Nikon D700, time to switch camp

[olymac]

Today is the 10th of July and the thread is still not removed. Why? I did not read every word of it, but this thread has absolutely no value. the thread starter says absolutely nothing in his opening post, it is just an "I jump ship" post which nowadays gets reported and deleted even on DPR.

I all honesty, I think the TS is NEVER going to jump ship, just dreams about the camera.

Can't agree with you more.

 

[TMC]

I have a friend who bought D300 and moaned when he read the specs of D700 and his lense collection is not fully compatible.
So now if he want to upgrade to D700, he has to sell off his lenses and buy new ones.
I told him it is not too late to swicth to Olympus, since you have to sell of everything anyway but he stubbornly held on to the blind believe and succumb to peer pressure that only Nikon is worthy of purchase.

Good for Nikon, bad for his pocket.

Well if he has money to burn, then well I guess it is his money.
May be when we sit leisurely together again 30 years later I will prod him on his decision now, and how much money does that translate that time.

Why? D700 is backward compatible with DX lenses. There is no need to sell everything and get new lenses just because it is a new camera. The mount has never changed and will still support both DX and FX formats.

I know people who have both canon and oly and used Nikon before. There are pros and cons for each system and no one can fault another for wanting something else. As far as I can see Cimman is looking for better high ISO performance for his usage and got lynched because of it. So far Nikon and Canon have the advantage over Oly, without a major breakthrough in their R&D, it is hard to see Oly being on par with either N or C.

 

[olymac]

D700 is backward.... There is no need to sell everything and get new lenses just because it is a new camera. The mount has never changed ....

I know people who have both canon and oly and used Nikon before. There are pros and cons for each system and no one can fault another for wanting something else. As far as I can see Cimman is looking for better high ISO performance for his usage and got lynched because of it. So far Nikon and Canon..... without a major breakthrough in their R&D, it is hard to see .... being on par with either N or C.

Who is getting lynched :bigeyes: Is Nikon / Canon over-charging again :bsmilie:

Better ai-soh performance? Get a Fuji F 20/30/31/50 whatever camera - best value for ai-soh performance - IMHO.

 

[TMC]

Who is getting lynched :bigeyes: Is Nikon / Canon over-charging again :bsmilie:

Better ai-soh performance? Get a Fuji F 20/30/31/50 whatever camera - best value for ai-soh performance - IMHO.

Nikon/Canon overcharging? Care to explain that?

I see reason being overridden by brand fanaticism here. Make one comment and get idiotic replies.

 

[OlyFlyer]

Nikon/Canon overcharging? Care to explain that?

I see reason being overridden by brand fanaticism here. Make one comment and get idiotic replies.

Of course they overcharge. Just like Olympus, Pentax and all the others. Thats how companies survive. It is called profit and is necessary for every business. I don't see any reason to be so trigger happy. :dunno:

 

[olymac]

Who is getting lynched :bigeyes: Is Nikon / Canon over-charging again :bsmilie:

Better ai-soh performance? Get a Fuji F 20/30/31/50 whatever camera - best value for ai-soh performance - IMHO.

Can you NOT read this as a question? It is NOT a statement of fact. As it is you are the one coming in claiming that the TS got lynched and I was just wondering what made you come to the conclusion.

Nikon/Canon overcharging? Care to explain that?

I see reason being overridden by brand fanaticism here. Make one comment and get idiotic replies.

Wowwww ..... you are sensitive ...... and demanding ...... and somewhat rude, too .... :sweat:

 

[drakon09]

People, please observe some decorum.

Being judgmental and throwing accusations left and right will only incur similar replies which will, at the end of the day, literally go down in flames.

If you have an opinion, say your piece, back it up, be polite about it and avoid ambiguity. Personally I don't care what equipment you use/have.

Anyway it's Strike One; two more and it's out.

 

[pisduck]

Why? D700 is backward compatible with DX lenses. There is no need to sell everything and get new lenses just because it is a new camera. The mount has never changed and will still support both DX and FX formats.

I know people who have both canon and oly and used Nikon before. There are pros and cons for each system and no one can fault another for wanting something else. As far as I can see Cimman is looking for better high ISO performance for his usage and got lynched because of it. So far Nikon and Canon have the advantage over Oly, without a major breakthrough in their R&D, it is hard to see Oly being on par with either N or C.

