WHATS NEXT FOR M43, after Olympus, what future is left?

[Pitachu]

@ricohflex you need to specify how long ago is "a very long time ago"
and what exactly is prohibitively expensive?

I have been using Canon for a long time so let's take discuss about Canon (probably applies to Nikon too)

Are you referring to when DSLR is first introduced? Canon EOS 1Ds released in 2002 (I think about S$12,000)
But the Canon 1Ds is their top of the line.
Few years later, Canon released the 5D series and price drop by more than half and suddenly lots of photographers can afford FF.
So I don't think the statement that FF "is prohibitively expensive to consumers" is applicable.

And then I recall some of my kakis jumped onto the Canon 7D (APS) not because of price, but because it has a lighter body and lenses.

And some even went a bit further to M43, to save weight and get a higher focal multiplier.

I migrated to M43 several years later and enjoyed the weight savings especially when I am on trip and need 4 to 5 lenses.

But to say that M43 has a pitifully small sensor, you are just telling everyone you are totally ignorant of the benefits of M43
even though you mentioned that you owned one before.

Have you ever thought...... why our mobile phones with a much smaller sensor has became the most popular format in the world?
Because the pitifully pitifully pitifully small sensor of mobile phones meed the needs of the photographers using them!!!!!

So same for M43. Seriously, 20MP meet my needs. Very seldom I print larger than A3. And if I need, I can easily increase the resolution to 80mp with my current OM-1 or with my previous EM5-m3, I can increase to 50mp)

There is a large percentage of photographers who can live by mobile phone sensors and M43 sensors and shooting photos bring joy with these cameras bring much joy to them that they continue using it. Rather than continuously ranting to a small group of M43 users here that their sensors are pitifully small,
@ricohflex why don't you walk on the street and tell that to everyone using a mobile phone that their camera sensor are very pitifully small LOL LOL LOL

Question to ask ourselves: Do I really need a larger format like Full Frame or Medium Format?
Otherwise, I usually settle for a smaller setup for more convenience.

Go straight to 6:34 and view till 7:26. Enjoy.

A very long time ago, consumers fret over these concepts.
Because full frame sensor cameras were prohibitively expensive for the average consumer.
As time passes technology improves, bigger sensors costs drop.

Now in 2023, full frame sensor cameras cost are within reach of consumers.
The average consumer does not need to buy a pitifully small sensor M43 camera anymore, for cost reasons.

That being the case, all the yada yada over "equivalence" is irrelevant.
Not longer necessary because most consumers own the full frame sensor cameras.

 

[one eye jack]

Here is a more objective discussion of camera formats.

Shooting wildlife in western countries is not the same in rain forest or jungle. He was actually here in sg for a biology competition and he got a day off exploring sg wildlife. As you can see the wildlife is what we see everyday but at least he show that it is not easy. A 500mm lens is not long enough.

 

[JW73]

Tiny sensor can do blurry background. When i had FF 600mmf4 , i still need to watch out the subject and background(bg) relative distance. Having a $16k 600mm doesn’t mean auto blur bg. Same when i am using the tiny sensor m43 system and I find it easier to create blur bg because I am able to move or change angle or go low ”faster” as the m43 system is light and portable instead of being anchored by a tripod.

People had been debating the background blur for decades.. M43 can do blur bg if u know what u are doing. Even a 1inch bridge camera can do blur bg if you know what you are doing.

 

[kcheong]

View attachment 113182View attachment 113183View attachment 113184
Tiny sensor can do blurry background. When i had FF 600mmf4 , i still need to watch out the subject and background(bg) relative distance. Having a $16k 600mm doesn’t mean auto blur bg. Same when i am using the tiny sensor m43 system and I find it easier to create blur bg because I am able to move or change angle or go low ”faster” as the m43 system is light and portable instead of being anchored by a tripod.

People had been debating the background blur for decades.. M43 can do blur bg if u know what u are doing. Even a 1inch bridge camera can do blur bg if you know what you are doing.

May I know what body and lens combination you used for these shots?

 

[JW73]

May I know what body and lens combination you used for these shots?

OM-1+300mmf4+mc14. I personally don't talk / urge about equivalent focal length because the M43 lenses like the Fuji System has actually no cropped effect as their lenses are made for the sensor size of their system. Shoot what my eyes see based on the equipment I have.

FF system will still be a more popular system regardless of many debates etc.

