WHATS NEXT FOR M43, after Olympus, what future is left?

[Pitachu]

The terms of the agreement is "transfer 95% shares of the Imaging Division" to JIP, but in any case, JIP still have committed to service the liabilities of the Imaging Division as well as making the business viable by now being able to charge certain expenses eg. R&D to the parent Olympus company which previously it is may not be able to. After all, the Olympus Imaging Division have also been providing all the R&D for Olympus Medical Imaging products. And I wouldn't doubt that the transfer is an opportunity to remove a lot of "dead wood" in the company.

As explained many times, 1% of market share is actually a significant amount and sufficient to keep a camera manufacturer going eg. Ricoh, Pentax, Leica etc.
It was never Olympus aim or fanancial capability to gain a significant market share like Canon, Nikon or Sony.

Photographers should be glad that M43 is around, as it serves as a good halfway point between Full Frame and Compact cameras with 1" sensors. All the 3 major camera manufacturers (Canon, Nikon, Sony) have to date no really committed to the APS cameras. Just look at the lens available for their APS cameras, it is really pathetic. Compare it to the range of M43 lenses available from Panasonic and Olympus.

Without M43, anyone want a smaller format, would have to content with 1" sensor cameras!!!

Actually JIP did not have to throw any money when the Olympus Camera Division was "sold" to them.

This is a quote from admin of photorumours.com.
The emphasis color font and bolfd face is by me.
Quote {
That’s right. The news out of Japan is that this is NOT a sale, but a divestment at loss. Olympus will have to pay JIP to take imaging, basically giving them the consumer patent portfolio in exchange. The reason for the press release is Olympus has to divulge now that it will be paying cash for JIP to take the assets. That warns shareholders. This was. OT a bout the loyal consumer. Anyone who thinks this is a deep pockets investor seeking a new product line, or this is an “under new management” improvement needs to know exactly what JIP is as a company. They exist to help Olympus get rid of their consumer Imaging portfolio entirely.
} UnQuote

Why? Look at the losses suffered for so long.
Olympus Camera Division was a hot potato that the parent company could not wait to get rid of.
Even the OM1 (and some lenses) were products already created under the R&D of Olympus Camera Division before winding up.


But all this is water under the bridge. Now is 2024.
Has OMDS succeeded to increase world wide market share from less than 1% to say for example, 25%?
No.


Credit: photorumors.com

 

[ricohflex]

Right now an OMDS ambassador is conducting a live YouTube session.
The title is
Lumix is going CRAZY? - RED (HOT) Talk EP50

My opinion is that Lumix is waking up and realising that Full Frame is the future. And thus is not crazy.

This ambassador keeps talking about how much he likes Nikon ZF, a Full Frame DSC.
Maybe he is hinting to Nikon.
Maybe considering Leaving a sinking ship (MFT). Cannot blame them. It is a job. They earn a living.

 

[one eye jack]

Nikkei says digital camera penetration has fallen below 50% and smartphones has risen in Japanese households.

Thread views have crossed 105k.

It just a click bait title, @ricohflex.

@1:07:20

 

[Pitachu]

@ricohflex Don't be imprisoned by "Full Frame is the future" mindset.
Fullframe may be the way to go for professionals as it is currently the most practical format to deliver professional quality.
BUT, don't forget why mobile phones took over most of the camera market.
AND don't forget cameras like the Fujifilm X100vi, which sold millions during pre-order.

It is not the sensor format, it is what people want.
Full Frame is NOT the NO.1 priority for most people. Just ask 10 people randomly what they want if they were to buy a camera. Almost everyone tell me their phone camera is good enough. Someone in my family just asked me about the Sony RX100vii (compact camera) and the RX10iv (1 in sensor).

Telling everyone Full Frame is the future and other formats are sinking ship is like ordering Michelin Star meals for every single meal, even when you feel like just having a coffee with a friend. LOL.

Right now an OMDS ambassador is conducting a live YouTube session.
The title is
Lumix is going CRAZY? - RED (HOT) Talk EP50

My opinion is that Lumix is waking up and realising that Full Frame is the future. And thus is not crazy.

This ambassador keeps talking about how much he likes Nikon ZF, a Full Frame DSC.
Maybe he is hinting to Nikon.
Maybe considering Leaving a sinking ship (MFT). Cannot blame them. It is a job. They earn a living.

