Official Sony A7 or A7r discussion thread (Season II)

[tplongsg]

HCB must be turning in his grave and thinking...damm if they put stabilisation on my Leica back then, all my shots will be tact sharp and I might not be "that" famous after all...mon dieu!

That said, Sony is a corporation with an aim to maximise their competitive advantage and make sh*t load of cash whenever they can. Gone are those days where the Big 2 dominates the market. Sony with their prowess in sensor technology (being the largest camera sensor supplier in the world) have enable them to leap to the forefront of the mirrorless breakthrough, and I'm all thankful for that due to my old shoulder and also to stop Leica's insatiable attempt to break my bank with their ridiculous price tag for their bodies. I believe that while they do have access to Olympus 5-axis technology, but due to the physical limitation to suspend a FF sensor in a small body, I believe it is very different from doing the same to a M4/3 sensor with everything being equal. At the end of the day, we can all make guesses but I don't think going 5-axis on the A9 will be possible or reluctant for Sony to undertake. I firmly believed that the bodies for A7/R are heavily subsidised for a reason, that it is to allow Sony to have kinda proprietary control on their lenses. Going with an in-body stabilisation will allow the competitor to home in on this lucrative part of their business. I believe if Canon/Nikon were to build similar bodies, they will go the very same direction. It will be the battle of VHS/Betamax all over again, and the more control Sony can have within their eco system, the better it will benefit Sony as a brand and a company. Well that's just my personal opinion, which is as valid as the next guy's. :sweat:

just my thoughts:

Sony is not new to epic battles. Sony lost VHS vs Betamax battle and went on to build a media giant - Sony Pictures, Sony Music and Sony Playstation because the studios supported VHS despite the fact that Betamax was a better format. Fast forward it latter day, Blu-Ray vs HD DVD. It was easy for Sony to eliminate Microsoft format.

Sony forayed into mirrorless camera to salvage it's PNS business. Nothing fancy, just great IQ and small form factor. Today, it has evolved into something else. I look at it (A7/A7r) as simply a modern day trojan horse, same formula (great IQ, small form factor) with greater adaptability. I see Sony replacing the body first, lens later.

 

[Halfmoon]

just my thoughts:

Sony is not new to epic battles. Sony lost VHS vs Betamax battle and went on to build a media giant - Sony Pictures, Sony Music and Sony Playstation because the studios supported VHS despite the fact that Betamax was a better format. Fast forward it latter day, Blu-Ray vs HD DVD. It was easy for Sony to eliminate Microsoft format.

Sony forayed into mirrorless camera to salvage it's PNS business. Nothing fancy, just great IQ and small form factor. Today, it has evolved into something else. I look at it (A7/A7r) as simply a modern day trojan horse, same formula (great IQ, small form factor) with greater adaptability. I see Sony replacing the body first, lens later.

I am not familiar with Sony product life cycle...

Do they replace their Alpha DSLR and Nex at a very fast rate???? Their product life cycle life span seems much shorter vs a 5D or 6D.... :think:

 

[keithwee]

HCB doesn't even care on d first place. LOL. We, the current generation of photogs r conditioned to keep chasing d perfect gears rather than getting d perfect moment captured.

Carpe Diem.

+1 The key is to maximize the abilities of the cameras we've, learn to work around the limitations not simply B n S for the next 'best' model. This is the perfect reason why the statement : 'the best camera is the one that's with you at that moment' exists.

 

[Halfmoon]

+1 The key is to maximize the abilities of the cameras we've, learn to work around the limitations not simply B n S for the next 'best' model. This is the perfect reason why the statement : 'the best camera is the one that's with you at that moment' exists.

I think a lot of photographer here do not care to learn about their gears weakness and strength.... like... some lens are flare prone, some are sharp from F4 onwards... and work on these.... I do learn about my lens and camera weakness, and learn how to avoid them... and shooting with what you have is the best...

The easiest option is just to go out and buy the BEST.... next model...

