Our structural problem

[JJFAM]

In perspective, the graduates here are regarded as better quality and atas, they have
higher expectations apparently. Are you a graduate yourself in SINGAPORE? Don't you feel you are in better position than foreign graduates? If you think foreign graduates are at level play here in Singapore, then what's the point of you getting a LOCAL degree?

What I'm saying is CISCO is not bothered by these people from Taiwan who are graduates. Their main concern is these so-called graduates should rightfully be competence in English, which is a mandatory factoring here as an APO. Their degrees only subjected to a limited weightage.

But, to say local graduates totally not taking up APO jobs is not true, they are APOs with degrees holding management or command positions. I have seen graduates APO at CISCO-Paya Lebar

 

[diver-hloc]

Certis-CISCO is hiring 120. Of the 15,580 cannot find 120 that meet their criteria? Or those that can find their offer sucks?

Out of that 15580... how many wishes to be working for a security agency ?? How many is of the age and fitness suitable for such a job... ahould CERTIS-CISCO lower their standard just so they could take in some of the 15580 ??

So how good should the offer be ?? $5k-$10k a month ?? Short working hours ?? Lots of benefits ?? And guess who is paying for all that... :think:

 

[UncleFai]

Out of that 15580... how many wishes to be working for a security agency ??

I don't know. Do you?

So how good should the offer be ?? $5k-$10k a month ??

Surely you are not saying that whatever the salary set by the company is the "right" one? In any case, I don't know what the 15580 expect. Do you?

Short working hours ?? Lots of benefits ?? And guess who is paying for all that... :think:

So in the name of lower cost, workers' rights and benefits don't matter?

 

[diver-hloc]

I don't know. Do you?

No... But I can bet you don't know either...

Surely you are not saying that whatever the salary set by the company is the "right" one? In any case, I don't know what the 15580 expect. Do you?

First of all, defined what is the 'Right' amount... In any open economy... all of us have a choice to accept or not accept an offer. If I think the salary is too low for the amount of hours I'm expected to work for... I could very well reject the offer... if my financial situation is dire, then I will still accept the job even if I do find the working hours long. And in this case... I do recall seeing job advertisement by security companies (not only CISCO) looking for workers alot of times looking in the major local papers... were non of 15580 reading papers ?? I don't know what those 15580 expect... but I can once again bet either do you....

So in the name of lower cost, workers' rights and benefits don't matter?

Once again... workers right and benefits are protected by our laws and market forces... non of us are force to work if the salary or benefits are below what you would expect. Companies must also survive and not be forced to paid beyond what they could afford or willing.




A final note...

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/private-security-companies-to-hire-taiwanese-as-auxiliary-police/3396950.html

An AETOS spokesperson added that many Singaporeans are put off by the nature of the job.

"Many Singaporeans are not keen to take on the role of an APO due to the nature of the job – routine, tough working conditions (having to endure vehicle fumes and harsh weather conditions) and performing shift duty," AETOS said in a statement to Channel NewsAsia.

The firm said that that it would still give "first priority" to eligible Singaporeans and Malaysians, adding that "Singaporeans have always been (its) preference".

AETOS added that the numbers it has recruited have not met the firm's manpower requirements. "(The) response by Singaporeans has not been forthcoming and getting qualified Malaysians has been challenging."

The firm also noted that the demand for security manpower has continued to rise in recent years, given the heightened security climate.

A police spokesman told Channel NewsAsia that the projected demand is over 600 APOs over the "next few years", and that Auxiliary Police Forces (APFs) - commercial companies like Certis CISCO and AETOS - have found it difficult to hire Singaporean APOs to meet the demand.

Take note that they need over 600 employees and is hiring 120 from taiwan... and while I can't prove that the remaining 480 employed will be out of the 15580 we keep talking about... I bet you can't disprove either...

 

[Jedi]

A final note...

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/private-security-companies-to-hire-taiwanese-as-auxiliary-police/3396950.html

This article sum it up.

There are many types of occupation which locals are not very interested in.

 

[diver-hloc]

This article sum it up.

There are many types of occupation which locals are not very interested in.

And just incase....

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/singaporean-auxiliary-police-are-paid-more-than-foreign-officers/3404078.html

Certis CISCO said that corporals are paid a starting salary of S$2,575 a month - regardless of nationality - but that the bonus paid to Singaporeans is higher.

For instance, new Singaporean officers get S$5,000 upon joining and S$10,000 after they have completed three years of service.