 

[ricohflex]

Vahagraphy forgot to mention Robin Wong as one of the frustrated and angry influencers not invited by Lumix.
For the luxurious all expenses paid tour to Japan.
Some of what Vahagraphy said makes sense. Especially about the inherent corruption involving social media influencers.

Those who were not invited by Lumix are not angry because of their righteous indignation + moral high ground.
Those who were not invited by Lumix are angry because they had no chance to partake in the corrupt Quid Pro Quo.
FOC Luxurious trip <=> Flattery of new camera product.

In digital photography/videography, technology advances so rapidly that the once dominant manufacturers are now pale shadows of their former grandeur.

Both the now defunct Olympus Camera Division & Panasonic Lumix failed to capitalize on a 10 year head start from 2008 to 2018.
They failed to popularize and sell very big numbers of MFT products - to build a giant user base.
Both forgot the mantra of Small, Light, Cheap for MFT.

Some of the MFT lenses are Very Expensive.

By stubbornly refusing to go Full Frame, Olympus handed the Prize to Sony on a silver platter.
The rest is history. Sony's meteoric rise in mirrorless full frame digital ILC scared the pants off Canon and Nikon.
(before 2018 Canon and Nikon still insisting to sell DSLRs with mirror and pentaprism)

Olympus Camera Division got wiped out. Serves them right.

If Lumix are as clever as Sony, they would quickly make a S9 Mk2.
S9 Mk2 with Full Frame sensor, 40 Megapixels, EVF, mechanical shutter, intelligent hot shoe, 2 card slots and slightly bigger body.
The main draw of S9 is the L mount.

Never mind if Lumix cannot make small lenses for the S9.
Third party lens manufacturers will do so.

By the way, I don't think much of the LUT. But that is just me.

 

[ricohflex]

He is entitled to his opinion.
As he pointed out, you cannot fit filter or lens cap on the the 26mm F8 lens.

 

[one eye jack]

Photography enthusiasts should know that it was not Olympus camera division that cause the parent company's downfall. What actually happened was a corporate culture thing and also the parent company ( top management's ) risky and reckless gamble into bad investments and their undoing was the attempts to cover up or do accounting sleight of hand. It took a British man whistle blower to expose one of the greatest fraud in Japanese corporate history.

 

[Pitachu]

Let's have a look at how fierce is the competition out there beyond niche markets.
Panasonic introduced the S9 for content creator. With a 20-60mm lenses, it is selling for U$1797 on B&H.

Sony then introduced the ZV-E10ii with 16-50 lenses (equivalent to 24 to 75mm) for US$1098 on B&H.
This is also targeted for content creators.
Resolution for both is 24mp to 26mp. S9 is Full Frame, Sony is APSC.

As a content creator, which one would you choose. Have a look at Sony ZV-E10ii features below.
It is a no-brainer for me. I get a camera more adaptable for content creation (eg. attaching mics etc) and save US$700 for various accessories like wireless mic etc.
This is kind of competition any manufacturer have to faced when stepping up to full frame.

This is the kind of challenge Panasonic have to face when trying to move from M43 to Full Frame.
It did had a little success with the S5, providing probably providing a more budget access to Leica L-mount lenses
BUT the equation is now very different on the S9.

OM Systems & Panasonic M43 department heads are probably glad they stay in M43 niche on (OM-1, G9ii) for Nature and Wildlife and (GH7) for Videographers )!

 

[ricohflex]

It is unfortunate for a Panasonic executive to state that the company will never make an APS-C camera.
That was said some time in the past.
He might have to eat his words. Now that Lumix concentrates on Full Frame.

For camera manufacturers who adopted Full Frame, it is a natural to also make APS-C bodies offering the same lens mount.
Sony E mount, Canon RF mount and Nikon Z mount all do that. Sony calls this the One Mount Platform.
APS-C body is cheaper and smaller. Ideal for any novice or youngster just trying out photography.

But when they are able to afford and want to try Full Frame.
It is a logical step up to buy the same brand of camera as their APS-C body.
This is a marketing concept and locks in the new camera buyer at an early stage into a particular brand's system.

MFT is too far away and too small for manufacturers to implement this concept.

Credit: pixelcraft.photo.blog

 

[Pitachu]

Panasonic made a wise choice not to sink in deeper with APS-C cameras.

