thinking of others

[Sion]

I dun see real pros with fantastic work replying here cuz they behave like a pro.. unliike these unpros people..

And I am pretty sure why are these "pros" replying and overeacting to my budget because of their rice bowls. Their work are as good as the budding photographers who are kindly offering me. So, "pros", be scared, be VERY scared!!

Cuz your work ain't good enough..

And please, if I really WANT to scrimp and save for myself in a once in a lifetime event, I'm nuts! I NEED to! If I have the money I would have sign up with a good bridal studio like Tan Yoong who ties up with Chris Ling. Pre wedding + AD photography, 2 fantastic gowns, etc etc @ $5K. I won't even need to ask.

I rather talk to my son.. Cuz he listens and understands better than the gorwn ups here.

I suggest you watch your tongue posting in CS. You are running down some of the respectable members here.

If you do not have any interest in photography except looking for some el cheapo wedding photographers I suggest you leave this photo forum.

Please refrain from insinuating the poor standard of the "pros" you so termed here. You and I have not seen enough of their works to pass any judgement let alone your and my ability to be able to do so.

By the way I am earning a living through photography fortunately not in wedding photography and thankfully not have to deal with a client like you.

The end.

 

[bride2be]

I believe that it was not an assumption but a question, so now it is only you who looks like an ...

If it is a question there won't be like, "200 for 6 hours?!" I did not say $200/nett for 6 hours flat.

and i am only having a discussion with fellow photographers about the industry, you only just happen to be an example. I would call it being there at the wrong place and at the wrong time, but there were other b4 you, so you are not alone.c...

Oh, how unlucky and unfair life can be?? :dunno:

did you explain your situation to us? No, but history tells us that couple who have no budget for photography has spent it all on a nice 5 star hotel banquet.

Do I HAVE the DUTY to explain? All I know is I only have less then 1K to get my wedding done because the old folks insisted to invite the relatives. And btw, it's a $20/head buffet

so did you go to get a manicure professionally done? Hair? Makeup? Made new gown?

Sadly, never been to mani/pedi but loaned nail polishes from my sister. Haven't cut my hair for a year. Don't have budget to get own cosmetics. And a $30/- dress for my big day.

what happened to him? I would suppose that he would love to shoot for you again.

He does professional children photography.

ah... interesting things if your mother goes to the market and asked the stall owner for 2 whole chicken for $5, will the stall holder be insulted? you tell me

farmer? eggs? hen? wah you need to calm down, you might get high blood pressure

If your mother demanded for free chicken liver it would be "lose face", shameless is too strong a word for this example. Because in the first place she has no right to demand. Insulting the whole chicken industry.... wah i dunno man
Why does she bargain? to pay less money i guess.

But we are not talking about mothers and chicken industries, the money saved will not go to making the family life better, it would be going to other luxuries.

The stall owner will not be insulted, that's why. Cuz he i WILLING to sell the chix @ that price when the woman requested, not demand.
I'm calm and well.

the stand of the admin is stated already, go read it yourself.

Admin got his stand, I got my stand.
It ain't rule.
Maybe come with rule like, "people who are going to post for services need to submit pay slips, bank account info, expenses in order to judge his ability to pay."

ok rice bowls

again you need to read this tread from the start, I am not a pro
so i cannot snatch any rice bowls
i am trying to educate the young and budding photographers of their self worth.
Photographers talking to photographers, nothing to do with you..

If you ARE talking about photographers, (while others are pointing at the innocent fellow ASKING for services), please go directly to their post like, "Budget photography offered" and EDUCATE them. And I guess you got no rights to cuz you are not any sort of leader. The only thing you can do is ADVISE.
And if you are EDUCATING them, why are you replying to my posts? Getting so work up and upset?

Now i ask you, Why are you trying to exploit the young and budding photographers?

Accusation again. Are you married? kids? they're just dun get your real care and are frustrated with you. Willing parties might not be young and budding. they might be freelancer, they might be hobbyist, they might just be happy to charge low.

And again, you can't afford abalone, you force yourself to loan, strain every single cent just to get 1?

The pros do not compete in the same market, again go read from the start.
My skills would not be of interest to you as my shots are of little/no commercial value
i shoot for fun

And yes, they are of different market and value, so how do people requesting for budget photography affects the market? Affect budget market??:think:

Now you are calling the photogs who PM you shameless?
the same photogs who is going to shoot your ROM?
Wah, you are really insulting them now
you said it, not me.

