manual film camera. There is no sensor or electronics for you to worry about.

The warranty is there for a reason. It is there to take care of any variations in quality. There is NO SUCH THING as 100% defect-free product. The important thing is for the manufacturer to stand by their product and fix the problems during warranty period. Which Nikon is clearly doing (and has done for you by giving you an exchange set). So what more do you want?

Maybe you should sell your D7000 and buy a 7D. After which you should look at the pictures from the 7D and see if you see the same problems. I see it too in the 7D for the limited times I saw the RAW output. BTW, I would be happy to buy your D7000 off you 2nd hand.

I think people just expect too much from the D7000.... and if you look closely.. the people complaining the most are the newbies. Stop pixel peeping and start shooting.

I find your post rather astonishing... For a start, how do you define newbies?

Customers right should not be mixed up with photoshoot itself, be it talking about passion, experience or style. Please get this right.

Last but not least, I understand what you're putting through in your post (by telling people to care more about photoshoot than the technical defects itself). However, I'd be strongly disagree with you if you call someone a tech savvy (esp those particular about the performance of the camera and defects behind it), a newbie in photography. That also means you (intentionally or unintentionally) calling a photography expert, a tech idiot.

Nothing to do with customer rights. And I did not say it has anything to do with customer rights.

I just said a simple statement.

Most of the people complaining are newbies. If you do not believe me, you are welcome to look at all the complain posts and see how many of them have been shooting for more than 2 years.

At no point did I call anyone a photography expert.
At no point did I call anyone a tech idiot.
At no point did I call anyone tech savvy.

Newbie just means people new in DSLR photography.

Do not put words in my mouth. Don't try to read between the lines when all that is there is empty space.

And like I said in my previous post, you are welcome to make a statistical count of the complaints and prove me wrong.

I can sense that this is going to look like some argument exchange, so let me clarify first before I continue, I'm not arguing with you in anyway regarding the term 'newbie' in particular. I'm only keen in commenting about your point of view, and not intending to change your thoughts in anyway.

Alright, straight to the topic. Your point of view is that someone who've been taking photo for less than 2 years a newbie? Maybe so. However, that doesn't means he or she doesn't have the rights to own an ideal piece of equipment.

That also means that he or she have the right to comment, or to demand for a service that would otherwise justify on the money he or she spent on the gear.

Now, if you would wanna say that an experienced photography would not complain too much about their gear, cause they understand it inside out (eg. it's normal to have hot pixel), then you're right in a way, ethically. However, being a customer, there's no wrong to demand a service which we deemed to be right (eg. remapping of pixels to resolve the issue).

I hope you don't mix up being a 'newbie' in photography, against customer's right, and last but not least, against those who're more particular about the tiny bit of details (such as pixels), and start grouping them together. (Cause your "the people complaining the most are the newbies" sounded like "all people complaining, be it tech savvy or people who demanded customer's right, are newbie in photography). You can compile the statistics and prove yourself right if you want

Dear brother PaulKami & Daredevil123

Both please be cool and dont angry :angry: or fright...

We are here for discussion and not frighting.. be a men.. ok

Cheers :cheers: and be happy :vhappy:

 

[PaulKami]

Dear brother PaulKami & Daredevil123

Both please be cool and dont angry :angry: or fright...

We are here for discussion and not frighting.. be a men.. ok

Cheers :cheers: and be happy

I rest my case, no worries

Back to the topic of D7000 and sensors, I think nothing is ideal in this world and it's not quite possible that you'll have a perfect sensor in your camera. Like a few post back from me, I think it's all about how much one can tolerate. I got pretty anxious throughout all these talks here, but after checking that it'll not affect me much in my photoshoot, I guess I can tolerate it bah...

 

[ilurbu]

usually I would just keep quiet about posts but as a professional photographer of 9 years serving more than a few local and international agencies, I know for a fact that I have a right to a product that performs to specifications without the need for any after sales service almost as soon as my gear leaves the showroom as my property.

I know for a fact that Nikon or any other established brands, have in fact a social responsibility to their loyal customers who supported them through the years, through all the numerous product updates and through the belief that all products created by this great Japanese company is built with pride and to the best of their ability.

