observations of buy/sell behaviors

[alloy]

Hi, Alloy:

Is the $20 so important to you? I know that every cents count, but does it worth it after so much trouble and time? Do you really think it is safe enough to trust such a person after so much you have experience? Actually we can all just sit back and let you guys argue, but it leads you to no destination. As a fellow member, I would just say forget it, take it as a lesson learnt. Yes you lost $20, but it makes you a wiser man the next time you do anything. Just tell the guy either he pay back $20 or stay away from you in the future.


Last words are that we all know it is impossible to get back the $20 from what you say. Why waste your precious time? OK, I am wasting my precious time (j/k hor)

Hi ITguy, i totally agree with u. I myself know that its not worth it to risk anything for $20. In fact i even wanted to donate that sum of money as soon as or if i ever receive it. I jus hope he will do the payment via bank transfer and not a face to face thing cos im dead sure it will look/feel akward, and it may end up very "akward" too. If he simply refuses to pay via bank transfer i also LL liao loh. If he does the payment , im pretty sure i wont stoop so low as to continue lamenting about his misdeed. Anyway i dont think its impossible to get back the money lah, jus that his paranoia and neurotic personality coupled with his slight lack of knowledge with the electronic fund transfer procedure is making him shun away from that mode of payment. Seriously, till now i still dunno how his bank a/c number can harm him, all i can do is send money into it if i have his a/c no. which i definitely wont do so :bsmilie: Infact i know of a ppl who publicly announce their a/c number in the forum to receive money for mass orders.

Anyway i must once again thank u guys for ur concern over this issue. I hope it will come to a close peacefully if all things work out.

 

[csy]

to alloy:
$20 isnt very much, and you can easily earn it back by doing some odd jobs on weekends. honesty and trust is very impt in all aspects of life, including doing sales with other people.
think bout this: Would you want to make a good and clean trade with another person, or would you instead want to trouble yourself and the other person by changing the terms of the trade? the first option is best as it is a win-win situation in which both parties get what they want (buyer gets goods, seller gets $$). If you do not have enough $$ or you are just bidding for fun, then you shouldn't even be a worthy member of clubsnap at all.

there are many good sellers out there, but as patient as they might be, they can still be pissed off by nuisances.
--i met a buyer today and he spent 20mins teaching me how to check to see if a lens was of good quality even though he was in a hurry :thumbsup: --

It seems like you are getting a bit mixed up on the whole event.

 

[alloy]

eh alloy, you need people to go with you. can pm me... interested in seeing this type... dun worry, i am non violent.

hehe, no problem, will pm u to meet up for shoots more likely. ;p

 

[theITguy]

you see, itguy.

to you it is a small issue.

to alloy, he has been cheated, harrassed, disturbed and threatened. so you must understand why he is so pissed off.

not to mentioned he try to conned us with 2 nicks.

end of the day i think nothing will happen but how alloy feel... is a bit burning now i guess.

Hi,

It was never a small issue. How do you know to me it is a small issue? I am those hot tempered guys out there that will scold a fellow worker if he did things wrong. I will react more than Alloy do. But does it really help by using words to make his blood burn even more? Sometimes you need to overcome emotions, by trying to help with getting him to call police etc will only add to his emotion. Cheated? I am not sure, so do not jump to conclusion as we are all 3rd party. No one knows who is right or wrong, only they themselves know.

Harassing, disturbing and threatening are just methods that challenges the minds. If you are weak you will fall. If you can overcome your fears the so called SMSes will stopped, coz the starter will become bored at the end of the day. It is all in the mind.


There are a lot of people who gives you that kind of attitude. If you are bothered by them you will make them feel good. On the other hand if you ignored them, somehow they will think it is no fun at all, gradually it will stop. A counter method will be to give 10x more attitude, but it will hurt you more at the end.

 

[alloy]

to alloy:
$20 isnt very much, and you can easily earn it back by doing some odd jobs on weekends. honesty and trust is very impt in all aspects of life, including doing sales with other people.
think bout this: Would you want to make a good and clean trade with another person, or would you instead want to trouble yourself and the other person by changing the terms of the trade? the first option is best as it is a win-win situation in which both parties get what they want (buyer gets goods, seller gets $$). If you do not have enough $$ or you are just bidding for fun, then you shouldn't even be a worthy member of clubsnap at all.

there are many good sellers out there, but as patient as they might be, they can still be pissed off by nuisances.
--i met a buyer today and he spent 20mins teaching me how to check to see if a lens was of good quality even though he was in a hurry :thumbsup: --

Eh bro i hope u directed the above post to me by mistake cos i was the one whose money was being owed. :sweat: And yeah like ur buyer today, i did spend a good 20-30mins the other day teaching dtaytc how to use his camera and the filter he bought from be despite the fact im meeting someone else. Reason he gave was that he is a complete newbie who know nutz about photography plus he bought his camera 2nd hand w/o the manual. I felt sorry for him so i taught him and gave him advises. He checked the filter for scratches etc too. And he got my a/c on that very day too. Infact i even told him to pay me $10 more and i will jus write off the other $10, but he refused.

