Malaysia Airlines plane missing...

[donut88]

http://www.thestar.com.my/News/Nation/2014/04/05/MH370-search-batteries-ok-no-replacement-need/ http://edition.cnn.com/2014/04/04/us/flight-370-pinger-batteries/

[/QUOTE] Aircraft maintenance programmes are designed to keep the equipment working to specifications.

If the expiry is June 2014, it means that the, pinger in this case, will work for the stated requirement of 30 days. It cannot be shorter than 30 days as that would be non-compliant with the requirement.

The manufacturer provides the life guideline on basis of test results which MUST meet the stated requirements, which stipulates the minimum criteria. Yes, if you have fresh batteries, it will work for longer than that but there are no marks or credit for 'being better'.

Newspapers are not the proper authority on this subject and should never be used as the basis.[/QUOTE]

Not so simple.

They say the batt should work for 30 days. That is based on lab controlled environment.

They also say that actual batt power depends largely on water.temperature, water depth and impact and circumstances of the crash.

Nothing runs according to paper specs.

Like a car that states fuel consumption that is xx km/litre. No car will actually consumes exactly, according to paper specs. Paper specs are tested in a controlled lab environment

 

[s1221ljc]

This statement makes more sense....

Not so simple.

They say the batt should work for 30 days. That is based on lab controlled environment.

They also say that actual batt power depends largely on water.temperature, water depth and impact and circumstances of the crash.

Nothing runs according to paper specs.

Like a car that states fuel consumption that is xx km/litre. No car will actually consumes exactly, according to paper specs. Paper specs are tested in a controlled lab environment

And stated requirement of XX days depends on whether required maintenance has been effectively carried out.

 

[9V-Orion Images]

If the expiry is June 2014, it means that the, pinger in this case, will work for the stated requirement of 30 days. It cannot be shorter than 30 days as that would be non-compliant with the requirement.

You are correct, while I currently do not have access to the servicing manual and specification data for the particular model of Underwater Locator Beacon (ULB) used in the Boeing 777-2H6/ER (9M-MRO "Romeo Oscar") operating as Malaysia Airlines (MAS) Flight 370 (MH 370) callsign "MALAYSIAN 370" until I reached my office tomorrow but AFAIK / IIRC (more or less rather vividly) the certification requirements calls for a minimum lithium battery lifespan of 30 days while submerged at a depth of 20,000 feet to 30,000 feet with temperature as low as - 05 °C to 05 °C before the acoustic dB output of the 37.5 kHz ultrasonic pulses starts fading below functional detection range.

Under "idea controlled lab environment", I have personally witness ULBs almost at the end of their usable service lifespan being activated and powered on past 90 days.

 

[s1221ljc]

You can tell what is the specified requirements, but can you tell, confirm that the pinger/batteries THAT WAS IN MH370 has been serviced, according to scheduled & properly, esp where Malaysian Airline is concerned? If not, isn't the statement of possibilities (not of absolute known fact) with regards to the 20-25%, the same as that of the manufacturer? :bsmilie:

You are correct, while I currently do not have access to the servicing manual and specification data for the particular model of Underwater Locator Beacon (ULB) used in the Boeing 777-2H6/ER (9M-MRO "Romeo Oscar") operating as Malaysia Airlines (MAS) Flight 370 (MH 370) callsign "MALAYSIAN 370" until I reached my office tomorrow but AFAIK / IIRC (more or less rather vividly) the certification requirements calls for a minimum lithium battery lifespan of 30 days while submerged at a depth of 20,000 feet to 30,000 feet with temperature as low as - 05 °C to 05 °C before the acoustic dB output of the 37.5 kHz ultrasonic pulses starts fading below functional detection range.

Under "idea controlled lab environment", I have personally witness ULBs almost at the end of their usable service lifespan being activated and powered on past 90 days.

 

[Octarine]

You can tell what is the specified requirements, but can you tell, confirm that the pinger/batteries THAT WAS IN MH370 has been serviced, according to scheduled & properly, esp where Malaysian Airline is concerned?