Do you know the name for Canon Mirrorless APS lenses?
Do you know the name for Nikon Mirrorless APS lenses?
Most people hardly heard of them and camera shops may not even carry them?

Do you know how many Canon Mirrorless APS Lenses (RF-S) lenses are there?
Do you know how many Nikon Mirrorless APS Lenses (Z-Dx) lenses are there?
Have you heard Nikon or Canon announcing new Mirrorless APS lenses?
Do you know where there are so few? Even Canon and Nikon has no confidence in their Mirrorless APS Lenses!

Please don't give the wrong advice to your friends to buy a Mirrorless APS lenses and they end up like a clown having to buy FF lenses to use on their mirrorless body like my friend. She bought a Canon Mirrorless APS-C with a kit lenses and when she outgrew it, was shocked at how heavy and expensive the Canon Full Frame R Lenses are!!!!!!

Plus almost everyone I know who upgrade from APS-C to Full Frame found the quality of their APS-Lenses so bad on their Full Frame camera that they get rid of all their APS-C lenses!!!!

Meanwhile, M43 users like me is still happy with the super wide range of Olympus Pro Lenses, Panasonic Lenses and Pana-Leica lenses available to us since I start collecting 5 years ago. BTW, you will be hard pressed to find a APS-C camera that can match the image quality of the OM-1ii or the G9ii. Yes, not a fair comparison as they are more expensive, but the point is I continue to use all my M43 lenses after I upgrade my camera body.

Also I am not against APS-C camera. Fujifilm did a very good job and Sony quite a good job too on their lenses for their APS-Cameras, but I am against the upgrade idea of the upgrade path from APS-C to FF of the same brand.

It is unfortunate for a Panasonic executive to state that the company will never make an APS-C camera.
That was said some time in the past.
He might have to eat his words. Now that Lumix concentrates on Full Frame.

For camera manufacturers who adopted Full Frame, it is a natural to also make APS-C bodies offering the same lens mount.
Sony E mount, Canon RF mount and Nikon Z mount all do that. Sony calls this the One Mount Platform.
APS-C body is cheaper and smaller. Ideal for any novice or youngster just trying out photography.

But when they are able to afford and want to try Full Frame.
It is a logical step up to buy the same brand of camera as their APS-C body.
This is a marketing concept and locks in the new camera buyer at an early stage into a particular brand's system.

MFT is too far away and too small for manufacturers to implement this concept.

Credit: pixelcraft.photo.blog

 

[ricohflex]

For time being will need to wait and let time pass.
Monitor what happens.
How many years can they bluff? Market share is ice cold merciless. They cannot hide it forever.

In some companies, things move fast.
Others move slowly.
Some never learn until they die a corporate death.

If camera companies got money to burn and don't mind losing a lot each year, that is their problem. You don't care.
For the individual consumer, (if one is starting a new system) do not buy an obsolete sensor format, such as MFT.
MFT has no future.

Choose from a suitable full frame mirrorless ILC camera from Canon/Nikon/Sony/Lumix (full frame series)/Leica.

If just starting out on a budget, get their APS-C model first ( Canon/Nikon/Sony ).
Upgrade later to a Full Frame.

 

[Pitachu]

Er.... market share is only be relevant if you compare apple to apple.

For example, what is the point of keep pointing out the market share Full Frame to Medium & Large Format manufacturers?
or What is the point of comparing market share of Full Frame to 1" sensor cameras?
Yes, it is totally irrelevant.

M43 is actually just like a niche like 1" sensor cameras (Sony RX10iv) or Medium Format Cameras with less than 1% market share.
It is for a niche market, for users who understand their benefits. To keep banging on M43 only has 1 per cent market share and therefore no one should use it anymore is like saying everyone should also not use action cam like GoPro, Drone Cameras, 360 cameras and Medium Format Cameras, just because they are not Full Frame and have less than 1 per cent market share and will die off?

For time being will need to wait and let time pass.
Monitor what happens.
How many years can they bluff? Market share is ice cold merciless. They cannot hide it forever.

In some companies, things move fast.
Others move slowly.
Some never learn until they die a corporate death.

If camera companies got money to burn and don't mind losing a lot each year, that is their problem. You don't care.
For the individual consumer, (if one is starting a new system) do not buy an obsolete sensor format, such as MFT.
MFT has no future.

Choose from a suitable full frame mirrorless ILC camera from Canon/Nikon/Sony/Lumix (full frame series)/Leica.