The day M43 die (IF), I believe it is not because it is not a capable system but a misunderstood system.

 

[one eye jack]

@JW73, you put it nicely that m43 is a misunderstood system. Your understanding of depth of field theory plus experience and skill debunks the myth that small sensor cannot do blurry background however it requires you to get close and positioning camera distance to subject and subject distance from background. Nitpickers will say oh I need to crop and noise comes into the photo.

For beginners can a short telephoto lens shoot birds? Let the pros explain.

 

[one eye jack]

The low down on the new Panasonic Lumix G9 MK2. The frame rates are fantastic but no camera is perfect.

 

[ricohflex]

They say in their videos.
Monitor what happens. The World Wide camera market share pie chart still does not reflect OMDS. Because the data is too small.
For Panasonic it is 4.2% which would include L mount full frame cameras.

 

[one eye jack]

These videos are clickbaits but that's normal. The last two are making conclusions with their imaginations. Smartphones has replaced point & shoot cameras and enthusiast photographers and companies have fallen on bad economic times as if no one notices. Now hear the reason for the crisis.

 

[one eye jack]

We take a look at the state of advancement in smartphone computational technology versus a real camera with respect to fake bokeh. For ordinary people the results are good for non photographers using it in social media. Hope Ricohflex stop harping about sales of m43. This is the reality, all camera formats take a hit.

It is not about the gear @ 32 min.

 

[one eye jack]

Robin Wong acknowledges that OMDS is in bad shape market share wise. He suggest omds take a bite of the fullframe pie.
Livestream now!

Should Olympus/OM System Go Full Frame? Let's Talk!

Full frame is all the rage, in this world where bigger is better. Micro Four Thirds was the first mirrorless system, and now every camera player out there ha...

www.youtube.com

 

[one eye jack]

Is DJI osmo pocket3 the new disrupter for the camera industry? Thread views already hit 69k.

 

[one eye jack]

Overheating issues?

 

[Pitachu]

For OMDS to succeed in Full Frame, it probably have to make the Full Frame body able to take M43 lenses in Crop mode, like what other manufacturers are doing eg. Sony bodies can take E-mount (APS-C) and FE (Full Frame lenses). Just my 2 cents worth.

Robin Wong acknowledges that OMDS is in bad shape market share wise. He suggest omds take a bite of the fullframe pie.
Livestream now!

Should Olympus/OM System Go Full Frame? Let's Talk!

Full frame is all the rage, in this world where bigger is better. Micro Four Thirds was the first mirrorless system, and now every camera player out there ha...

www.youtube.com

View attachment 113527

 

[Pitachu]

No overheating lah.... I pray.....'cause I just ordered one.

Tried using my DSLR and Mobile phone with Gimbal for my travel video shots. Mobile Phone with Gimbal works but is a bit clunky and takes time to set up if your phone is not left on the Gimbal (which then I will not be able to use my phone properly) so I decided to get the Pocket 3 to try

I will use my OM-1 for videos when the subject is far away.

Overheating issues?

 

[Pitachu]

The Osmo Pocket 3 is going to hit sony very hard. I read more than 40% of Sony camera sales are from its ZV series for vlogging.

I noticed that whenever I add a video together with my photos in my social media posts, the response is much much better, so I guess all the content creators out there are aware of this too.

Is DJI osmo pocket3 the new disrupter for the camera industry? Thread views already hit 69k.

 

[Pitachu]

Probably OMDS while changing name has dropped out of the surveyors radar
or maybe that survey is for Full Frame and APS cameras or only those popular brands.
Lots of Camera shops do not sell Ricoh, Pentax and Leica too and they are not inside the surveys too.

Here is one survery I found which include OMDS.

BCN award 2023 winners announced: OM Digital increased their mirrorless market share – 43 Rumors

www.43rumors.com

Anyway, I don't make my purchase based on how popular it is. I based on whether it suits my needs.
Just like I choose to get the Osmo Pocket 3 for my travel videos instead of the Sony A7Siii which I have no doubt it produce much better quality,
but my No. 1 criteria is portability and not Video Image quality and any others.

Just a side note...... when I was having my EM5 mk3 and going to upgrade, I did spent a few days at Sony showrooms trying out various lenses as my son uses Sony and it will be nice if we have compatible system. In the end, Sony do not have the lenses with the range, weight and size I want and I decided to go for the OM-1 instead.

