WHATS NEXT FOR M43, after Olympus, what future is left?

[ricohflex]

The Panasonic executive could be hinting that they will make a very small and light Full Frame camera.
Quietly and completely abandoning M43. To concentrate on Full Frame.
Just like how Leica dumped their APS-C models CL and TL2 to focus on Full Frame & Medium Format.

Sony made the small & light A7C and in future maybe the A7 C II.
Sony already proved that it can be done. Why not Panasonic?
Is Panasonic a lower class manufacturer? Cannot be, right?

If Sony can do it, then Panasonic can do too.

Why should Panasonic persist with M43 when the worldwide market share is so miserable small?
What is the point of insisting on going down that road that proved to lead to a dead end?

OMDS and Panasonic cannot be frogs in the well.
Both cannot be isolationist if they want to sell cameras to the world.
They have to be aware of what competitors are doing and what buyers want.

Sony, Nikon and Canon did not neglect CHEAP, SMALL, LIGHT, EASY TO USE.

Sony, Nikon and Canon have their Full Frame range of cameras.
Cleverly all 3 use their APS-C bodies to act as a bridge to bring new buyers into their Full Frame systems.
One mount concept. E mount, Z mount , RF mount.

Sony and Canon have not yet abandoned compact cameras.
Sony makes the RX100 range. The latest is model VII.
Canon has their G7 and G9 series compacts.

Competitors are eating OMDS's lunch when it persists with M43.
Panasonic needs to stealthily shift its emphasis to Full Frame and quietly ignore M43 to let it die within the company.
Just ramp it down slowly until it fades away (to save face).

Unless OMDS is actually not keen on doing business. That is, if they don't care.
Its purpose being a technical loophole.
To sidestep Japan labour laws when Olympus Camera Division was killed.

 

[ricohflex]

One more thing.
Remember what the Panasonic executive said.
Well, unfortunately for OMDS and Panasonic, Sony has just delivered a product for video creators that fulfills his statement.
Sony’s New Tiny AI-Powered Full Frame 4K Video Camera ZV-E1.
If in the whole world only OMDS and Panasonic manufactured cameras and lenses, then they will do well and succeed.
But in the real world, there are business competitors.

 

[Pitachu]

@ricohflex which part of his speech did he hint that Panasonic is going to abandon M43 and focus on Full Frame.
I copy and paste below for you to read again:

Yosuke Yamane has been interviewed by Dpreview. This is the part were he talks about MFT:

He emphasized that the size and portability of Micro Four Thirds lets it deliver things that full-frame systems can’t. ‘Micro Four Thirds is a compact and lightweight system that enables hand-held photography in combination with a telephoto lens, which is not possible with full-frame,’ he said. ‘And we believe it is an indispensable system for achieving a compact body that can be easily carried.’


@ricohflex Please stop misleading others with your conclusions. This is not the first time you interpret articles the opposite meaning.

 

[Pitachu]

@ricohflex you totally have no idea of what you are talking about.

Are you saying those photographers who is planning to get the OM-1 for Wildlife, Birding, Outdoor Landscapes, Macros etc
are now going to buy the Sony new ZV-E1 instead?

I am not a Videographer, but my friend told me Panasonic has some very nice lenses for the GH5 he is using for video
eg. 10-25 F1.7 (20-50mm F1.7) which is a superb zoom for indoor videos. Until FF manufacturers come up with similar lenses,
otherwise, videographers will still use both M43 and FF for various video shoots.

One more thing.
Remember what the Panasonic executive said.
Well, unfortunately for OMDS and Panasonic, Sony has just delivered a product for video creators that fulfills his statement.
Sony’s New Tiny AI-Powered Full Frame 4K Video Camera ZV-E1.
If in the whole world only OMDS and Panasonic manufactured cameras and lenses, then they will do well and succeed.
But in the real world, there are business competitors.

 

[ricohflex]

Best is to let world wide camera buyers decide - thread topic - that is, whether M43 has a future.
Monitor the world wide market statistics over many years.
Don't rely on 1 shop or a few shops data in a highly manipulated "survey" schemed to skew the statistics to portray a pre-determined outcome.