Not that I call them, you aren't reading clearly instead. I'm asking IF you call me insulting, you are trying to call the kind photographers shameless. mabby too strong a word.. low ego? not educated? Come'on, if you say this dress is ugly and peopel still wears it, what are you calling them? You're insulting them indirectly.

again, read from the start. no one is stopping anyone, this is a public forum
you keep going on and on about "being less fortunate", do you need help?
There was once, I too was less fortunate. Had no money to eat lunch even.
you cannot be that bad right? you have computer and internet connection
and time to post in forums.
Anyway, i worked hard and made sure that i do something about it.
complaining will not make you any more fortunate.

Am not complaining, cuz I'm upset that I'm being accused to look for budget photographer but the fact is I can afford it? Trying to say I can't, that's why.
Computer and internet connection are not mine.
And I'm off work, why dun I have the time. I need to take care of my child so I can't work OT. I'm feeling like being questioned. OMG. Childish. But I gotta play.. Cuz people here are just too selfish.

I think you are the one that needs to grow up, photogs also have families to feed you know.
Robbing? oh that is against the law you know?
Again i repeat I do not earn my living out of photography
I am talking to other photographers about the state of the industry and what can be done about it.

Again, am I forcing anyone to take up this assignment? Why the hell can't you get facts straight?

CASE is not needed here as there were no transactions in the first place.
We are talking to one another, is that wrong? Look who is overeacting?

I'm talking about when I take up an assignment. Do you even pass your O levels? Like those question and answer thingy? I dun have to state every single detail and REPORT to you.

Wah very long story, so to cut it short, you are just an example
another person asking for free/cheap services
happen to post in the wrong place and at the wrong time
it s not personal, i have stated that in your tread
and was replying to hawaiisg and not to you.
is hawaiisg your HTB?

I am a photographer talking to other photographers about the industry
what is wrong with that?

Good luck on your ROM shoot with the photog you just called shameless.

Looking for cheap services but not demanding for. Do I need to repeat again and again or do an analysis for you to understand, dude?
You keep thinking you are right and you just dun get what others are talking about. Anything against your stand you bark like a mad dog without even going through your brain. Why are people looking for cheap photographers for an event once in a lifetime? Some might be taking advantages, but not me. If I have got the money, I would have engaged the best and not even look around.

I am a bride to be looking for someone to fit into my bill, what's wrong with that?

And again, shameless, it was a question..

 

[bride2be]

maybe it is a case of everyone is looking at the issue from different perspective?

One side of the story, the professionals (people who take photography as career), the other side the hobbyists who jumps at the opportunity to take photos of anything.

Hence once side will not do unless there is money, the other side will do even if no money.

Result? Arguements will go on and on.... and no conclusion cos both sides are looking at issue from very different perspective. And also perhaps CS is no longer the playground of pros only but we have lots of hobbyists here who dont think like pros.

I like this..

But so much are accusing and coming against me..

I understand the market value they are protecting, but is ASKING for WILLING parties due to low budget always end up this way? I'm just trying my luck here and I think it ended up a bad luck.

 

[eikin]

bride2be, if you expect people to respect you, you should respect others to begin with.

you bash into this forum with an unreasonable, yes, i mean unreasonable budget WITH RESPECT to the market norm, without any explanation whatsoever. how do you expect others to respect that? who is not understanding who? who's being selfish? do you expect the entire world to understand you? if i want to dig into matter, your HTB is a hobbyist, there's a high chance he knows what's expected of the job. which make your request seem all the more unreasonable.

please put things in perspective.

 

[bride2be]

now i really worry :sweat:
and she said that she wasn't insulting

I wonder what the 20 over forum mates will think if they know what she tought of them

Again, it was quoted..

 

[r32]

Actually fine and good that you have stated a budget so that $200 photographers step up to the plate.

You would have automatically priced those photographers who value their time more out of the candidates.

Just as long as you know that you will more likely than not get your $200-worth, if not less.

It is after all a free market economy we are in, especially one dominated by freelancers.

 

[bride2be]

please wake up lah! That statement made by the TS is only a figure of speech, not claiming that they are crazy or desperate for $$$.

That 20 over photogs are willing and that does not demean them in anyway.

Does that means those hairstylist who work in QB Cut salon charging at only $10 a hair cut are insulting themselves???

Somebody finally opened BIG eyes to read into my words.
*lol*

 

[bride2be]

Maybe ortega needs to recognize that there are bottom feeders in the sea of photographers that sell their services. The sentiment here is overwhelmingly one of avoiding exploitation, yet there are photographers quietly taking up these jobs anyway (according to bride2be, 20-odd of them).

