Thread for Lumix FZ18 and FZ28 Series
- Thread starter ombre
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I posted this in the newbie forum, but I guess this is the thread i'm most attached to here! So repost here!
Hi guys, you may call me a freak, but I spent some time thinking and invented a mathematical formula for calculating the amount of pixel blur you will get. This is the most simplified (usable) version I have been able to come up with... (my first one had like 12 variables :S)
I'm personally not sure if anyone has done a similar math on this, I haven't found it anywhere so yea. =) (can I call it the Ombre's formula for photography blurs? haha) Please do let me know if anyone came up with something similar.
So anyway, just to share with you guys what I've found. C&C welcome. =) Just for disclaimers, I don't study mathematics. (not anymore at least)
B = fxsR / (d - f)
B = Pixels of Blur
x = object speed
s = shutter speed
R = Pixels per metre of sensor
d = distance from subject
f = lens focal length
So how much shutter speed is really needed to "freeze motion"? Say a sports man is running on a field at 4m/s, (this is about running 2.4km in 10 minutes), and you're using a 55-250 IS (handshake blurs are not taken into account). Target is 50m from you.
If you shot at 1/400s shutter speed, the pixels of blur will be 7.82289~ pixels. =) (this is calculation for 350D 8mp sensor).
Perfect accuracy of the formula is not entirely guaranteed, because the distance between your lens and sensor may vary slightly. But this should be negligible with the formula. (at this point i'm not sure).
=) Cheers.
Hi guys, you may call me a freak, but I spent some time thinking and invented a mathematical formula for calculating the amount of pixel blur you will get. This is the most simplified (usable) version I have been able to come up with... (my first one had like 12 variables :S)
I'm personally not sure if anyone has done a similar math on this, I haven't found it anywhere so yea. =) (can I call it the Ombre's formula for photography blurs? haha) Please do let me know if anyone came up with something similar.
So anyway, just to share with you guys what I've found. C&C welcome. =) Just for disclaimers, I don't study mathematics. (not anymore at least)
B = fxsR / (d - f)
B = Pixels of Blur
x = object speed
s = shutter speed
R = Pixels per metre of sensor
d = distance from subject
f = lens focal length
So how much shutter speed is really needed to "freeze motion"? Say a sports man is running on a field at 4m/s, (this is about running 2.4km in 10 minutes), and you're using a 55-250 IS (handshake blurs are not taken into account). Target is 50m from you.
If you shot at 1/400s shutter speed, the pixels of blur will be 7.82289~ pixels. =) (this is calculation for 350D 8mp sensor).
Perfect accuracy of the formula is not entirely guaranteed, because the distance between your lens and sensor may vary slightly. But this should be negligible with the formula. (at this point i'm not sure).
=) Cheers.
just curious to ask abt this.... I seen some photos of LX3 and FZ50....particularly portraits.. tt are v sharp(may appear over sharpened to some) and love this effect but so far I seen none from FZ18 n FZ28. No offence but is this a characteristic of some Lumix models or rather more to the user settings? I am hopin to get a superzoom with such sharpness so need to clarify :angel:
skyguy
Senior Member
i think its more of the setting... and maybe even the post processing of image...
pls view post number 259 and 243 of this thread... a good example will be the bird one the bird one.. with zoom and still so sharp, coz sometime when i am at full zoom it won't be able to give that sharpness due to lighting or setting... i think its quite sharp already... maybe u would like to post some sample or the link also... like maybe we can see how sharp it should be...
skyguy
Senior Member
depend wat type and design of the hard case i believe... hmm... its like the type tat will be on ur camera even when u are taking photo... i might consider..
actually think about it, it might be difficult to change the batt... so most probaly won't get it
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Clunk
New Member
Hi Guys, thinking about getting a monopod, for shooting macro, much easier to manouver in amongst shrubs and bushes and easier to move in and out for focusing. Can get a Manfrotto790B for $57 here or should I wait and get one in Singapore in about 3 weeks. I have a Slik U6000 tripod that is lightweight for travelling that I am using with legs in like monopod. What are your thoughts, do you find a monopod useful for other types of shooting?
Hi Kennmail, were you from the S8100 forum? I remember seeing you somewhere. Anyway, let me try to answer this question about sharpness. FZ18 and 28 is a really really sharp camera, I'm surprise that you haven't seen good pictures. Ok let me correct that, maybe the sensors aren't that good, but the Leica lens is about top of the line. Truthfully, FZ50 and FZ18 should essentially be the same lens, LX3 is also made by Leica, I don't expect the difference to be that observable.
Heck! its even sharper than my lower end dSLR lenses!
Now if you were asking about sharpness in terms of background diffusion to foreground contrast, this is extremely difficult to achieve (not impossible) exceptional results with any of the prosumers. LX3 may have the advantage due to the large max aperture, however, if you have enough space, using the FZ18 at 18X zoom for a headshot definitely does the trick. But as you can see, you don't always have space for such a set up.
Settings wise matters too, obviously. The thing is FZ18/28 lose their sharpness to ISO noise easily. ISO 400 and you're totally gone. Don't expect any different on LX3, it uses the same sensor as FZ28. FZ50 should be abit worse I assume, it has a older processor.
So if you want to keep the sharpness, keep the ISO down, turn off the Noise reduction completely. If you find it necessary, push the sharpness up to +2. I think we have enough pictures around to prove its worth =)
This decision is for you to make =) But definitely, some suggestions.