Toyota has the humility to admit it and so does any responsible organisation who believes in protecting the intangible asset which makes up for most of any corporation's perceived value. That intangible asset known as brand value. One may argue that Toyota only has the humility only because their products involve the safety of lives but I'm sure a google search would be able to prove my point in any other non-life-threatening industries.

Case in point, if Nikon believes in the value of customer loyalty and ever increasing market size for their products, then they should listen and find a solution to appease and work towards a better customer relationship, be it through service quality training, stricter 6 sigma and gemba kaizen management to achieve lower fault ratios, we don't really care. Because as customers, these efforts are opaque to us. Only the final results show for themselves.

over and out.

 

[daredevil123]

I can sense that this is going to look like some argument exchange, so let me clarify first before I continue, I'm not arguing with you in anyway regarding the term 'newbie' in particular. I'm only keen in commenting about your point of view, and not intending to change your thoughts in anyway.

Alright, straight to the topic. Your point of view is that someone who've been taking photo for less than 2 years a newbie? Maybe so. However, that doesn't means he or she doesn't have the rights to own an ideal piece of equipment.

That also means that he or she have the right to comment, or to demand for a service that would otherwise justify on the money he or she spent on the gear.

Now, if you would wanna say that an experienced photography would not complain too much about their gear, cause they understand it inside out (eg. it's normal to have hot pixel), then you're right in a way, ethically. However, being a customer, there's no wrong to demand a service which we deemed to be right (eg. remapping of pixels to resolve the issue).

I hope you don't mix up being a 'newbie' in photography, against customer's right, and last but not least, against those who're more particular about the tiny bit of details (such as pixels), and start grouping them together. (Cause your "the people complaining the most are the newbies" sounded like "all people complaining, be it tech savvy or people who demanded customer's right, are newbie in photography). You can compile the statistics and prove yourself right if you want

I've said it before and I will say it again since you missed my point.

1.
There is NO IDEAL PERFECT product. It does not exist. To make up for that, a manufacturer has given manufacturer's warranty. So in the case when something do go wrong, you can bring it in for a manufacturer to fix it. Has Nikon done this for D7000? Yes they did. The person in question had a problem, and he demanded service, and service was rendered. And IMHO it was rendered above and beyond when Nikon gave him a replacement unit. So, there is no consumer rights violation issue here. Point 1 solved.

2.
Newbie or not, they have consumer right. Yes I agree with this. And at no point in any of my posts did I say newbies do not deserve consumer rights. If you think I said that, I encourage you to read all my posts again to reconfirm. Point 2 solved.

3.
I never said or implied anything you claimed I said (in bold red in the quoted text above). But let me tell you what I think. People who are more experienced will know hot pixels is a common problem. But instead of making a big fuss out of this issue, they WENT DIRECTLY TO THE SOLUTION. Which is to go to NSC, ask for warranty service, get the sensor remapped and GET THE PROBLEM SOLVED. Newbies on the other hand, are not experienced with this. So they tend to go "Ohhh Noooooooooooo", panic, make a big fuss about it, post everywhere and complain about it. That is what I am saying.

So we are not arguing at all. You misunderstood what I said, and inferred my thoughts based on a single statement. And your inference is totally wrong. There is no case.

 

[daredevil123]

usually I would just keep quiet about posts but as a professional photographer of 9 years serving more than a few local and international agencies, I know for a fact that I have a right to a product that performs to specifications without the need for any after sales service almost as soon as my gear leaves the showroom as my property.

I know for a fact that Nikon or any other established brands, have in fact a social responsibility to their loyal customers who supported them through the years, through all the numerous product updates and through the belief that all products created by this great Japanese company is built with pride and to the best of their ability.

Toyota has the humility to admit it and so does any responsible organisation who believes in protecting the intangible asset which makes up for most of any corporation's perceived value. That intangible asset known as brand value. One may argue that Toyota only has the humility only because their products involve the safety of lives but I'm sure a google search would be able to prove my point in any other non-life-threatening industries.

Case in point, if Nikon believes in the value of customer loyalty and ever increasing market size for their products, then they should listen and find a solution to appease and work towards a better customer relationship, be it through service quality training, stricter 6 sigma and gemba kaizen management to achieve lower fault ratios, we don't really care. Because as customers, these efforts are opaque to us. Only the final results show for themselves.

over and out.