If just starting out on a budget, get their APS-C model first ( Canon/Nikon/Sony ).
Upgrade later to a Full Frame.

 

[one eye jack]

The Chinese already answered people who want compact camera in m43 format and also look like Funji x100 Mk6.
For such low price, mai hiam lah ( don't be picky ).

 

[Pitachu]

There is already 2 projects (Alice and Switchlens) in Kickstarter that use M43 sensors to make cameras that uses a mobile phone screen, storage and sharing.
Logictech has also released a web streaming camera using M43.

Besides Logitech start ups, techie geeks can also build their own cameras with M43 sensors, see url below.

All this can be good news for M43, as all these cameras need M43 lenses, which will help to grow the eco-system of lenses for M43 cameras.

For hackers: FourThirdsEye Opensource Micro Four Thirds camera module based on IMX294 – 43 Rumors

www.43rumors.com

 

[one eye jack]

From the comment section of article linked'

• Diversion a day ago
  This is not just a simple DIY project. You can't order the PCB with sensor anywhere so you'll have to find a provider for the sensor, board, components and soldering.
  The only 3d print file provided for a mount so far is E-mount.

My advice: Go talk to the people that made the cheap x100 clone. They have the where-with- all to put together such a camera. Amateurs only have plastic 3d printing. The Chinese have real metal machining workshops and the electronic engineers to make the guts of the camera.

There is already 2 projects (Alice and Switchlens) in Kickstarter that use M43 sensors to make cameras that uses a mobile phone screen, storage and sharing.
Logictech has also released a web streaming camera using M43.

Besides Logitech start ups, techie geeks can also build their own cameras with M43 sensors, see url below.

All this can be good news for M43, as all these cameras need M43 lenses, which will help to grow the eco-system of lenses for M43 cameras.

For hackers: FourThirdsEye Opensource Micro Four Thirds camera module based on IMX294 – 43 Rumors

www.43rumors.com

 

[Pitachu]

Just came across an article on how a photographer became a OM System Ambassador, the reasons why and how is he being rewarded.
This is inline with what I heard from local photographers who have helped to promote Olympus.

Reasons to Jump to Micro Four Thirds: We Review the System and the OM-1

The tired arguments against the Micro Four Thirds (MFT) standard are obsolete and rarely voiced now. Furthermore, the release of the OM-1 a year ago has seen a massive migration to the system, and for good reason. Many consider giving their creativity a boost by swapping to an MFT camera. To...

fstoppers.com

 

[ricohflex]

Here is a comment by a person in another forum, about ambassadors.
Vermont3133
Quote {
Sorry, these guys are basically spin doctors.
What do they do? They sign contracts with camera companies and get paid to promote their gear.
They do their job when they convince us poor suckers that they are really on our side and do honest reviews of their employer's cameras/lenses.
I find most of them quite irritating .
} UnQuote

As to the claims of not being paid.
Well maybe for those who are already Billionaires and who decide they wish to be an ambassador.
As for the other 99.9% ambassadors, don't trust them when they tell you that they are not paid.

I think there are indeed REWARDS in one form or another.
You can be paid in a zillion ways.
Not necessarily in Cash $ notes directly.

For example, it can in the form of a titanium bicycle "gift". Just saying.

If an ambassador is a writer for a magazine/website, then the camera company can take out EXPENSIVE advertisements in that magazine/website.
And make it known to the ambassadors' employers that they are doing so because so&so is an ambassador for their camera company.

If an ambassador is also a photographer who takes assignments, then the camera company can give the ambassador several Lucrative photo contracts to him for photo assignments.

There are so many ways one can get PAID, without being upfront about it.

I think most ambassadors choose to become one - only if there are rewards.

For example, ambassadors can get invited to frequent All Expenses Paid Very Expensive Photo Tours/Talks to exotic locations.
5 times a year of this can mean ambassadors get the equivalent of $500,000 luxury each year. In addition to their other rewards.
What is not to like?

They are indirect employees/workers. It is a JOB.
If they do not do a good job of flattering the company's camera/lenses products, they get fired by their boss (camera company).
Whenever you surf the YouTube channel of a Malaysian ex-ambassador (hint), you sense the suffering ex-ambassadors go through.

 

[one eye jack]

@ricohflex, he has moved on. Does he look like he is suffering?