Such as brand X offering crazy cut price offers in a shop for a short period to boost fake "sales" figures.

Shops can print out this photo, laminate it and show to all the prospective customers and let them decide.
Bearing in mind once they get into the system they will pour more and more money into it over the long run.
Buying more bodies, lenses, flashes, etc.

Creating a Sunken Cost situation. That is very hard to get out of. Tell the customers to choose wisely.

Credit: apotelyt.com

 

[Pitachu]

@ricohflex If sensor size is all you care about, then you and everyone would have gotten the 3200 megapixel Vera C Rubin camera! LOL

https://www.digitalcameraworld.com/news/worlds-largest-digital-camera-sensor-is-equivalent-to-266-iphones

On a less extreme basis, why are all the photographers not moving to Medium Format DSLR eg. Fujifilm GFX 50 / 100 if sensor size is so important?

@ricohflex ANSWER THIS QUESTION and you will see how illogical you have been!

Best is to let world wide camera buyers decide - thread topic - that is, whether M43 has a future.
Monitor the world wide market statistics over many years.
Don't rely on 1 shop or a few shops data in a highly manipulated "survey" schemed to skew the statistics to portray a pre-determined outcome.

Such as brand X offering crazy cut price offers in a shop for a short period to boost fake "sales" figures.

Shops can print out this photo, laminate it and show to all the prospective customers and let them decide.
Bearing in mind once they get into the system they will pour more and more money into it over the long run.
Buying more bodies, lenses, flashes, etc.

Creating a Sunken Cost situation. That is very hard to get out of. Tell the customers to choose wisely.

Credit: apotelyt.com

 

[ricohflex]

He says. Full Frame is Most Versatile Format.
He is entitled to his opinion.
Especially view from 0:54 to 1:08 and hear what he says.

 

[Pitachu]

Full Frame is probably the Most Versatile Format, which explains it is the most popular format.

But Sulanto did stress that it may not be the best format and no format is the best. It depends on the situation in you are in and the type of photos and how much control you want to input and from there you select your camera gear. This is what his whole video is about.

@ricohflex I hope you are not just trying to lift only a part of a video or article to bang on a certain point but change the whole intention of the video or article.

He says. Full Frame is Most Versatile Format.
He is entitled to his opinion.
Especially view from 0:54 to 1:08 and hear what he says.

 

[Pitachu]

This is another lenses which taps on the strength of M43.
If you need 180mm Macro (4x magnification in 35mm equivalent) and 8x with teleconverter.
You will be hard pressed to find anything similar in Full Frame

 

[JW73]

Wildlife photographers do not just compare the body sizes. The lens size/weight/aperture and reach are considered too.
The 150-400mm F4.5 pro are getting more attention nowadays since the launched 2 years back.

 

[Pitachu]

M43 Lenses remain popular (even the report is for the Japanese Mkt) is still a strong indication that there is still a strong interest on M43 camera and lenses and the M43 format.

BCNreport: MFT lenses keep being the second most sold mount lenses on the market – 43 Rumors

www.43rumors.com

 

[ricohflex]

An answer to thread title - does M43 have a future.
Some one wrote an article in 2016 (click on link to read):
Is Micro Four Thirds Good Enough? A Realistic Evaluation after 2 Years.

After using it for a while longer, he wrote an article in 2021 (click on link to read):
The Reasons Why I Am No Longer Using Olympus MFT Gear

Of course. The world does not stand still. The competitors of M43 have progressed faster than it.
By 2023 Canon, Nikon, Sony and Fuji have better products that thrash M43.
The gap will get much wider by the time it gets to 2030. Actually by 2030, M43 may be on the rubbish heap of unwanted obsolete formats.

 

[Pitachu]

This article was last updated in Jan 2021 before OM-1 was introduced.
Obviously, he did not care much about the various advantages of Olympus EM-1 Mk2 ever the Z6
eg. 60fps vs 12fps
eg. focal multiplier 2x vs focal multiplier 1

From the article, Robert Reiser has a couple of Nikon Telephoto lenses. If I am him, I would also make the logical choice of staying with Nikon (common sense). Robert did not mention he has any Olympus telephoto lenses. He probably has not compared the weight of a 600mm F4 lenses equivalent with a M43 one.