If you actually read the whole thread, most of us are pretty level headed about this. nobody is "lynching" anyone. seriously, I do think that this thread is pretty calm (at least before you came in) considering provocative title (I personally feel it would get a stronger outburst if the title is posted in other sub forums)

most of us do agree that oly ISO performance is not on-par with nikon/canon, especially so if you are comparing with full frame sensor. We suggest things that oly have which nikon doesn't have which MAY help to compensate for the ISO performance. Example, olympus has a f1.4 stabilized system with the 30mm f1.4 prime (which nikon/canon does not have). That helps u somewhat to use a lower ISO. but if you need a high shutter speed in low light, then full frame is probably the way to go. nobody is saying any different.

all systems has its pros and cons. Olympus pros for me is probably the color rendition, stabilized f1.4 prime + ultra wides, live view (E330) and dust cleaner (really works). cons to me is dynamic range, resolution (E330), ISO performance.

I jumped to an SD14 which hardly have any "fanatical" followers in CS. Reason being I feel its dynamic range and resolution is higher. I can print better A3+ prints and see the difference in front of me. But for that, I get a non-working AF.... non-working exposure... have to shoot full manual. I will probably switch sometime in the future.

We should not be so serious about brands. Just chit chat about our personal views, some of us like nikon, some like canon, I like sigma (duh...). It is nice to talk about our personal opinions of the brands, but when people gets too emotional about it, it usually gets out of hand.

 

[tomcat]

I jumped to an SD14 which hardly have any "fanatical" followers in CS. Reason being I feel its dynamic range and resolution is higher. I can print better A3+ prints and see the difference in front of me. But for that, I get a non-working AF.... non-working exposure... have to shoot full manual. I will probably switch sometime in the future.

Why is AF and exposure non-working in the SD14? Faulty camera? I have no problem with mine. :dunno:

 

[pisduck]

the AF is a specific problem with the 12-24mm... confirmed with sigma singapore, they cannot do anything about it. it is not consistent, ie not in focus also can get focus confirmation.

I also find the metering of the camera rather inconsistent for different situations so in the end I used manual metering to get more consistent results.

 

[Jord84]

To each, his own. Enjoy what you have.

 

[olymac]

the AF is a specific problem with the 12-24mm... confirmed with sigma singapore, they cannot do anything about it. it is not consistent, ie not in focus also can get focus confirmation.

I also find the metering of the camera rather inconsistent for different situations so in the end I used manual metering to get more consistent results.

Nice camera .....

 

[cater]

Nikon/Canon overcharging? Care to explain that?

I see reason being overridden by brand fanaticism here. Make one comment and get idiotic replies.

Most of us over here is polite. I urge you to watch your words over your post. Im sure that u doesnt want to be the firestarter here. As an Oly user, I admit that Oly cant perform in par with Nikon & Canon ISO performance. But if you were to look at previous model E1,E300,E330,E500 comparing to later model E410,420,510,520,E3 everyone is clear in mind that Oly is moving ahead with better control on noise. If you are brand fanaticism (pls take note i use the word "IF") ,you should feel relief Oly is 1 step behind of noise control. If Oly is ever on par on ISO & noise control, Im very sure that it will be the worst nightmare to Canikon & this topic will exist on Canikon thread instead of here. Bare in mind Oly does have features that Nikon & Canon gets jealous with & there is no end when comes to brand comparison. Pls do not point your guns at me as i did not add any gun powder in my post. Again if my words makes any whom feel uncomfortable, I sincerely apologise here. Cheers.

 

[Mikefellh]

I admit that Oly cant perform in par with Nikon & Canon ISO performance.

And just to remind those reading the ISO is merely only one factor, and Olympus out performs Nikon and Canon in other ways. In selecting a dSLR I went through three rounds of weeding out inferior cameras, and Canikons were weeded out in the first round.

 

[olymac]

And just to remind those reading the ISO is merely only one factor, and Olympus out performs Nikon and Canon in other ways. In selecting a dSLR I went through three rounds of weeding out inferior cameras, and Canikons were weeded out in the first round.

Are you implying that the Canikons are inferior :bigeyes: :bigeyes:

 

[drakon09]

Are you implying that the Canikons are inferior :bigeyes: :bigeyes:

No, mike is just stating that fourthirds meets his needs better than the other systems.