 

[Pitachu]

@ricohflex, wow so much imagination.
Which of the M43 ambassadors you know work for magazines (and have expensive advertisement packages).
Magazines are all dying, and even websites like dpreview.com are struggling to look for advertisers.

$500,000 worth of luxury holidays a year? Can you name any brands that lunch cameras 5 times a year?
And each time has a holiday worth $100,000? What kind of holiday? Presidential Suites. LOL??????
You really think Panasonic or even Sony / Canon has the ability to cough out $500K per influencer per year?

Anyway, the hotels the influencers get to stay during the Panasonic S9 launch in Osaka are just standard business class hotels, nothing luxurious.

And please don't keep calling us suckers? You mean you have been a sucker? Did you sell off all your gears of one brand and switch to another brand just because of a few youtube videos? Of course everyone will do their research, ask their trusted friends or camera shops, try out the equipment first before buying. For example, I rented Sony and Fujifilm equipment to test them out before purchasing.

Here is a comment by a person in another forum, about ambassadors.
Vermont3133
Quote {
Sorry, these guys are basically spin doctors.
What do they do? They sign contracts with camera companies and get paid to promote their gear.
They do their job when they convince us poor suckers that they are really on our side and do honest reviews of their employer's cameras/lenses.
I find most of them quite irritating .
} UnQuote

As to the claims of not being paid.
Well maybe for those who are already Billionaires and who decide they wish to be an ambassador.
As for the other 99.9% ambassadors, don't trust them when they tell you that they are not paid.

I think there are indeed REWARDS in one form or another.
You can be paid in a zillion ways.
Not necessarily in Cash $ notes directly.

For example, it can in the form of a titanium bicycle "gift". Just saying.

If an ambassador is a writer for a magazine/website, then the camera company cam take out EXPENSIVE advertisements in that magazine/website.
And make it known to the ambassadors' employers that they are doing so because so&so is an ambassador for their camera company.

If an ambassador is also a photographer who takes assignments, then the camera company can give the ambassador several Lucrative photo contracts to him for photo assignments.

There are so many ways one can get PAID, without being upfront about it.

I think most ambassadors choose to become one - only if there are rewards.

For example, ambassadors can get invited to frequent All Expenses Paid Very Expensive Photo Tours/Talks to exotic locations.
5 times a year of this can mean ambassadors get the equivalent of $500,000 luxury each year. In addition to their other rewards.
What is not to like?

They are indirect employees/workers. It is a JOB.
If they do not do a good job of flattering the company's camera/lenses products, they get fired by their boss (camera company).
Whenever you surf the YouTube channel of a Malaysian ex-ambassador (hint), you sense the suffering ex-ambassadors go through.

 

[ricohflex]

It looks like Robin Wong is close to being officially named as a Nikon ambassador.
Good for him. He got a new job. We are happy for him.
Soon he can earn a living as Nikon ambassador.

I said long ago that he should dump the obsolete MFT and embrace Full Frame (any brand).
Which finally he has done. Circumstances forced him to.
{ Applause }.

He is not the only one. And why not? The old rotten obsolete MFT ship is sinking.
Lately Red35 (OMDS ambassador) has been showing A LOT of Nikon ZF in his video channel.
In his latest video Red35 grumbled that he is not making enough from YouTube camera/lens review. (hint to OMDS).

To be fair, Robin Wong did not betray Olympus/MFT. It was the other way around.
OMDS threw Robin Wong under the bus and treated him badly.
Robin Wong did relate the details in a video. The cold and dismissive way he was treated.

Do notice that in the video, from 5:43 to 6:43 Robin Wong strongly criticized the digital MFT OM-1.
While comparing it with Nikon Z6 Mk III.
I agree with his criticism of OM-1.

From 7:00 to 7:40, Robin Wong praised Nikon Z6 Mk III to the skies. Extreme superlatives. Almost to the point of effusive flattery.
( This video maybe a job interview for Nikon Ambassadorship ).

Lastly, before he is appointed Nikon ambassador, Robin Wong is still suffering.
From 7:44 to 7:48
He ask you to buy him a cup of coffee or contribute to him by PayPal.

There is 1 thing about Nikon Z6 Mk III that maybe Robin Wong missed.
The new Nikon Z mount is THE MOST IMPORTANT design element.
Canon also got that right in the new R mount.

Both leave the obsolete MFT mount in the dust.