 

[tsammyc]

nope, that shot was not leaning against anything or bracing against any support. This below is a 200mm F2.8 shot at 1/60s also shot last night, which i really was seated and braced against a chair. but shows what proper technique can achieve. If talking about shooting candids during random walkabout, you need faster shutterspeed to freeze the motion of the subject or to freeze action on account of user movement due to walking. If you are not keeping still, it is not the camera having shutter shock causing image shake. it is the user not keeping still.

I don't shoot plastic models much, although newspapers at distance sometimes So, if you are walking outside and shooting street shots of people (seated for example), buildings etc and assuming that you stop to shoot i.e., not moving, what shutter speed do you set your camera at with the 55FE?

I've been shooting with film SLRs since decades ago and have developed good technique for those, but the A7r is still an issue for me.

 

[ricleo]

I don't shoot plastic models much, although newspapers at distance sometimes So, if you are walking outside and shooting street shots of people (seated for example), buildings etc and assuming that you stop to shoot i.e., not moving, what shutter speed do you set your camera at with the 55FE?

I've been shooting with film SLRs since decades ago and have developed good technique for those, but the A7r is still an issue for me.

Actually with film one couldn't see the effects of handshake as obviously as the pixel peeping and test charts generation nowadays unless printing big.

I typically set my camera at aperture priority and auto ISO. So my camera naturally defaults to 1/60s when using the 55 1.8. Lazy photog I am kekeke

Can check out the images from this page. All the 55 fe indoor shots were at 1/50 a 1/60s.

http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1338082&page=104

FE 55 1.8

FE 55 1.8

FE55 1.8

FE 55 1.8

FE 55 1.8

 

[Thoth]

Actually with film one couldn't see the effects of handshake as obviously as the pixel peeping and test charts generation nowadays unless printing big. I typically set my camera at aperture priority and auto ISO. So my camera naturally defaults to 1/60s when using the 55 1.8. Lazy photog I am kekeke Can check out the images from this page. All the 55 fe indoor shots were at 1/50 a 1/60s.

Yupz. U took these shots wif me. I still rem u were using A mode. Haha. Good steady hands bro.

 

[silgt]

Just realised with my FE24-70/4 OSS, whenever I tilt the lens foward/backward, the rear elements moves (extend/recess). That must be the OSS at work so that means every OSS lenses need to be longer than their non-OSS counterpart, right?. Anyone knows how many elements actually moves for the OSS to work?

 

[ricleo]

Just realised with my FE24-70/4 OSS, whenever I tilt the lens foward/backward, the rear elements moves (extend/recess). That must be the OSS at work so that means every OSS lenses need to be longer than their non-OSS counterpart, right?. Anyone knows how many elements actually moves for the OSS to work?

typically only one lens element or group only moves in lens based IS. example below from a canon lens

the floating element within an IS unit

 

[tsammyc]

Actually with film one couldn't see the effects of handshake as obviously as the pixel peeping and test charts generation nowadays unless printing big.

I typically set my camera at aperture priority and auto ISO. So my camera naturally defaults to 1/60s when using the 55 1.8. Lazy photog I am kekeke

Can check out the images from this page. All the 55 fe indoor shots were at 1/50 a 1/60s.

35mm film is about 6MP, so even printing big, you didn't need to hold as steady. Downsampling and sharpening a 36MP picture also hides blur. Take this shot which looks sharp. The 100% image below is actually blur.

 

[ricleo]

in this case where your subject is moving, there could be a few reasons for the image blur.

1) handshake - can be avoided with OSS/IBIS
2) subject movement - can't be avoided with OSS/IBS
3) AF not accurate - were you on single AF or tracking AF? if single AF on a moving object, the area in focus would have changed since the subject has shifted location. can't be helped with OSS/IBIS

from your 100% crop above, could be a combination of the above factors. it almost seems like the hair on the top of her scalp is sharper than the eyes which are not sharp.

anyway what i am trying to say is IBIS can only help you in scenario 1 above. the other 2 scenarios no amount of IBIS/OIS will help. If your explanation about not having to be so steady because film is approximately 6MP while now the a7r is 36MP you need to be more steady in your technique, absolutely.