 

[dtaytc]

Cause i completely think it's unfair for u.... since i have promise to pay u full amount but i have not enough and u agreed to my suggestion rite alloy..? i will only pay u upon meet up.... u decide urself then... Btwm, Thanks so much on teaching me... really appreciate ur sincere and concern....

 

[theITguy]

To Alloy and dtaytc:

I hope either of you call each other up, hold your emotions and talk peacefully. It might just be misunderstanding, coz both do not read other's minds. If both are really sincere in settling the $20, please do so. It seriously do not need a bank transfer to know the other person's personal information. Such information can be easily traced from the IP log from NTU and the admins here. Stand for both your innocent by being willing to settle the problem peacefully. Win Win situation that harm lesser both's mental health (it is unhealthy to be angry).


Tired, tomorrow still need to go back to camp for course, nite

 

[alloy]

Hi,

It was never a small issue. How do you know to me it is a small issue? I am those hot tempered guys out there that will scold a fellow worker if he did things wrong. I will react more than Alloy do. But does it really help by using words to make his blood burn even more? Sometimes you need to overcome emotions, by trying to help with getting him to call police etc will only add to his emotion. Cheated? I am not sure, so do not jump to conclusion as we are all 3rd party. No one knows who is right or wrong, only they themselves know.

Harassing, disturbing and threatening are just methods that challenges the minds. If you are weak you will fall. If you can overcome your fears the so called SMSes will stopped, coz the starter will become bored at the end of the day. It is all in the mind.


There are a lot of people who gives you that kind of attitude. If you are bothered by them you will make them feel good. On the other hand if you ignored them, somehow they will think it is no fun at all, gradually it will stop. A counter method will be to give 10x more attitude, but it will hurt you more at the end.

I understand wat u mean bro, i think bro zekai was trying to explain how i felt if others were in my shoes. Anyway like wat u said, i know all these will have to end, and i hope it will end well too. I think i will choose ignore method if he sms somemore rubbish, anyway im not really bothered with most of the smses jus the previous few which look quite bad. The subsequent ones were not so bad, there is no more threats , jus complains and whines.

 

[p4610yz]

guys i ask u all
do u find fellow clubsnappers who do not wan to deal properly...
deal is closed...n say will contact me...
n somemore got my contact liao...
then mia for two days nvr reply my pm...
then now say...item is being sold....
it is so no integrity...

i wonder if u all meet people like this...

i will not wans to say who larh..but the person who reads this i hope his conscious prickle him larh..

 

[Belle&Sebastain]

Cause i completely think it's unfair for u.... since i have promise to pay u full amount but i have not enough and u agreed to my suggestion rite alloy..? i will only pay u upon meet up.... u decide urself then... Btwm, Thanks so much on teaching me... really appreciate ur sincere and concern....

Hey, if you dun have money dun buy ok? loser :blah:

 

[alloy]

Cause i completely think it's unfair for u.... since i have promise to pay u full amount but i have not enough and u agreed to my suggestion rite alloy..? i will only pay u upon meet up.... u decide urself then... Btwm, Thanks so much on teaching me... really appreciate ur sincere and concern....

hey bro i think i will not wanna meet u for the $20. i jus want u to transfer it to my account if u can. If u think u cannot and u definitely wont then i think there is no use argueing that much anyway. Tell u wat, u take the $20 and donate it. To NKF or to a chinese temple also ok. As long as its used for good deeds im ok liao. U can choose to keep the money in ur pocket but mind u God is watching.

Why do i wanna do this, cos i saw ur post of apology and that is all that is needed in my case and slight repentance. I have also said before, i would have had the money donated upon receiving it anyway so now u are jus doing the donation for me. I no longer feel comfortable using the money anyay. Anyway i doubt i will wanna meet u and u will wanna return via atm, i guess this is only way for both of us to seek solace from this episode.