Personally, if I get a monopod, it must always be able to reach my full standing height. A short monopod does little to help you travel. Imagine always having to bend to shoot. I'm not sure about the manfrotto 790B's height. Price seems ok though, however does it come with a head? you may be incurring extra costs that you don't see. Most high end pods don't ship with a head. (which can cost about the price of the pod)
However, for FZ18, I would skip the high end monopods unless you are going to get a dSLR anytime soon. I have an Excell monopod that I bought for 40 bux. reaches about 1.8 meters max, and it holds up to 3 kg very sturdily, takes my heavy dSLR+ lenses very well.
As for tripod vs monopod, it all depends on the weight you want to carry. If you dont mind carrying a tripod, then getting a monopod is useless, you can continue using just 1 leg of the tripod. Infact using 2 legs is one of my favorite setups, like a Bi-pod, and you can hold on to the 3rd un-extended leg to control the camera, or press it against your body for support.
jim_mcgill
New Member
Hi Friend,
You can check out the image quality of DCR-250 with FZ18 below. It was taken by one of our clients. See if it is the quality you are talking about. Of course skill level of the user plays a part too.
http://cgi.ebay.com.sg/RAYNOX-Macro...ZLH_DefaultDomain_216?_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116
Cheers,
Jim, McGill
24-Hour Hotline: 6389-1734
here are my humble shots of water droplets taken by my fz18. no pp done. pics are really sharp just that like what ombre said, when u bump up the iso and noise reduction kicks in, many details are lost. so just try to keep iso noise reduction low as possible.
The shape of the water droplets are simply stunning! I almost won't believe an FZ18 did this! Excellent work. Did you use flash?
yup. used a white pouch as a diffuser.
Ah I see, nicely done. =)
Clunk
New Member
Hi ombre, have just been reading your thread in Newbies Corner, well done.
It is amazing the respone you got, in some cases I think you really touched a nerve. There were some very opinionated and quite blunt replies. You kept your cool and articulated your argument very well. In some ways I was thinking it was like trying to have a reasonable discussion with a religious zealot, an exercise in total futility.
In Aust we have V8 supercars (touring cars) that travel around the country holding race meets in each capital city. I had a student inform me that he was going to be absent from a lab experiment because he was going to the qualifying races on the Friday before the big race. I told him it was an important experiment he was going to miss and would be reflected on his report card. He responded with "Dun matter to me Sir, I hate Science and anything to do with Science" and off he went to watch his car race. I think that day Sir Isaac Newton rolled over in his grave.
I wonder if that boy is a CSer, could very well be!:think:
It is amazing the respone you got, in some cases I think you really touched a nerve. There were some very opinionated and quite blunt replies. You kept your cool and articulated your argument very well. In some ways I was thinking it was like trying to have a reasonable discussion with a religious zealot, an exercise in total futility.
In Aust we have V8 supercars (touring cars) that travel around the country holding race meets in each capital city. I had a student inform me that he was going to be absent from a lab experiment because he was going to the qualifying races on the Friday before the big race. I told him it was an important experiment he was going to miss and would be reflected on his report card. He responded with "Dun matter to me Sir, I hate Science and anything to do with Science" and off he went to watch his car race. I think that day Sir Isaac Newton rolled over in his grave.
I wonder if that boy is a CSer, could very well be!:think:
skyguy
Senior Member
haha..is he in the race or just there to watch??... if its just there to watch, its abit wasted... maybe he is just too young to understand the importance of science... he will know it later tat even racing car have science and maths involve...
Hey thanks for the encouragement =) Skyguy too! And yea, its hard to convince people, but it will set them thinking anyways. One day it'll be applicable to them and they'll just silently accept it :bsmilie:
Its an interesting remark your student made, I'm pretty sure that there is very little in the world that Science is not involved. Science will always try to explain every single thing in the world I guess. Even a topic such as love, is scientifically explained. haha.
Hey so, we're about exactly 4 weeks away from our outing! Can we have a headcount and suggestions for where to go?! I really have no idea where to go, but anywhere is fine with me. Need a bad weather plan too...
Headcount: Clunk, Ombre, Skyguy...
Previously expressed interest: Vinze? ay? dickson?
Clunk
New Member
I am counting the days till school finishes.
I am quite happy to go where-ever you guys decide, I will be staying in Hougang and I am quite familar with finding my way around S/pore so that is not a problem.
I went to the horse races yesterday, a friend of mine is a jockey and he is up from Alice Springs for a few race meets, could not have been thinking to well because I forgot to take camera with me, might go next week.
Might go to the greyhound races next Friday night, that is always a good night here in Darwin. Although sometimes there are more dogs than patrons.:bsmilie: Will try to remember cam.
Where do other CSers have their outings? Zoo? Bird Park? (That is an ominous place for me)
Clarke Quay? Are there any events on that day?
I am sure you guys know what is best and will sort out a bad weather plan orso.
Do you want to start a thread and invite all Lumix shooters? or just keep it fairly small? FZers?:dunno:
I am quite happy to go where-ever you guys decide, I will be staying in Hougang and I am quite familar with finding my way around S/pore so that is not a problem.
I went to the horse races yesterday, a friend of mine is a jockey and he is up from Alice Springs for a few race meets, could not have been thinking to well because I forgot to take camera with me, might go next week.
Might go to the greyhound races next Friday night, that is always a good night here in Darwin. Although sometimes there are more dogs than patrons.:bsmilie: Will try to remember cam.
Where do other CSers have their outings? Zoo? Bird Park? (That is an ominous place for me)
Clarke Quay? Are there any events on that day?
I am sure you guys know what is best and will sort out a bad weather plan orso.
Do you want to start a thread and invite all Lumix shooters? or just keep it fairly small? FZers?:dunno:
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