They say in their videos.
Monitor what happens. The World Wide camera market share pie chart still does not reflect OMDS. Because the data is too small.
For Panasonic it is 4.2% which would include L mount full frame cameras.

 

[one eye jack]

@Pitachu, it may well be OMDS is still hanging on in Japan. Unless they come up with innovative products like DJI and Shenzhen arashi vision, the company that makes the insta360 line of action cameras OMDS may lose their grip on the international markets.

 

[one eye jack]

Insta360 go3

Insta360 X3

 

[Limberg]

Abit of my story.

I started with Canon SLR, then Panny mirrorless. Lighter, smaller, cheaper, smaller accessories, smaller bag.

During a holiday trip, I smashed the camera on a concrete floor, by accident. The cam strap entangled with something, I pulled with force. When it untangled, it slipped my palm and smashed to the floor. Heartache. Yes, very hard hit, but the frame and lens had no visible crack. The cam refuse to boot and kept resetting. It was at night. I didn't have a spare cam. Doomed. The next morning, I checked the cam, everything back to normal. I went on to use it for another 3 years. No problem at all. My highest respect for Panasonic.

Then I switched to Oly EM5 Mk 2, due to the lens are compatible. But I still bought 2.8 pro lens. Served my well for 5 years b4 mold grew inside the lens and cam. Sent both for cleaning by Oly service centre, not cheap, but I convinced myself, they're still good and still have net book value. Result was good. But they didn't advise and I forgot to ask for the internal battery to be replaced. So, the date need to be set every time I change the battery. Learnt my lesson, I bought a dry cabinet. As memory card and SSD prices dropped, I changed the photo taking resolution to the highest and raw file. Hardly play with the raw files, one, no time, two, seldom got complaint with the jpg version.

Niece, arrowed to be a photographer, first-timer, borrowed my cam once for her uni beauty pageant contest. She returned my cam in good condition and complimented her photos were better than her peers.

Now 8 years on, my Oly cam is still good. However, the video is still HD, bad when viewing on monitor or TV set. Now, I'm in the market looking for upgrade. To my horror discovery, left only Alan Photo carrying the brand. The world has moved on to Sony and move back to Canon.

I still prefer mirrorless because my audience don't look at my photos larger than their hp screen, not more than 1 sec. Very sad norm, nowadays. I also don't develop hardcopy or do business. Only me, an uncle who would look at them on a 27" 4K monitor for the longest time. So, APSC, FF are meaningless.

With my budget, I would have chosen OM5, around $1.6k (body). OM1 is a dream but too expensive, "ideally" around 2.7k (body only). Reading about the uncertain future of mirrorless especially the development of Oly's small service ctr, poor sales worldwide, I bravely looked at other brands. A cheap body (e.g. Sony 6700) plus a good lens (e.g. Sony G Master), $5k, before a external flash light, remote control, spare battery, polariser. That's a huge investment, since I no longer take family photos or in SG, but just for travelling, which offers better and faster control, less distortion than a handphone, e.g. people on both side look wider, buildings are stretched when cam angle tilted.

Suddenly, Oly OM1 doesn't looks expensive any more. However, price at Alan is 3k+. SG onlines prices are more competitive, 2.7k, but I don't know the sellers. My upcoming trip is to Japan. A check in Japan big names like Bic Camera and Yodobashi, their online prices are cheaper. Rakuten is even cheaper, but it is pure online. Bundle with pro II lens (my current is pro I), is like getting the lens at 50-60% discount tha buying the lens along. So, it makes economic sense to get one at the beginning of my my trip, bcos S$9=JPY1,000 and tax-free. However, there are plenty of drawbacks. I don't have time to learn prior to the trip. The warranty after I left the country is as good as gone.

Looking at my situation, either I take a painful switch now, with some times to climb the learning curve of using a new camera and brand, or grab the upfront convenience and advantage to stay put with Oly and buy in Japan but prolong my dependency at the mercy of the uncertain Japan Industrial Partners (JIP)'s strategy for OM Digital Solutions (OMDS). (I dreamed of getting a zoom lens. With new and old Oly cams, this could be realised, I hate switching lens.) It is assumed my current lens can last a few more years, if staying put. Getting a new Oly pro lens in Japan is like 75% discount from says Sony G Master, but granted, Sony G Master lens has innovation like aperture (speed?) setting ring.

May I seek member's advice since I'm perfectly at this cross road now.