I hope u understand by now after my countless sms replies to u that money is jus but a small issue, but the individual character and integrity is very important. Its says alot about an idividual and also dictate how a society's morals will be moulded into in the future in all manner. So long as u do ur part as a good dealer/partner in future, and be very sure to hold up to ur promises, everything will be fine. Do not resort to anymore sort of trickery be it asking seller to meet u when u jolly well know that ur pocket have not enuff money and then try last min discount. Or even try a double nick to support urself by hiding behind ur pseudo character. All these says alot. So sorry for being loh soh, im not trying to preach here or assume to be the greatest in character or wat, but 1 thing im sure of is that all business dealings should be clean. Profit or loss is another issue. Honesty and integrity rules above all. Hope u have a bright future, take care

 

[dtaytc]

I think it's not really good that if i dun return lor... now mess up until like this... i have to return to u lor.. else more ppl will tot i trying to escape from payment... so I strongly hope that u can come out and we meet up to return u the money lor... now is me who wanna return u the money and u dun 1... y like this? in the first place u keep saying that i dun wanna pay up.. now i wanna pay u but u dun 1? huh? :dunno:

That's really strange... anyway, i insist to pay u upon meet up.... if not other will keep saying i broke my promise and try not to pay u. it's not fair for u and me... so i am now trying my very best to ask u out just for the payment and u dun 1... hai~~~

 

[y0ngcheng]

i'm on the side of justice.
dtaytc, you'll know alloy wun meet you in anyway cause i believe hes juz too nice not to use violence on you. if i'm the one cheated ( not saying you cheat his $ ) i would have given him a nice ending. so pls dont give any lame excues that you will only pay up upon meeting him. technology now is advance. there is a thing call bank transfer. dont tell me that you dont have a bank a/c? or you scare write wrong a/c no. transfer to wrong a/c? i dont think it will be nice if both of you meet up in anyway since its already become this state. who knows you'll ask a group of ppl with you when you meeting alloy and give him a beating? i'm not saying that you would do this, but juz looking at ur post, this is wad i can assume. ok. my assumation might be wrong. juz use the bank transfer method transfer the god dame $20 to alloy for the god sake that you both agreed for the deal price. for the sake of "man of a word"....
clubsnappers :cheers: alloy

 

[hwchoy]

dtaytc aka coolzzz, let me just say that for NO OTHER REASONS but just pretending to be two person by using two nicks to defend yourself, is an act so lacking in integrity and so despicable that if you're my son I'd personally strangle you.

I say this not just for reprimanding you, but in the hope you would stop and THINK of what you just did. And if you still do not think what you have done is shameful and despicable, I can only pity your parents. You are not young, and you are not uneducated. You have a long way to go, in your studies and in your career. THINK.

 

[zaren]

I think it's not really good that if i dun return lor... now mess up until like this... i have to return to u lor.. else more ppl will tot i trying to escape from payment... so I strongly hope that u can come out and we meet up to return u the money lor... now is me who wanna return u the money and u dun 1... y like this? in the first place u keep saying that i dun wanna pay up.. now i wanna pay u but u dun 1? huh? :dunno:

That's really strange... anyway, i insist to pay u upon meet up.... if not other will keep saying i broke my promise and try not to pay u. it's not fair for u and me... so i am now trying my very best to ask u out just for the payment and u dun 1... hai~~~

dtaytc,

may i suggest you mail alloy a cheque for the $20 if you are not comfortable with bank transfer. Or, donate the $20 as alloy suggested and post the donation receipt on this forum.

cheers...

 

[Dennis]

dtaytc, don't try to make things more difficult, it does not show you are sincere in trying to return the $20. It is not acceptable to own people money and say you have simply forgotten. There are so many ways to pay up but you insist on meeting face to face. If you sincerely wanted to say sorry face to face it may be a different storey but I have my doubt as you have not mentioned it in the entire thread and only soften up when your defence fail. Using another nick to your defence shows your insincerity from the beginning. I applaud alloy for bringing this to light and let all be aware.

I think to many it is not the money that matters but the integrity and sincerity of an agreed transaction.

 

[loupgarou]

I think its ridiculous.
a) you owe money, its your obligation to meet alloy at his convenience, not the other way round.

b) electronic transactions via internet banking, paypal or simply atm to atm, or even cash deposit into bank account has been done safely without risk.

c) well, too bad alloy has more integrity in honoring your privacy than outing you.