Robert also did not mentioned what technology Nikon has came up with when he said the rest has progressed. He only mentioned ISO and resolution.
Actually for M43 users, with the Focal Multiplier, we have twice the reach (the Olympus 300mm is equivalent to 1200mm with a 2xTC) and we do most of the cropping by zooming in.

Anyway, I am not sure how @ricohflex come out with the conclusion whether M43 has a future based on the decision of a user with 2 nikon bodies and lots of Nikon telephoto lenses chosing to stay with Nikon.

@ricohflex, you are just browsing thru articles and twisting them to use it against M43 without deep diving into the article and understanding the various issues. You hardly answer any questions on your viewpoints on all your posts.

An answer to thread title - does M43 have a future.
Some one wrote an article in 2016 (click on link to read):
Is Micro Four Thirds Good Enough? A Realistic Evaluation after 2 Years.

After using it for a while longer, he wrote an article in 2021 (click on link to read):
The Reasons Why I Am No Longer Using Olympus MFT Gear

Of course. The world does not stand still. The competitors of M43 have progressed faster than it.
By 2023 Canon, Nikon, Sony and Fuji have better products that thrash M43.
The gap will get much wider by the time it gets to 2030. Actually by 2030, M43 may be on the rubbish heap of unwanted obsolete formats.

 

[Pitachu]

No I do not know any Panasonic executive who has said what.
You have already misquoted what Panasonic Yosuke Yamane said in your earlier post.

The Sony ZV-E1 is only 12mp and has no subject identification for birds etc.
It is mainly used for vlogging?
Why is that unfortunate for OMDS?
Have you been using your previous Olympus camera for Vlogging only? LOL


You are just posting nonsense here. Stop doing it. It make you look so silly

One more thing.
Remember what the Panasonic executive said.
Well, unfortunately for OMDS and Panasonic, Sony has just delivered a product for video creators that fulfills his statement.
Sony’s New Tiny AI-Powered Full Frame 4K Video Camera ZV-E1.
If in the whole world only OMDS and Panasonic manufactured cameras and lenses, then they will do well and succeed.
But in the real world, there are business competitors.

 

[one eye jack]

@ricohflex, this is not a criticism of you but a reminder of what we don't know. The person you linked is entitled to his thoughts and feelings , he can spend his money as he chooses and how he feels about his choices of equipment. Photography for most of us is a hobby but let us not delude ourselves as to where photography will lead us. It is a pastime , yes literally to pass time not to be professional and make a living out of it. People can say anything on the internet but is the information correct,who should you listen to?

You are also entitled to your opinion but you need to sort out what photography is and what it means to you. Harping on fullframe is not what photography is about. This professional gets to the important point for all of us, it is not about photography formats but what we have been told on the internet by people who are not real photographers. So it's for fun and hey if that's what you like, fine but don't fool yourself , enjoy and learn.

An answer to thread title - does M43 have a future.
Some one wrote an article in 2016 (click on link to read):
Is Micro Four Thirds Good Enough? A Realistic Evaluation after 2 Years.

After using it for a while longer, he wrote an article in 2021 (click on link to read):
The Reasons Why I Am No Longer Using Olympus MFT Gear

Of course. The world does not stand still. The competitors of M43 have progressed faster than it.
By 2023 Canon, Nikon, Sony and Fuji have better products that thrash M43.
The gap will get much wider by the time it gets to 2030. Actually by 2030, M43 may be on the rubbish heap of unwanted obsolete formats.

 

[one eye jack]

To expand further, you have this example, does he know what real photography is. Is he a working professional. Should we listen to his advice?

Or listen to a real photographer like him.

 

[one eye jack]

@ricohflex, Can you tell the difference between fullframe and M43 ? In the end how you spend your money is up to you. Each format has it's pros and cons. Each is neither better or worse. What do you want to get out of it?

Notice the clickbait title.. haha but what did he say about Sony A1 finally?