35mm film is about 6MP, so even printing big, you didn't need to hold as steady. Downsampling and sharpening a 36MP picture also hides blur. Take this shot which looks sharp. The 100% image below is actually blur.

 

[tplongsg]

I am not familiar with Sony product life cycle...

Do they replace their Alpha DSLR and Nex at a very fast rate???? Their product life cycle life span seems much shorter vs a 5D or 6D.... :think:

Haha. It's too fast and furious the way the obsolete cameras. Churning out new features and sensors.

 

[tplongsg]

I am not familiar with Sony product life cycle...

Do they replace their Alpha DSLR and Nex at a very fast rate???? Their product life cycle life span seems much shorter vs a 5D or 6D.... :think:

Haha. It's too fast and furious the way the obsolete cameras. Churning out new cameras with new features and sensors every year

 

[spinworkxroy]

Bottom line..Sony NEEDS to upgrade their firmware to allow minimum shutter speed in auto ISO mode like in Canon cameras. That wasy you cn still use A mode and auto ISO and set your minimum shutter speed...Sony's choosing to use 1/60 baffles me...my hands are never that steady

 

[Halfmoon]

Haha. It's too fast and furious the way the obsolete cameras. Churning out new cameras with new features and sensors every year

Actually. .... not sure if this is good.

If you hv the camera and years later when you need servicing, will there be parts?

 

[ricleo]

Haha. It's too fast and furious the way the obsolete cameras. Churning out new cameras with new features and sensors every year

not too bad la...its the low end ones that keep getting replacements. look at the A77 and A99, nex 6 7 nex7. no replacements for so long.

canon and nikon are as guilty of outing cameras at the lower end fast and furious kekeke

 

[ricleo]

Bottom line..Sony NEEDS to upgrade their firmware to allow minimum shutter speed in auto ISO mode like in Canon cameras. That wasy you cn still use A mode and auto ISO and set your minimum shutter speed...Sony's choosing to use 1/60 baffles me...my hands are never that steady

true, that wld be a good firmware update to allow minimum shutter to be set by the user. i want a way to reduce the sensitivity of the eye sensor hehe....or to set a custom key for the rear lcd screen to be really "off" instead of what it does now.

 

[tplongsg]

Actually. .... not sure if this is good.

If you hv the camera and years later when you need servicing, will there be parts?

I'm on to my fourth sony system camera. Probably too ignorant to care ;-) My cameras are still functioning well after all these years. Probably won't hit lifetime of shutter.

 

[Halfmoon]

I'm on to my fourth sony system camera. Probably too ignorant to care ;-) My cameras are still functioning well after all these years. Probably won't hit lifetime of shutter.

I saw the video of them tearing down the A7 and it in fact uses more same screws size than C or N....

If this is the lower end model, refreshing frequently is normal...

I was refering to the higher end, like... A7/R, A99 or A77... I think A99 around for only 2 years plus right?? :think:

 

[ezekiel]

Got my A7 for about 2 weeks and still waiting for my 55FE to be delivered.

Currently using Contax G45 for test shots and have a few questions hope you guys can chip in?

1. Comparing with my rx1, the A7 seems to have more noise at similar high ISO? Infact id say colour signatures are more pleasing on my rx1 as well.. Dunno if it's the Contax g lens and if my 55fe will be better.

2. How does the 35mm FE compare to rx1? Aperture 2 vs 2.8 is a given but how about sharpness and micro contrast? Keep debating whether to get it but seems little sense.

3. Anyway to get around the 1/60 shutter speed default for A mode?

4. What's the best legacy wide angle choice available now? Is CV21mm ultron any good?

Thanks in advance folks