D4 User Thread

[lenslust]

The issue is that Singapore has insisted on several occasions that there is supposedly no repair software to rectify the issue for the D4. However that stance has changed in recent months & Singapore & Japan both deny the possibility of a defect & believe that the camera is within factory standards. Now after my continuous appeals and e-mails to Mr Kimura Makoto, Japan wishes to inspect the set again. I have low hopes that inspecting the set will result in the problem being resolved. I was initially reluctant to share my experience online but after more than half a year of struggling with the issue, I wrote a post on dpreview. As can be seen here, I have finally given in and wrote on clubsnap too. Selling this D4 to another user using my userid has thus become extremely difficult & certainly immoral & imho things have developed to a full-fledged conflict between me & nikon.

I would also like to clarify that other than this issue, I believe the D4 is a fantastic product. XQD is not my favourite either, but it is fast & has great potential in the pro-video market.

If any of you are in doubt of my truthfulness, or the validity of the problem, I am willing to organise a session near funan for you guys to test my set. Coffee is on me. I just want to solve the problem. I am very, very, very, very tired.

Nobody's doubting you, I know the frustrations one goes through when things aren't working as expected. The weight of the matter lingering in the head, unable to concentrate, and wondering when it will go away.

It can be weary when the technical department does not have an answer to your issue nor can they address it in layman terms except to tell you to pay for the repairs.

However, as what dd123 has mentioned, perhaps, you should just bite the USD300, get it fixed, and get it over and done with. If I had issues with my D4, I certainly won't wait and be as patient as you. Guess I'm fortunate that mine being one of the pioneer batches (paid through my nose for it), had no issues except when it hung on me the very first time I inserted the battery.

We are just trying to share, trying to resolve your headache, sometimes issues arise not of our usages, but sometimes, it sucks that we have to pay for the fixes. Opportunity costs vs time spent, I think USD300 is a worthwhile resolution.

I just feel that NSC needs to come clean what is the USD300 going to cover, which parts replacement, which parts were faulty and warranty period of 3 months do apply thereafter.

There are many proud D4 owners like myself, because we know what kind of beast it is and how it really performs, so we're inclined towards it being a perfect solution for all, but nonetheless, you still get lemons once a while.

Cheers!

 

[lenslust]

I usually don't travel with a tripod. I just walk and shoot hand held. ISO shots up to 12800 or more are still useable straight out from the camera or with minor tweaking.

It is a camera that is really good for shooting in low light situations and I still have yet to hit it limits. The ISO gives me the freedom where I can just pre-visualize, shoot and scoot. Some places aren't too safe to linger long with all your gears exposed especially at night.

Sydney harbor bridge, shot hand held after some beers at circular quay pubs.

24-120mm VR4, f/4, 1/10sec, ISO12800




D4S_2327 by Light Machinery, on Flickr

Down side with the D4 is not the weight, is not the battery life.... it's the bloody dual slot charger that you need to lug along during trips. That said, maybe I'm just being wilful. When I was on D2X/D3S dual charger seemed 'WOW', but now I have it, I feel it's... hard to travel with it, unless I'm going photography trips.

I've since settled with a D600 (remove the grip when travelling). Light, small, and not loud. The last time I walked around with a D4+17-35 hanging on my neck in China, all the souvenir shooter-and-print folks on-site, avoided me like plague. D600 is more quiet and doesn't attract the attention.

Love it.

 

[surrephoto]

@ Surrephoto:

My respectful suggestion:

If you believe that another set of D4 can solve your problems then you would also believe that changing the defective part would solve the problem.

However, bodies are not international warranty and if need to get Nikon to honour the warranty, I am afraid you'll have to do it at the country you purchased it. A company needs to abide by its policies without exceptions.

Otherwise, it would seem that you have isolated the problem to the sensor and having it repaired/changed by the technician/service centre who said they could would likely solve your problem unless you believe otherwise at this juncture.

I wish you all the best and a swift end to your troubles

Just to clarify somethings which were in the part I of my dpreview exposé; I actually told singapore that I can pay for the adjustment on day 1 of going to the service centre for the issue. This was probably the 2nd or 3rd sentence I said to the technician. But they choose to not charge me. And yes, I have been to KL personally once. Issue not solved.

You'd be surprised that Japan is actually insisting that Hong Kong is responsible for the issue. The whole matter is extremely confusing and stressing for me as a customer. I am finding hard to believe that these policies are without exceptions. So I hope those of you who wish to help me or suggest ways to solve the problem can read my in-depth exposé first.

Continuation of my Nikon D4 assymetrical AF saga Part III: Nikon FX SLR (D1-D4, D600-D800) Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

 

[Light Machinery]

Yes, it is very true. The D4 does have its attractions and distractions.

Nothing attracts beautiful people to be photographed like a D4 mounted with a big lens, especially at those free for all shoot outs with plenty of models

The other distraction that comes with it is when people stops me to take pictures of them with their own gear or for them, especially in foreign cities. I get plenty of those requests off and on. :sticktong

Most of the time I find it is the fellow photographers that have avoided me. I don't really know why? Is it the D4? Perhaps.:angel:

I have thought of getting a smaller FX camera for my usual travel walkabouts. The D600 / D800 issues are giving me a pause for the moment. So I am still sticking with my D700 / D5100 for the time being.

As for surrephoto, I do hope you will find an amiable solution, have the D4 to be fixed and working to its full potential again.

Technically the problem is the same as the D800/E left AF point focus issue.

Any CS members here care to share on what was the actual fix on their D800/E by NSC. Just parts replaced or just AF sensor offset calibration or both? I am just curios.

 

[zoom3]

I usually don't travel with a tripod. I just walk and shoot hand held. ISO shots up to 12800 or more are still useable straight out from the camera or with minor tweaking.

It is a camera that is really good for shooting in low light situations and I still have yet to hit it limits. The ISO gives me the freedom where I can just pre-visualize, shoot and scoot. Some places aren't too safe to linger long with all your gears exposed especially at night.

Sydney harbor bridge, shot hand held after some beers at circular quay pubs.

24-120mm VR4, f/4, 1/10sec, ISO12800




D4S_2327 by Light Machinery, on Flickr

Nice shot of the bridge, even at ISO 12800! Brings back memory. Used to frequent the restaurants and pubs in that area when I was covering NSW.

 

[surrephoto]

Yes, it is very true. The D4 does have its attractions and distractions.

Nothing attracts beautiful people to be photographed like a D4 mounted with a big lens, especially at those free for all shoot outs with plenty of models

The other distraction that comes with it is when people stops me to take pictures of them with their own gear or for them, especially in foreign cities. I get plenty of those requests off and on. :sticktong

Most of the time I find it is the fellow photographers that have avoided me. I don't really know why? Is it the D4? Perhaps.:angel:

I have thought of getting a smaller FX camera for my usual travel walkabouts. The D600 / D800 issues are giving me a pause for the moment. So I am still sticking with my D700 / D5100 for the time being.

As for surrephoto, I do hope you will find an amiable solution, have the D4 to be fixed and working to its full potential again.

Technically the problem is the same as the D800/E left AF point focus issue.

Any CS members here care to share on what was the actual fix on their D800/E by NSC. Just parts replaced or just AF sensor offset calibration or both? I am just curios.

I use the D4 because of image quality & dynamic range. I'm not one of those who use the D4 with big lenses for bragging rights. But i do agree you can immediately create a distance between yourself & other photographers by using expensive gear, and i agree the D4 enters the overtly expensive & indulgent range to some.

 

[daredevil123]

How I deal with situations has nothing to do with the fact that I am facing issues. I appreciate your comments very much but I do not understand why you need to bring in the past. I have been extremely patient in dealing with this D4 issue. Can you imagine someone giving a large corporation numerous chances over a year? I don't think my speaking volume exceeded anything more than 5 decibels more than average even when at the angriest/agitated state when talking to Nikon reps about my issue. I know of alot of other customers far more senior than me who have blown their top over far smaller problems. I hope you do not demonize me, I think I have been fair throughout this case. I respect you very much as a mod and am aware you have many years of experience in the field and also as a member of this forum. The reason why my issue(s) are known to people is because of leakage of information and also many untrue rumors. Infact I have had 2 discussions with Nikon Singapore about their staff breaching my privacy and informing the public about my case. I have even witnessed (overheard, I was seating at the counter area, he was near the display area) a staff member telling another senior photographer about my case and branding me as a "silent protester". Many people are able to vouch for my integrity.

Also, how much I drive my camera and the type of genre of photography my shoot has nothing to do with the issue. This is an issue about a characteristic of the AF array. I am not questioning the durability of the D4 in any way.

As stated in my documentation on my dpreview thread, I did attempt to resolve things with Malaysia. They tried to tweak it once but to me there was no difference.

Also, is there even a "proper" way to deal with my D4 issue? I spent 1 year thinking of the best "proper" way and couldn't come to a conclusion. Sure, I can agree that I'm not the best at dealing with things at the service centre(s), but I think I'm far from the worst!

And btw, what's the P in IMHPO?

P = Personal. And everything I say in this thread is at a personal level.

How you deal with situations and people have everything to do with how you get your issues resolved.

In the end, getting an issue resolved is to do with dealing with people as much as dealing with issues. First understand the jurisdiction of the warranty. Then understand that people are what is most important in resolving issues. Relationships get things moving around the world more than anything.

I am not trying to demonize you. I don't really care as I have probably met you only once and we never had much more than a word to each other. But if you reflect on what you are doing all these while, you are actually the one trying to demonize Nikon as well as the people working in there.

I bring in the past because the way you chose to deal with this issue is exactly the same as the previous cases. Yes, there are problems you faced in each of these cases. But instead of working with the right people, you always chose make assumption on issues and people and then proceed to demonize the people you expect service from. Then you will publicize these assumptions and complaints on forums openly, akin to trying to force their hand. And to make it worse, you always go to the wrong point of contact, upsetting the service chain/flow, and in the end making people look bad while they were trying to help you out. Your set is a Malaysia set. You should have gone to Malaysia NSC in KL from the get-go and continued following up there. If the tweak did not help, you can request that they send it to Japan - not through NSC sg or to Nikon Japan yourself. If you want to save a few coins by buying a MY set, that is what you have to be prepared to do. By going to NSC Singapore, should not and will not get warranty service. That is policy of most electronics company and there are valid reasons for that.

When you finally go to Malaysia NSC, AFTER your camera went to NSC SG then Japan, did you work with them to resolve the situation? what did you do - You asked for return and exchange. Malaysia NSC was polite in agreeing until they found out you have used your camera considerably. A return/exchange is not stated in warranty. They have no obligation to authorize a return or exchange.

And when you go to Japan, you are basically inferring that Malaysia NSC, Singapore NSC and Nikon Hong Kong are not doing their job. You went as far as going to Nikon HQ, which in Japanese culture is very impolite and amount to equivalent of a demonstration against the company. Ginza NSC offered you a fix, and you declined.

And all these time you posted in forums, like your previous cases, complaining and seeking sympathy and at the same time demonizing Nikon, and worse, mentioning specific names of people serving you (you did it a few times before against the folks in NSC SG remember?)

Things work better and faster if people helping you actually like you. And by doing/saying/posting what you have done all these times, you are not helping in making people like you as a person. In fact, your actions create a lot of trouble for others. So how you expect anyone to go the extra mile for you?

As for Nikon Hong Kong, the reason what that is so because the regional HQ for Singapore and Malaysia is Nikon Hong Kong. All Nikon equipment sold in Singapore and Malaysia are distributed from Nikon Hong Kong. So for escalation, if Nikon Malaysia cannot solve your problem, the next level up is Nikon Hong Kong. Not sure why you wanted to jump the gun and flew to Japan.

I truly hope you will get your issues fixed. And so far it seems Nikon is doing a lot more I would expect them to, given how you have treated them all this time. And beyond wishing you best of luck in getting your hardware fixed, I hope more you can learn from this episode and grow up more and understand how to relate to people better and learn better problem solving skills.

PS. Just in case you are wondering, I am in no way related to Nikon. I am not sponsored, I am not a rep, I do not work there and, hell, I am not even NPS. I don't even know Jonathan that well to drink coffee and exchange jokes with him...

 

[daredevil123]

Technically the problem is the same as the D800/E left AF point focus issue.

Any CS members here care to share on what was the actual fix on their D800/E by NSC. Just parts replaced or just AF sensor offset calibration or both? I am just curios.

IIRC, the fix was calibration of the focus points via software.

 

[surrephoto]

P = Personal. And everything I say in this thread is at a personal level.

How you deal with situations and people have everything to do with how you get your issues resolved.

In the end, getting an issue resolved is to do with dealing with people as much as dealing with issues. First understand the jurisdiction of the warranty. Then understand that people are what is most important in resolving issues. Relationships get things moving around the world more than anything.

I am not trying to demonize you. I don't really care as I have probably met you only once and we never had much more than a word to each other. But if you reflect on what you are doing all these while, you are actually the one trying to demonize Nikon as well as the people working in there.

I bring in the past because the way you chose to deal with this issue is exactly the same as the previous cases. Yes, there are problems you faced in each of these cases. But instead of working with the right people, you always chose make assumption on issues and people and then proceed to demonize the people you expect service from. Then you will publicize these assumptions and complaints on forums openly, akin to trying to force their hand. And to make it worse, you always go to the wrong point of contact, upsetting the service chain/flow, and in the end making people look bad while they were trying to help you out. Your set is a Malaysia set. You should have gone to Malaysia NSC in KL from the get-go and continued following up there. If the tweak did not help, you can request that they send it to Japan - not through NSC sg or to Nikon Japan yourself. If you want to save a few coins by buying a MY set, that is what you have to be prepared to do. By going to NSC Singapore, should not and will not get warranty service. That is policy of most electronics company and there are valid reasons for that.

When you finally go to Malaysia NSC, AFTER your camera went to NSC SG then Japan, did you work with them to resolve the situation? what did you do - You asked for return and exchange. Malaysia NSC was polite in agreeing until they found out you have used your camera considerably. A return/exchange is not stated in warranty. They have no obligation to authorize a return or exchange.

And when you go to Japan, you are basically inferring that Malaysia NSC and Singapore NSC are not doing their job. You went as far as going to Nikon HQ, and in Japanese culture is very impolite and amount to equivalent of a demonstration against the company. Ginza NSC offered you a fix, and you declined.

And all these time you posted in forums, like your previous cases, complaining and seeking sympathy and at the same time demonizing Nikon, and worse, mentioning specific names of people serving you (you did it a few times before against the folks in NSC SG remember?)

Things work better and faster if people helping you actually like you. And by doing/saying/posting what you have done all these times, you are not helping in making people like you as a person. In fact, your actions create a lot of trouble for others. So how you expect anyone to go the extra mile for you?

I truly hope you will get your issues fixed. And so far it seems Nikon is doing a lot more I would expect them to, given how you have treated them all this time. And beyond wishing you best of luck in getting your hardware fixed, I hope more you can learn from this episode and grow up more and understand how to relate to people better and learn better problem solving skills.

PS. Just in case you are wondering, I am in no way related to Nikon. I am not sponsored, I am not a rep, I do not work there and, hell, I am not even NPS. I don't even know Jonathan that well to drink coffee and exchange jokes with him...

I think you are right on most points. Especially regarding me looking for the wrong people. However I want to clarify that I waited 6 months before publicizing any of the issue openly on the internet, even with my friends I avoided the topic until about late 2012. I only started an "internet campaign" of sorts because nothing I did solved the issue. Yes, I should have gone to Malaysia first, but then Singapore voluntarily initiated the assistance, which I believe was the instructions of Nikon Japan. Yes, going to the HQ was impolite, but do I have a choice when no response was received? At least 2 of my polite e-mails were subsequently ignored. I avoided any possible initial conflicts & extreme measures, but my patience simply ran out. We are all humans. I do not believe in blaming the employees of the company unless they blatantly attempt to paint a misleading picture of me & my case. This is why I still can joke with reps like Jonathan & head of the Customer Sastisfaction department in Japan. Nikon D4 issues do not end the world for me, nor Nikon, but it cannot be ignored and I must have it resolved in entirety.

Oh yes and I would very much appreciate it if you can stop insisting that i "need to grow up" and have "alot to learn"... I may be young but I certainly have much better attitude then some so called laojiaos who go to Nikon and yell at the counter staff, or brag that that move mountains by talking to so-and-so at Nikon. I know that employees have their limits. My EQ not so low.

I've had a fellow photographer dousing oil over me and humiliating my decision to purchase a D4 in public (that lasted 30 mins), and a shop-owner flaming me when I was looking at his stuff in his shop. His reason? Because he heard "alot of things from inside Nikon". I am not the best of character, but I am not an unreasonable customer.

Btw I'm appreciating your discussion with me. So I will not take anything to great offence.

IIRC, the fix was calibration of the focus points via software.

I think for the D800 this software certainly exists, based on leaked screenshots on dpreview. However I do not have evidence that it exists for the D4. Multiple reps have implied to me several times that it doesn't exist for the D4.

 

[daredevil123]

Oh yes and I would very much appreciate it if you can stop insisting that i "need to grow up" and have "alot to learn"... I may be young but I certainly have much better attitude then some so called laojiaos who go to Nikon and yell at the counter staff, or brag that that move mountains by talking to so-and-so at Nikon. I know that employees have their limits. My EQ not so low.

I've had a fellow photographer dousing oil over me and humiliating my decision to purchase a D4 in public (that lasted 30 mins), and a shop-owner flaming me when I was looking at his stuff in his shop. His reason? Because he heard "alot of things from inside Nikon". I am not the best of character, but I am not an unreasonable customer.

6 months of not getting the issue fixed... but did you ever stop and wonder that you went to the right point of contact for help/service? All this one year plus of running around and you only went to Malaysia NSC once. Your camera is a Malaysia set. MY NSC should be your first point of contact, and the point of contact you spend most time with. So who is to blame?


Just a thought - When one have to compare himself to those in the bottom of the barrel... Do you feel good about yourself when you said all that?

You have a track record of how you dealt with people, and IMHPO not precisely a very good one. Most people will not bother to tell you bad things to your face. But if you feel you are good and reasonable enough in how you are, well, good for you. I will no longer comment on your situation. I have said what I wanted to say. The rest, like people always say, is all up to you.

Best of luck.

 

[surrephoto]

Just a thought - When one have to compare himself to those in the bottom of the barrel... Do you feel good about yourself when you said all that?

You have a track record of how you dealt with people, and IMHPO not precisely a very good one. Most people will not bother to tell you bad things to your face. But if you feel you are good and reasonable enough in how you are, well, good for you. I will no longer comment on your situation. I have said what I wanted to say. The rest, like people always say, is all up to you.

Best of luck.

Hahahaha.... I think it's good to know I'm not bottom of barrel. Yes my track record is not too good. But I believe alot of the impressions you are getting are based on the negative sides of my past "sagas". There are many directions to look at the cases.

 

[daredevil123]

Hahahaha....But I believe alot of the impressions you are getting are based on the negative sides of my past "sagas". There are many directions to look at the cases.

That is what everyone says. anyway good luck.

 

[Luminare]

Yes, it is very true. The D4 does have its attractions and distractions.

Nothing attracts beautiful people to be photographed like a D4 mounted with a big lens, especially at those free for all shoot outs with plenty of models

The other distraction that comes with it is when people stops me to take pictures of them with their own gear or for them, especially in foreign cities. I get plenty of those requests off and on. :sticktong

Most of the time I find it is the fellow photographers that have avoided me. I don't really know why? Is it the D4? Perhaps.:angel:

I have thought of getting a smaller FX camera for my usual travel walkabouts. The D600 / D800 issues are giving me a pause for the moment. So I am still sticking with my D700 / D5100 for the time being.

As for surrephoto, I do hope you will find an amiable solution, have the D4 to be fixed and working to its full potential again.

Technically the problem is the same as the D800/E left AF point focus issue.

Any CS members here care to share on what was the actual fix on their D800/E by NSC. Just parts replaced or just AF sensor offset calibration or both? I am just curios.

I was told at the point of collection that the fix was point calibration via software

 

[Light Machinery]

All right. I see. So just the software calibration for the AF points is able to solve the left AF point issue on D800/E.

Thanks for the info Luminare & Daredevil123!

 

[Luminare]

Just chipping in as a general info for all readers regardless if they own the D4/D800 or other bodies.

When testing with any lens wide open, please also be reminded of the MTF performance of the lens.

Just an example. In this case, with my Fav and workhouse lens, the 14-24mm f/2.8G
The MTF as linked
AF-S NIKKOR 14-24mm f/2.8G ED from Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 14-24mm f/2.8G ED from Nikon

The sides are softer than the center and this is clearly expressed in the MTF graph.
If one is shooting with either side of the sensor array, we are also looking at the AF point on the lens area away from the center and the picture can be soft. When it is soft with a thin DoF, it becomes harder to determine if it is soft or if it is out of focus for those without a trained eye.

 

[surrephoto]

Just chipping in as a general info for all readers regardless if they own the D4/D800 or other bodies.

When testing with any lens wide open, please also be reminded of the MTF performance of the lens.

Just an example. In this case, with my Fav and workhouse lens, the 14-24mm f/2.8G
The MTF as linked
AF-S NIKKOR 14-24mm f/2.8G ED from Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 14-24mm f/2.8G ED from Nikon

The sides are softer than the center and this is clearly expressed in the MTF graph.
If one is shooting with either side of the sensor array, we are also looking at the AF point on the lens area away from the center and the picture can be soft. When it is soft with a thin DoF, it becomes harder to determine if it is soft or if it is out of focus for those without a trained eye.

This is true... for cases of lower megapixel bodies, the 14-24 can be considered usable even with a body with the left AF issue. However one must be prepared that if one uses the left side points, some of the things infront of the intended point of focus will not be as sharp as normally expected. I just change to live view mode and AF, slower but won't be affect by the left AF issue. But this is unacceptable as a work around when things are fast paced.

 

[Light Machinery]

Hi guys & gals. Good evening.

Shot these with the updated firmware. Looks surreal or it is some thing new from Nikon?

Besides night walks , I like to shoot flowers at the gardens too.


D4S_8749 by Light Machinery, on Flickr


D4S_8859 by Light Machinery, on Flickr


D4S_8841 by Light Machinery, on Flickr

 

[zoom3]

Hi guys & gals. Good evening.

Shot these with the updated firmware. Looks surreal or it is some thing new from Nikon?

Besides night walks , I like to shoot flowers at the gardens too.

So this is the "appear more three dimensional” aspect of the latest firmware ??? :bsmilie:

 

[Light Machinery]

hahaha, no idea man...

It has always looked 2d to me.

 

[daredevil123]

So this is the "appear more three dimensional” aspect of the latest firmware ??? :bsmilie:

I find with 1.05 firmware, micro contrast seems slightly better.. much akin to adding a tad of clarity in LR.