Just accept that there would be photographers willing to work at any given price level - the results will more or less reflect the money changing hands. If the photographer is good, yet has been undercharging, he will soon raise his prices in order to make his time worthwhile. Basic human nature, and economics, that he will raise his prices to the point where his business starts to fall off.

As a member of Clubsnap I find it a bit demeaning to be associated with cheap photograpy/ers but that's the general situation here - lots of learners and hobbyists. It is inevitable that people would come in here thus looking for exactly what this forum has a lot of.

Its a little bit like the TFCD models. Some of them might be very good, yet need to build a portfolio, and there are hordes of photographers eager to get a piece of that.

It's the different piorities.
Most of the people who PMed me are just trying to earn some pocket money or build up portfolio.

Some poeple just keep on going on money money money and dun even think about seeing situations in different angles.

Prejudice and strong ego?

 

[bride2be]

bride2be, if you expect people to respect you, you should respect others to begin with.

you bash into this forum with an unreasonable, yes, i mean unreasonable budget WITH RESPECT to the market norm, without any explanation whatsoever. how do you expect others to respect that? who is not understanding who? who's being selfish? do you expect the entire world to understand you? if i want to dig into matter, your HTB is a hobbyist, there's a high chance he knows what's expected of the job. which make your request seem all the more unreasonable.

please put things in perspective.

I had a rough guideline and details will be done in PM.
Izzit wrong?

And so, after I made clear, people are still accusing me and putting words into my mouth.

 

[bride2be]

Personally I do not find it demeaning at all to be associated with "cheap" photographers. But I do find it demeaning to be associated with hypocrites.

We all start somewhere. Not everyone is blessed with rich parents. Hypothetically speaking, if I were to be passionate about my photography, and I am not particularly well-off, I would jump at the opportunity to earn just that $200.00. And I would appreciate deeply if the more established members here can kindly give me some simple advice.

I had my past. I have my present. I am now much better off. But I had my hard times.

I believe I understand those who want that $200.00. Let it be. If one is truly a "bro" (a term so frequently used here), then help those to earn that $200.00.

Would this not be another way of "Thinking of Others?"

When you are starving in a famine, any thing that is not poisionous will be good, isn't it?

And yes, certain people just dun THINK. They just think about themselves..

 

[bride2be]

setting aside only a small amount of money for the recording of these event put the couples at risk. the small sum will attract fresh photographers with little experience.

to wedding couples to be: do you really do not mind giving inexperienced photographers a chance? or are you trying to save money? if you say that the coverage need not be of high quality, do you really mean it?

i'm not saying fresh photographers cannot produce good works, but photographers who produce good works (new or old) more than often know the value of their service well enough.

Which bride or groom doesn't want to have great and realiable pictures?
Tell me about it.

It's just when you can't afford to go US to further your studies, you just gotta get it in Singapore.

Got it?

 

[bride2be]

after reading through your very long essay, i finally understood where you are coming from.

you equated the work of a budget photographer worth $200 as being equal to that produced by a working photographer.

Oh, my bad..
And your's for putting words into my mouth.

I am looking for someone to take pictures of my wedding and am not expecting anything. Just decent pictures.

And by comparison, it is a compliment to the peeps who PMed me.

 

[clicknick]

I understand the market value they are protecting, but is ASKING for WILLING parties due to low budget always end up this way?

To answer your question, YES, it always ended this way, and the TS always gets heckled left right center from the pros, frens of pros, supporters of pros, future pros, freelancers, etc. For your info, you are not the first TS asking for below market rate service to be heckled, and from the look of things in this thread, you will not be the last.

Maybe there are better forums for posting such requests.

It's strange that admins and mods frown upon "price police" crashing another person's B&S thread, but allows this in "Services wanted" thread.

 

[eikin]

bride2be, you know what is wrong? despite bringing in all the accusations and sorts, you seemingly refuse to acknowledge that you had proposed an unreasonable budget without even a brief explanation initially, which resulted in an expected flood of postings in disagreement. and then you go around accusing people of putting words into your mouth (please check your postings properly)

do you think you are right because you have all the reasons in the world to be right? are others denied of opinions about your careless posting? you are only thinking about yourself, is that not so? (and therefore the title of this thread)

anyway, here is a personal request. please do not complain about bad quality of pictures should you feel that the pictures are not good enough. if the pictures turn out well, good for you and the photographer trying to build a portfolio. good luck, and spare a thought for others.

 

[versatile]

Simple, stop ranting, go elsewhere and source your way. Instead of ranting here, might as well take the time to source for your "low-budget" photographer.

Anyway guys, give her a break. Not all are rich enough to hire a photographer. She might be "the one" that can’t afford professional ones.