 

[ricohflex]

In 2008, the 2 original founding companies Olympus Camera Division & Panasonic camera division announced M43.
Olympus Camera Division was sold in 2020.
In 2023, the number of big camera manufacturers that make M43 cameras remains as 2. OMDS and Panasonic.

No other major big camera manufacturer adopted M43 from 2008 to 2023. They must have a long list of good reasons why they rejected M43.

If you look at Olympus Camera Division & Panasonic camera division.
Both are sub-companies belonging to a giant parent company that makes the bulk of its money from other sources.
Both can afford to lose MASSIVE amounts of money over many years - and be tolerated by a doting loving parent company.

In the case of Olympus Camera Division, it was sold in 2020 after many years of losing big amounts of money.

Now if you are an external observer, how do you read the situation?
The conclusion is that you will lose financially big time if you make and sell M43 cameras/lenses.

No other company wants to jump into this M43 sinking ship.

This answers the thread title question - does M43 have a future?

 

[Pitachu]

@ricohflex the reason why No other major big camera manufacturer want to adobt is because Olympus and Panasonic has already established themselves in M43 format and have made excellent M43 lenses. The main reason for Camera manufacturers to make bodies is to sell lenses as a user spent much more on lenses than camera bodies. Why would Nikon, Canon, Sony take this kind of risk to draw their users to M43 and after that lose their users to buying Olympus or Panasonic Lenses?

This is exactly why Fujifilm made the same decision to stay out of Full Frame and focus of APS format, where Nikon, Canon and even Sony don't put in efforts to produce good lenses. Look at what Nikon, Canon and Sony offered in their APS range of lenses compared to their FF lenses and you know what I mean.

Don't forget that Canon and Nikon did a bad job with their smaller format lenses......... the EOS M series and the Nikon V series has a very very short life span!

Olympus made the wise decision of staying out of the Red Ocean. Look at how Panasonic is struggling in the Full Frame market.

There is no superior or inferior format, it all depends on what the user want or prefer.

Which format a Manufacturer choose to focus on depends on where it sees it can crave a niche.
Fujifilm has done much better than Panasonic by choosing to avoid the FF market and focus on the APS and Medium Format market.

Olympus has done well to focus on the M43 market, even though it is a very small market, it probably sells more camera bodies and lenses than Panasonic S-Series full frame and lenses.

All these are their business decisions and they may have their own plans and agendas.

Our focus should be on whether a certain is going to serve us well, and not banging on Olympus made a wrong decision from 2008 to 2023,
because in the meantime, tons of photographers using Olympus cameras have already gotten much statisfaction from their photos while you are still lamenting away and missed the boat. Don't believe me, go and join a Facebook forum on OM Users, local or international and see them happily sharing their great photos.

In 2008, the 2 original founding companies Olympus Camera Division & Panasonic camera division announced M43.
Olympus Camera Division was sold in 2020.
In 2023, the number of big camera manufacturers that make M43 cameras remains as 2. OMDS and Panasonic.

No other major big camera manufacturer adopted M43 from 2008 to 2023. They must have a long list of good reasons why they rejected M43.

If you look at Olympus Camera Division & Panasonic camera division.
Both are sub-companies belonging to a giant parent company that makes the bulk of its money from other sources.
Both can afford to lose MASSIVE amounts of money over many years - and be tolerated by a doting loving parent company.

In the case of Olympus Camera Division, it was sold in 2020 after many years of losing big amounts of money.

Now if you are an external observer, how do you read the situation?
The conclusion is that you will lose financially big time if you make and sell M43 cameras/lenses.

No other company wants to jump into this M43 sinking ship.

This answers the thread title question - does M43 have a future?

 

[ricohflex]

Camera sales worldwide recently is very depressed.
It will not improve with US and Switzerland banks collapse in 2023. And talks of global recession.
The video uploader says latest very capable mobile phones has eaten into camera market.

It does not look good for M43 at all. M43 being considered the sub-standard low grade option among digital mirrorless ILC.
This kind of market situation means business DEATH for low performing brands/sensor formats.