Malaysia Airlines has a good track record of the past. This is only possible if maintenance is carried out as defined in the various schedules. If there were serious doubts about that, Malaysia Airlines would have been already subjected to specific attention or worse: a ban for certain countries and regions. Garuda Indonesia was blacklisted in European for several years due to serious and systematic lapses in maintenance and safety.
What gives you reason to assume or suggest that MAS do not perform maintenance according schedule? Do you extrapolate from the status of cars on the roads (or other examples) to the maintenance status of the aircrafts?

 

[9V-Orion Images]

You can tell what is the specified requirements, but can you tell, confirm that the pinger/batteries THAT WAS IN MH370 has been serviced, according to scheduled & properly, esp where Malaysian Airline is concerned? If not, isn't the statement of possibilities (not of absolute known fact) with regards to the 20-25%, the same as that of the manufacturer? :bsmilie:

AFAIK / IIRC, I do not think Radiant Power Corporation is responsible anymore for the routine servicing of the Dukane (DK) Seacom range of Underwater Acoustic Beacons (UABs) that are in used by Malaysian Airline System (MAS), could easily be done in-house by MAS Aerospace Engineering (MAE) Sdn. Bhd.

Anyway, MAS has a rather satisfactory public safety record so far. Wait till you hear of the "terrific" servicing standards in some of the Skytrax Top 10 airlines. :bsmilie:

 

[qystan]

You can tell what is the specified requirements, but can you tell, confirm that the pinger/batteries THAT WAS IN MH370 has been serviced, according to scheduled & properly, esp where Malaysian Airline is concerned? If not, isn't the statement of possibilities (not of absolute known fact) with regards to the 20-25%, the same as that of the manufacturer? :bsmilie:

No one can, however, air travel is a highly regulated industry with checks and balances to ensure proper maintenance for the sole purpose of ensuring safety for the passengers.

The maintenance programme has to be approved by the authorities and regular reviews of the work performed with reporting and declaration made to the authorities.

As Orion mentioned, MAS does has a good maintenance track record. There are bigger monies elsewhere that any airline can save on than scrimping on a few thousand dollar battery repair job. When an accident like this happens, everyone loses.

Btw, I am not a MAS employee.

 

[s1221ljc]

Upfront, just say I take whatever the Malaysian authorities say with a heavy healthy dose of salt. Especially in a crisis where weaknesses & failures can be exposed & where the reputation & viability of assets are at stake

I read the CNN report end to end, I read, in between the lines, in context, explicit or implied, insinuation or suggestion, etc. I think the pinger manufacturer has been very careful, measured & precise in its choice & use of words, clearly stating the facts & the possible deterioration of the battery life. On the other hand, in the face of these assertions & their implications, MAS response has been indirect, vague & uncertain. So people like me are not so convinced & have no confidence in what they say?

And good track record in past (or reputation) does not mean there are no lapses or oversights. Just that nobody knows till problems surfaced like in this crisis. Hey, a whole aircraft belonging to them just disappeared which they cant find it, don''t know where it is & dont know why And a aircraft wheels just burst on takeoff in a separate recent incident? "Wait till you hear of the "terrific" servicing standards in some of the Skytrax Top 10 airlines" only prove this point.

Anyway, this battery life is not really a big issue in the saga. I merely pointed out the references when Qystan asks for the "basis" of what Saberlancer mentioned.

 

[donut88]

No one can, however, air travel is a highly regulated industry with checks and balances to ensure proper maintenance for the sole purpose of ensuring safety for the passengers.

The maintenance programme has to be approved by the authorities and regular reviews of the work performed with reporting and declaration made to the authorities.

As Orion mentioned, MAS does has a good maintenance track record. There are bigger monies elsewhere that any airline can save on than scrimping on a few thousand dollar battery repair job. When an accident like this happens, everyone loses.

Btw, I am not a MAS employee.

Er..... if u know the mentality of MY ppl, u will be aware of their "tida apa" working attitude.....

 

[ninelives]

Er..... if u know the mentality of MY ppl, u will be aware of their "tida apa" working attitude.....

sg also mah " wa mu zhai lah, wa mu zhai lah"

 

[qystan]

Er..... if u know the mentality of MY ppl, u will be aware of their "tida apa" working attitude.....