 

[olymac]

whenever I'm indoors either in the daytime or especially in the night, I'm reminded of the four thirds constraint ie. high noise levels. Of course this can be said of Nikon and Canon with thier non full frame sensors.

Now with the D700, I can finally go to ISO 3200 OR 6400 with acceptable noise levels.
Flash is not always an option indoors if you want candid shots, or if you're in a public place where the patrons don't like to be blinded by flashes, one or two they will tolerate, but not more. I'm drooling for a full frame sensor camera. The Canon full frame is out of my reach, but give the D700 a year for the price to subside, then it is time for indoor candid pics. I've lost so much opportunities.

I'll still use the Olympus for daytime outdoors, and when flash is acceptable, at least for now.

If Olympus doesn't come out with a full frame sensor soon, it's going to lose more ground to the market leaders.
I don't see that it conflicts with their four thirds strategy. Both Nikon and Canon has DX sensor and APS sensors as well as full frames.
Now that Nikon has the D700 and the Canon is coming out with a replacement for the 5D, is Olympus going to sit quietly by and watch C&N clean up the full frame market ? flashless low light shots will now be possible and opens up a new realm of opportunities. I don't need super sharp or super noise free images at ISO 3200 or above, just enough noise free for 4R pics is fine with me. Currently the Olympus at ISO 3200 is unusable at 4R size pics.

Just curious to know ..... which Olympus are you comparing the D700 with :think:

 

[TMC]

If you actually read the whole thread, most of us are pretty level headed about this. nobody is "lynching" anyone. seriously, I do think that this thread is pretty calm (at least before you came in) considering provocative title (I personally feel it would get a stronger outburst if the title is posted in other sub forums)

most of us do agree that oly ISO performance is not on-par with nikon/canon, especially so if you are comparing with full frame sensor. We suggest things that oly have which nikon doesn't have which MAY help to compensate for the ISO performance. Example, olympus has a f1.4 stabilized system with the 30mm f1.4 prime (which nikon/canon does not have). That helps u somewhat to use a lower ISO. but if you need a high shutter speed in low light, then full frame is probably the way to go. nobody is saying any different.

all systems has its pros and cons. Olympus pros for me is probably the color rendition, stabilized f1.4 prime + ultra wides, live view (E330) and dust cleaner (really works). cons to me is dynamic range, resolution (E330), ISO performance.

I jumped to an SD14 which hardly have any "fanatical" followers in CS. Reason being I feel its dynamic range and resolution is higher. I can print better A3+ prints and see the difference in front of me. But for that, I get a non-working AF.... non-working exposure... have to shoot full manual. I will probably switch sometime in the future.

We should not be so serious about brands. Just chit chat about our personal views, some of us like nikon, some like canon, I like sigma (duh...). It is nice to talk about our personal opinions of the brands, but when people gets too emotional about it, it usually gets out of hand.

Nah, that is just feeling I got when I went through the whole thread and posted it up. The response was quite taunting despite what the poster claims. But it will have to rest for now.

As for the Oly cams. The E-3 I tried is nice but there are some cons that put me off about it, although I do like it color output. That said, I have yet to try Sigma, they are so rare in SG.

 

[Mikefellh]

There will be cons, and pros, for every camera. There's no one perfect camera out there, not even the recently announced ones.

The same thing goes for camera formats, no one format, including the so-called full-frame 135/35mm format is free of cons.

 

[olymac]

This sounds like one of those 'jump ship' thread on DPReview

To thread starter: Go get the D700 and be happy man/woman, nobody is stopping you and you do not need to jusitfy your purchase to anybody.

yes, i agree. if anything, this smells of a flamebait.

and to the TS, i got both - oly and nikon (plus canon.. but dats a PnS), and so do some oly users here too. each can do things the other can't. so, no point comparing.

thread closed.

Folks, I've reopened this thread for the sake of civil discussion (and I mean CIVIL).

Points to note:

1. No brand-bashing.
2. No chest-beating.
3. Do bear in mind that the two systems discussed here are COMPLETELY different in nature.
4. And lastly, DO NOT even attempt to flamebait; I'm taking a ZERO tolerance stance on this.

I hope to see some maturity in the posts following.

So does anyone know when the D700 be out in SG :dunno: Would like to test it.

I would so like to shoot at ISO 6400 ..... might be the decider for me to be a camp switcher .... you know, the incredible ability to take acceptably good pics in restaurants at night for printing in 4R ..... :lovegrin: