Clones For Flaming.

[Klose]

I saw nothing wrong with what DP had posted. He was straight and to the point. Id kill for C&C like that. If people cant take what he has to say, then IMO they shouldnt be posting.

As for clones for flaming, well that just brings a whole new meaning to lame!

I have been emphasizing this alot of times, we lack storng solid critique here and when we have them; forumers tend to bash them citing the rude element. DP's critique is a nail to the head, he doesnt beat around the bush and give pathetic & weak comments. He's able to see the flaws that most people don't and puts it in a way that makes the photographer think and reflect. However, most of the "snapshot" & "pro" & "nice" lovers are too numbskulled to interpret that - They just want people to say good things instead of pointing out the flaws.

DP once gave me a hell of a licking when I posted my first model series but after reading through his comments couple of times, I understood what he saw and improved on them.

For the clones, they are just too scared to have their main accounts banned and thus create clones. Weaklings.

 

[Hexlord]

Lol.. DP may have said some pretty harsh stuff, but that doesn't really justify those remarks by the 'new members'.

Thanks evenstar for taking the time to quote some of the juicier remarks being made by them.

 

[wildstallion]

I have been emphasizing this alot of times, we lack storng solid critique here and when we have them; forumers tend to bash them citing the rude element. DP's critique is a nail to the head, he doesnt beat around the bush and give pathetic & weak comments. He's able to see the flaws that most people don't and puts it in a way that makes the photographer think and reflect. However, most of the "snapshot" & "pro" & "nice" lovers are too numbskulled to interpret that - They just want people to say good things instead of pointing out the flaws.

DP once gave me a hell of a licking when I posted my first model series but after reading through his comments couple of times, I understood what he saw and improved on them.

For the clones, they are just too scared to have their main accounts banned and thus create clones. Weaklings.

I completely agree with you. I would love to see DP comenting on some of my shots because I want to improve! People who cannot take strong critique will not go far in this field. There is a time for arrogence and then there is a time for complatency. Choose wisely!

Sometimes, me especially here, we look to closely at are images and cant step away and look at the whole picture. This is what DP does, and so brilliantly. Is able to point out flaws we didnt even think of. Why would you want to try and shoot someone down who has the ability to help you out so much?

It just makes no sense to me.

 

[Klose]

Lol.. DP may have said some pretty harsh stuff, but that doesn't really justify those remarks by the 'new members'.

Thanks evenstar for taking the time to quote some of the juicier remarks being made by them.

It's like the boss going up to you and saying your presentation sucks in front of the clients rather than waiting for them(clients) to leave and telling you that. It hurts the ego but it gets things done.

 

[wildstallion]

It's like the boss going up to you and saying your presentation sucks in front of the clients rather than waiting for them(clients) to leave and telling you that. It hurts the ego but it gets things done.

I like that analogy :thumbsup:

 

[student]

This is a little OT, but I think related to some things said here.

Photogs in CS are at different "levels", and have different requirements.

Setting the "foundation" of "good photography" is always recommended, like teaching kindergarten kids to be able to spell and write.

And frankly, what DP said with regards to images are generally appropriate and "mainstream", especially for beginners. I believe there are few who will disagree with that.

What people are objecting to is not the substance of what DP said, but his delivery. To say that the end justify the means is not something which many will agree to. And hence the animosity created by DP's less than elegant delivery "style" (wonder what type of poetry he writes - if any!)

There are many ways to instruct and correct. Some are gentle and persuade. Others are harsh and direct. Amongst the latter ones (harsh and direct) there are those who could do so without hurting. But there are those who hurts. And DP belongs to the latter ones. Whether he intended to or not is another matter. Personally I do not believe DP sets out to hurt. But it comes across that way.

As for me, I do not have the "benefit" of such wonderful critiques as given by DP. So therefore my images are full of things DP does not like!

Having said that, let me say something. Right from the beginning, I was directed in a totally different manner.

And frankly, even though the substance of what DP gave out is "mainstream", I am not interested in the type of critiques he gave out, even to beginners. If one, even a beginner, comes to me for critiques, my comments will be different. Very different.

And I am glad for that!

 

[Deadpoet]

Dr. C and I will forever not see eye to eye, which is fine, and perhaps a blessing.

he does not particular like my style of photography, and likewise, I feel the same for his work. Maybe his work is so brilliant that I cannot appreciate, that is absolutely fine. I like what I enjoy. Others I do not care.

What I cater to are photographer like myself, who likes to shoot portrait, in a much more straight forward manner. If Dr. C insists that these are mainstream, kindergarden, beginners stuff, so be it. This iw what I like and what I am good in. And I comment to the that I know best. You really cannot teach running before teaching walking.

As I said the the Colleen thread, I do not see too many real critics in CS. Dr. C, other than picking on my posts sometimes, do not criticise much. Neither do most of my detractors and trolls. Well, trolls and cloned trolls, they usually have nothing much to say. Very few people offer critics and real comments here, other than what I will generalise as "pro and nice" statements. Such statements made me want to throw up in 99% of the time.

As far as my lanugage goes, hey, well, I am not changing. My style of commentary suits some people and turn some people offs. So be it. The very cheesy "pro and nice" comments turns me off too.

Back the the Colleen comment I made. I really wnat to know, how was I insulting? I admit my comments on Tuck Loong's post regarding his 300D and Broncolor statements maybe a bit harsher, but if he did not his original excuse of why he is shooting with a 300D in the first place, have my detractors thought about that?

However to my detractors and trolls, cloned or not, it really does not matter I say.

I was really disappointed that the thread was removed. I do not belive Tuck Loong can do that himself. It has to be a decision by the Admin. I really wished everyone had the opportunity to read through the exchanges. Oh, I am not saying I was a boy scout. I am far from one, BUT, I have never start a personal fight. however, I will guaranty everyone that if someone becomes too personal, I will dish it back with interests and some more.

That said, I think the lowest of lows are the cloned trolls.

 

[roygoh]

some details i managed to salvge before the thread disappeared..

Hm...how do you save such information on your local PC? Seems like I must learn from you.

Anyway, thanks for the information. I could not find the thread at all, and the only possibility is that it has been physically deleted by a mod or admin. I will check with the team. The TS does not have the permission to physically delete a thread. He can only "soft" delete it and that will be tracable by the mods and admins.

Anyway, I think enough has been said about DP's style of giving critique. No offence to anyone, but let's not turn this thread into another such discussion. Just accept that you can either love or hate his critiques, but no amount of "critiques" on his style of critique will change him.

Let me state again, the CS terms of use do not allow multiple nicks, but that does not mean that the mods and admins have enough time to go through every single account to deregister clone accounts. If you have reasons to believe that a clone account has been used maliciously please report to the mods or admins via PM. We do not encourage members to go around accusing someone publicly as clones. Simple reasons: it creates a lot of unecessary arguments and you could be very embarassed if you were proven wrong. This has happened before.

The main reason for deregistering Manfrotto's account is violation of CS terms of use (clone account and personal attacks).

 

[Cheesecake]

Hm...how do you save such information on your local PC? Seems like I must learn from you.

Anyway, thanks for the information. I could not find the thread at all, and the only possibility is that it has been physically deleted by a mod or admin. I will check with the team. The TS does not have the permission to physically delete a thread. He can only "soft" delete it and that will be tracable by the mods and admins.

Anyway, I think enough has been said about DP's style of giving critique. No offence to anyone, but let's not turn this thread into another such discussion. Just accept that you can either love or hate his critiques, but no amount of "critiques" on his style of critique will change him.

Let me state again, the CS terms of use do not allow multiple nicks, but that does not mean that the mods and admins have enough time to go through every single account to deregister clone accounts. If you have reasons to believe that a clone account has been used maliciously please report to the mods or admins via PM. We do not encourage members to go around accusing someone publicly as clones. Simple reasons: it creates a lot of unecessary arguments and you could be very embarassed if you were proven wrong. This has happened before.

The main reason for deregistering Manfrotto's account is violation of CS terms of use (clone account and personal attacks).

fair enough!

thanks for the hardwork, Roy.

its indeed a wrench to have that particular thread deleted. i believe it has quite alot to offer, mainly on the functions of criticism.

 

[student]

Anyway, I think enough has been said about DP's style of giving critique. No offence to anyone, but let's not turn this thread into another such discussion. Just accept that you can either love or hate his critiques, but no amount of "critiques" on his style of critique will change him.

You are absolutely right that DP will not change.

But also remember that this will forever be a source of such repeated animosities.

 

[Deadpoet]

Deleting Manfrotto's account, well, thanks, be I will be waiting for Manfrotto2 ...3...4...

The only thing the really stop this trends is if Manfrotto is proven to be one of the more prominent CS members, said member's name should be made public.

Note to the Admin. Deleting the Colleen thread was a wrong decision. As Roy had put it so succinctly, I am not going to change, but I am not the only one dishing out harsh comments. The Colleen thread will show to all in CS, some of our esteemed members, guardian of good language, not not dish out harsh comments, but gets extremely personal and irrational too.

Anyway, water under the bridge. I just have to gear up for new clones and new trolls.

 

[Deadpoet]

You are absolutely right that DP will not change.

But also remember that this will forever be a source of such repeated animosities.

Really, Dr. C, if you think so. Are you suggesting that the Admin to ban me? To force me into the neatherworld of clones?

and are you suggesting anying casueing any animosity should be banned? Well, this may get too close for comfort.

 

[AReality]

if i recall correctly, i made some comments.
so too did Deadpoet in response to various rebukes and replies.

u failed to retrieve those?

+evenstar!

Hey, don't mind send me the whole thread if u can retrieve?
How can I miss out on such juicy stuff?


.

 

[AReality]

+evenstar!

Hey, don't mind send me the whole thread if u can retrieve?
How can I miss out on such juicy stuff?


.

I don't see manfrotto in http://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?t=204821

Should it be updated?


.

 

[roygoh]

Really, Dr. C, if you think so. Are you suggesting that the Admin to ban me? To force me into the neatherworld of clones?

and are you suggesting anying casueing any animosity should be banned? Well, this may get too close for comfort.

Aiyah...cool down man...the fact is your style of comment has indeed inspired a lot of attacks towards you, and student just said this will continue as long as you don't change. If you are not considering changing then you should also accept that the rest of the forum members won't...and we moderators get to keep out jobs.

 

[roygoh]

I don't see manfrotto in http://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?t=204821

Should it be updated?


.

No. There are many more deregistered accounts for various reasons and we do not make it a point to list every one of them in that thread.

 

[fotoudavid]

i fully agreed.

If DP changes, it will be a loss to alot of ppl here, me one of them.

I admire his ability to see so much in a pic, able to put it in such a way that ppl who kena will never forget.

Will never forget means it will haunt him/her, till they either improve it, or simply put a tag no comments pls.

Of course, DP comments may not always be right, but are not far away from it.

Log out again.

Cheers and have a gd day.

 

[student]

Really, Dr. C, if you think so. Are you suggesting that the Admin to ban me? To force me into the neatherworld of clones?

and are you suggesting anying casueing any animosity should be banned? Well, this may get too close for comfort.

I thought that you are capable of logical thinking. I was wrong. Very wrong!

Do you deny that your style provokes animosity? Yes or no?

If yes, do you think these kinds of fights will recur?

 

[student]

Aiyah...cool down man...the fact is your style of comment has indeed inspired a lot of attacks towards you, and student just said this will continue as long as you don't change. If you are not considering changing then you should also accept that the rest of the forum members won't...and we moderators get to keep out jobs.

Thank you!

This is another prime example of a person looking for a fight!

He wants to be harsh. Be prepared that others will dish out similar medicine to him!

 

[Deadpoet]

I thought that you are capable of logical thinking. I was wrong. Very wrong!

Do you deny that your style provokes animosity? Yes or no?

If yes, do you think these kinds of fights will recur?

Student, really, at the end of the day, you get the honor, you are the one and only here in CS that I really despise. Why, because you are the one who absolutely cannot stand anyone disagreeing with you, you are the one who always twist and turn other people's words, and you are about the most insecure person I ever know.

Let me take it apart one by one.

First of all, about your photography which I do not understand. I told you so, and you really dont like the fact that so regular joe who shoots beauty and glamour shots can think that way about your images. I do find your work absolutely bewilldering, but that is my problem, not yours. I choose to not try to understand your work, because to me you have nothing to offer. However, this is art and art has many interpretation. While you professed to understand this important point, you don't practice it at all. You must be right all the time, don't you. The sad thing is, you could have been a decent to good photographer.

You are one of the best word smith here on CS. However, you have done over to the dark side. You twist words better than any of us. Our exchange was as follow:

You said in your reply to Roy, and I quote, "You are absolutely right that DP will not change.
But also remember that this will forever be a source of such repeated animosities".

My reply to you and I quote, "Really, Dr. C, if you think so. Are you suggesting that the Admin to ban me? To force me into the neatherworld of clones?
And are you suggesting anyone casueing any animosity should be banned? Well, this may get too close for comfort."

Any you question my ability of logical thinking? How? How was my thought illogical? You agreed that I won't be changing, and you highlighted to the administration of this site that I will continue to be a source of repeated animosities. Well, how should I interpret your statement, given our long history?

Of course, Dr. C, other than myself, you are causing just as much animosity than anyone else here. At the very least, mine is becasue my harsh comments on posted images. Yours, usually becasue you are picking a fight with someone, just becuase you geel you are superior.

I for one will not want you to go away. Why? The world is big enough for all of us. Unfotuantely, you don't feel the same way.

Dr. C, you feel threaten by anyone who has a real opinion, anyone whose opinion differ than yours. You are a person who had already achieved alot, may I assume that you are a very successful and esteemed physician? You could become a good photographer too. What I do not understand is, why on earth are you so insecure?

Sorry Roy, I think I am going to keep you busy for a long time to come.