 

[RuthBaby]

shd we meet for kopi? so alloy shd jus use tt $20 to blanja us?

oh no... its getting so heated up...

milo peng pls

 

[buddy]

Long, my thoughts exactly.... Nowadays, I tend not to believe/trust any seller (or buyer) if they don't appear willing to deal asap when I contact them personally via PM or the phone even though their original post might say so e.g. "urgent sale", "must let go because upgrading to XXX"

It might be cliche, but I think the whole point of buy/sell should be win-win for both parties - the buyers get to obtain something they want at a lower cost and the sellers get to sell something they have for whatever reason i.e. lack of cash flow, lost interest etc.

It is definitely more important to me that the seller behaves in a sincere way. After all, would you guys buy something from a seller who you dont trust has damaged the item and try to sell it off bcos of this? Buyers merely part with hard earned cash on their end!

In all honesty, this is the only place in Singapore where I find the term "reserved" so often used and (not surprisingly) abused.

In any other place of buy and sell, its always the "first come first served" rule
that is practiced.

If Robinsons had a sale, do you think you can call in and ask them to reserve something for a week before you turn up? If Harvey Norman had a below cost sale, try calling them to reserve it?

All sellers should stick to the show me the money principle. If you want to buy something, come to me first and pay me and you will have it. Ppl who begin their posts have every right to demand conditions are met. So stick to your guns and demand speed of settlement from the buyer else it goes to somebody else!

So if I wanna sell something and require that that somebody must be able to suck my toes as well, and you are not willing to do so, too bad for you. If one is willing to dilly and dally on the conditions for the deal (1 week reserve period for Christ's sake), you are only inviting yourself to be screwed.

If you wanna reserve something out of your own accord, do it for your friends or those you can trust only! I would only if its one of my friends or ppl I have dealt with previously!

The flip side of this issue is that it is so ridiculous that items posted 5 mins before hand gets reserved by kiasu ppl (and therefore made unavailable) even though the serious buyers are willing and serious enough to make the trip immediately to pay.

Fact is that ppl change their minds, even in the real commercial world. You only end up seeing a ridiculous number of "I got stood up, so item is available again" re-posts which hog bandwidth and screws serious buyers/sellers alike.

Both buyer and seller's fault.

There is a reason why Time and money, Time=money has served the commercial world so well. I never have any problems because I tell ppl its a done deal only when the money changes hands.

 

[goering]

I think its ridiculous.
a) you owe money, its your obligation to meet alloy at his convenience, not the other way round.

Exactly ..

My deepest regards for alloy for his utmost patience and consideration over this matter.

It appears that the person concerned is clearly unrepentant and insincere in returning the money

When its time to make the payment, he jus told me "$100 can anot?" I told him," NO, u agreed to $120 and that why i came down to meet u." He then had the cheek to say that was the only way to make me come down to meet him. Then he contd saying that all he had was $112 in his wallet and tell me to take the $100. I really felt like walking away man. But he jus said how poor and miserable he was, and wanted that thing badly. I said i will take $110 and forget about the other $10, but e refused saying he need to go back to dorm. We finally agreed that he settle the payment the next day by wiring the $20 to my account after much pleaing from him. Kaoz, the next thing i know when we went separate ways, he sent me an sms and told me that the thing i sold him is most probably a fake, and then conveniently sent me another sms which says " Actually im really very poor, and i have no one to borrow the $20 to return u, and i hate owing ppl money, how ah? U tell me how ah? " Wah lao, it really jus pissed me off till i felt like strangling him man. What does he expect me to say? To tell him " Its ok, u can forget about the $20 u owe me?" NO WAY MAN. And the fact that he repeatedly smsing me telling me that the item might have been a fake cos his pictures did not turn out as beautiful as the ones he saw in the internet pisses me off even more. ......

He then asked me to stop reprimanding him and said that $20 only wat. no big deal, scared he wont return meh. I then asked him politely to meet me to exchange the item for a full refund but he seem to avoid that suggestion all together, bet he jus wanna pull a fast one. I really hate it when ppl jus point a finger at me and said i sold him a fake item all becos he wanted a discount. Till today, the money is still no where in sight. I sms him, no reply, call him, say not convenient and busy with project or some **** lah. All the buy/sell that i have done had been most pleasant. We buy/sell with no glitches or hassle/haggling and even make good friends, exchanging photograhy tips etc.

dtaytc
a) now if Alloy's account is as described, didn't you agree to wire the money the following day via bank transfer. Why is it now it is not settled and worse still you have refused to do a bank transfer?

b) and you have claimed that you have "forgotten". but alloy smsed you, no reply and you claimed you were busy with projects, etc.