And with everything in this imperfect world, things do and will go wrong. And the warranty is there to take care of the issues gone wrong. And in this case, when the sensors are re-mapped, they will perform to specifications. Warranty is the way any manufacturer, for the most parts, shows that responsibility.

 

[daredevil123]

Dear brother PaulKami & Daredevil123

Both please be cool and dont angry :angry: or fright...

We are here for discussion and not frighting.. be a men.. ok

I am not angry. And I am not fighting.

I am typing all these with a very peaceful heart.

But I just have to say what I feel is right.

 

[Ouverture]

Sorry to interrupt, not trying to bash nikon or any person, i just feel that in this saga, shouldnt the QC dept at nikon checked and remap the sensors before the products leave the factory?

I am sure there are many heads rolling over at the factory now that additional costs are now incurred to remap or replace those units and somehow the quality perception of nikon is tanished.

 

[daredevil123]

i using 10s shutter speed without any lens (juz the cap cover), try iso 200...can't find any hot pixels. iso800 and iso1600 appeared many hot pixels while the latter show more.

trust me, it is high ISO noise.

 

[daredevil123]

Sorry to interrupt, not trying to bash nikon or any person, i just feel that in this saga, shouldnt the QC dept at nikon checked and remap the sensors before the products leave the factory?

I am sure there are many heads rolling over at the factory now that additional costs are now incurred to remap or replace those units and somehow the quality perception of nikon is tanished.

This I agree.

Just like how hot pixels and AF issue in the 7D has tarnished C's perception of quality.

When things like this happens, branding takes a hit.

 

[PaulKami]

So we are not arguing at all. You misunderstood what I said, and inferred my thoughts based on a single statement. And your inference is totally wrong. There is no case.

Clearing of misunderstanding? I guess it's time to move on

Regarding the services provided, NSC should honour us the option of remapping, rather than making our lives difficult with all these 'our company policy indicates that this is normal' bullshit isn't it? Is a request of remapping so difficult? :dunno:

 

[daredevil123]

Clearing of misunderstanding? I guess it's time to move on

Regarding the services provided, NSC should honour us the option of remapping, rather than making our lives difficult with all these 'our company policy indicates that this is normal' bullshit isn't it? Is a request of remapping so difficult? :dunno:

Re-mapping has always been offered by NSC (and CSC as well) as a fix for hot pixels, in case you did not notice from all the previous posts from others.
:dunno:

 

[PaulKami]

Re-mapping has always been offered by NSC (and CSC as well) as a fix for hot pixels, in case you did not notice from all the previous posts from others.
:dunno:

I wonder if you did read about the problems encounter during the request for remapping a few posts back? I personally experienced it while talking with a CSO through the phone...

 

[daredevil123]

I wonder if you did read about the problems encounter during the request for remapping a few posts back? I personally experienced it while talking with a CSO through the phone...

phone?

No, you have to bring it down to NSC. A technician will have to look at the problem and the technician will recommend a remap. And it will be done. That is what I have been telling everyone... do not panic, bring your camera down to NSC.

Why waste time with CSO call centers staffed with non-technical people?? They just have a sheet of standard questions and answers.

BTW, you just can't "request for remapping". You bring the problem to them to fix. They will tell you what needs to be done.

 

[PaulKami]

phone?

No, you have to bring it down. A technician will have to look at the problem and the technician will recommend a remap. And it will be done.

Why waste time with CSO call centers staffed with non-technical people?? They just have a sheet of standard questions and answers.

You mean the person answered my call to NSC service centre is not technical enough to answer my question? That'd be really interesting... talking about 'normal' photos... :bsmilie: I even go into the technical details such as ISO, shutter speed, aperture, and that lady was like ;( at my details :bsmilie:

 

[daredevil123]

You mean the person answered my call to NSC service centre is not technical enough to answer my question? That'd be really interesting... talking about 'normal' photos... :bsmilie: I even go into the technical details such as ISO, shutter speed, aperture, and that lady was like ;( at my details :bsmilie:

Dude... are you living in the 21st century?

Or you did not know that first line tech support are non-technical most of the time?