Sweeping statements like this is uncalled for. Many of our best people here are MY and we do have a good measure of own tidak apa's

 

[ricohflex]

It is good that MLY has grown Air Asia waiting in the wings. In case MLY has to close down MAS.
They may do so in order to create a new national airline with a clean slate.

In the documentary on the biography of the Air Asia founder Tony Fernandez, he revealed that in the early stages MAS tried to unfairly destroy Air Asia.
By predatory pricing.

Now that MAS is in dire straits, guess Air Asia can say this is heaven's punishment 报应 for their evil act.

 

[d2xpeter]

The bomoh holding 2 coconuts - if they had split open the coconuts, they may see GPS coordinates of MH370. Latitude coord in 1st coconut; Longitude coord in 2nd coconut.

Lat3N Long70E

 

[Lawrence Quek]

even the suspicious debris found is not linked. everything back to sq one.

 

[ricohflex]

American radar experts have been asking for it.
Inmarsat stubbornly refuses to share the data - maybe they are afraid to have errors pointed out by more competent scientists.
Tens (or hundreds?) of millions of dollars have been wasted looking for something in south Indian Ocean.
What if the Inmarsat calculations were wrong - and the plane is somewhere else very far away in a different compass direction.

 

[Lawrence Quek]

American radar experts have been asking for it.
Inmarsat stubbornly refuses to share the data - maybe they are afraid to have errors pointed out by more competent scientists.
Tens (or hundreds?) of millions of dollars have been wasted looking for something in south Indian Ocean.
What if the Inmarsat calculations were wrong - and the plane is somewhere else very far away in a different compass direction.

countries with the images/data are worries it would compromise security to their country

 

[liteon]

Malaysia to release MH370 report next week: CNN

I hope the Report will say ....MH370 has not ended....

 

[Dfive]

Spoke to a Captain the other day.... asked him what he thinks.... answer " I think it's parked somewhere ".

 

[Octarine]

American radar experts have been asking for it.
Inmarsat stubbornly refuses to share the data - maybe they are afraid to have errors pointed out by more competent scientists.

Any sources for this?

 

[ricohflex]

Read only if you can be bothered to.

http://celebzter.com/what-if-they-a...n-on-where-missing-plane-flight-mh370-may-be/

http://www.duncansteel.com/archives/507

http://www.theantdaily.com/Outspoken/MH370-Is-it-really-a-mystery-or-a-hide-and-seek-conspiracy

For reasons best known to Inmarsat, Inmarsat has steadfastly refused to release the raw data for the ping timings or the arcs for the first five pings.

http://jeffwise.net/2014/03/27/why-did-australia-change-the-search-area/comment-page-5/

http://willyloman.wordpress.com/201...indian-ocean-china-demands-raw-inmarsat-data/

“Groundbreaking maths” of “inexact science” Prove Flight 370 Crashed in Indian Ocean? China Demands Raw Inmarsat Data

http://marvinsthinking.blogspot.sg/2014/04/why-has-inmarsat-refused-to-release.html

Why has Inmarsat refused to release the data showing that MH370 flew on a circular arc about the satellite???

http://jeffwise.net/2014/04/18/slate-why-inmarsats-mh370-report-is-a-smokescreen/comment-page-2/



http://marvinsthinking.blogspot.sg/2014/04/scientific-method-for-determining.html

The methods used by Inmarsat for interpreting the data have not been released, nor has the actual data on time delays and Doppler shifts. These are required for independent evaluation of their conclusions.

Details of the method and application to the flight path of MH370 are given in an earlier posting on marvinsthinking.blogspot.com. This information has been given to Mr. Patrick Lally in the Boston office of Senator Edward Markey of Massachusetts and has been forwarded by him to the FAA and the NTSB. To date there has been no official response. Mr. Ron Suskind of the Harvard Ethics Center has recently been contacted by Dr. Vestal with the suggestion that these events should be examined for evidence of scientific fraud.