In comparison, new Taiwanese officers get S$2,000 upon joining and another S$2,000 when they complete their two-year contract.

A Singaporean APO who has done national service will also have an NS allowance, Certis CISCO said.

Not working for them so I can't said for sure is all those stuffs written in the contracts of new APO (depending on 'qualifications' of course)... so, waiting for someone to said he/she knows someone, who's son/daughter knows someone on Facebook... that said they know someone, that said this isn't correct..

 

[greenieadi]

I wonder if CERTIS-CISCO have really gone all out to get locals to fill up those vacancies.
What I can say is bottom lines of a companies rules greater than being nationalistic.
It is a sad thing but no company is willing to skimp on an opportunity to cut cost if one present itself.

 

[diver-hloc]

I wonder if CERTIS-CISCO have really gone all out to get locals to fill up those vacancies.
What I can say is bottom lines of a companies rules greater than being nationalistic.
It is a sad thing but no company is willing to skimp on an opportunity to cut cost if one present itself.

I, myself, told enough colleagues with my own saying that goes - "Boss will want you to work more for the same amount of pay... and we'll want to work as little for that same amount of pay".

Bosses trying to maximize their profits and workers trying to 'eat snake' at work is a fact of life... its not good nor bad... just a basic fact of life.

How would one deem has Certis-CISCO, tired 'all out' to find locals ?? According to them, local are already paid more than foreigners for the same contract... so, how much more 'All Outs' will be required ?? Free Housing ?? Free Schooling for employees children ?? A free Car ?? Free Holiday to Europe ?? And does all this 'Free' stuffs meant cost will be passed to their customer ?? I would like to be employed by any company that would give me all these... but I doubt many... if any, has such a package anymore... :bsmilie:

 

[one eye jack]

I, myself, told enough colleagues with my own saying that goes - "Boss will want you to work more for the same amount of pay... and we'll want to work as little for that same amount of pay".

Bosses trying to maximize their profits and workers trying to 'eat snake' at work is a fact of life... its not good nor bad... just a basic fact of life.

How would one deem has Certis-CISCO, tired 'all out' to find locals ?? According to them, local are already paid more than foreigners for the same contract... so, how much more 'All Outs' will be required ?? Free Housing ?? Free Schooling for employees children ?? A free Car ?? Free Holiday to Europe ?? And does all this 'Free' stuffs meant cost will be passed to their customer ?? I would like to be employed by any company that would give me all these... but I doubt many... if any, has such a package anymore... :bsmilie:

Nice to know there is humour.Let's put in in perspective.What is the origin of certis cisco and who owns it? Cisco is an armed security and escort service.Why taiwan..their men have undergone national service and have similar cultural and language backgrounds notwithstanding weak command of english which being graduates help?.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Certis_CISCO

Is cisco having recruitment problems only?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aetos_Security_Management

More than APO (auxillary protection officer) jobs available to the 15K..

http://www.jobstreet.com.sg/en/job-search/jobs-at-certis-cisco-security-pte-ltd/


Origin of the word certis:The Origins of Reasonable Doubt: Theological Roots of the Criminal Trial



PS I'm not a supporter or spokesman of said companies.:bsmilie:

 

[nitewalk]

The same usual reaction when an article talks about hiring locals. Unclefai, north korea hires north koreans.

 

[diver-hloc]

The same usual reaction when an article talks about hiring locals. Unclefai, north korea hires north koreans.

Not really hor... they also hire foreigners... usually by kidnapping them... :bsmilie:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Abduction_of_Shin_Sang-ok_and_Choi_Eun-hee

 

[Sion]

... so, how much more 'All Outs' will be required ?? Free Housing ?? Free Schooling for employees children ?? A free Car ?? Free Holiday to Europe ?? And does all this 'Free' stuffs meant cost will be passed to their customer ?? I would like to be employed by any company that would give me all these...

Yes you have everything if you set up a company and pay yourself all of them including company-sponsored massage service etc. etc.

 

[Nikonzen]

Question - are apo's the defacto police forces in Singapore? Seems like being a cop would be no sweat in SG.

As a Jamaican tour guide once told me...we don't have problems here only situations. Perhaps this is just a situation?

 

[diver-hloc]

Question - are apo's the defacto police forces in Singapore? Seems like being a cop would be no sweat in SG.

As a Jamaican tour guide once told me...we don't have problems here only situations. Perhaps this is just a situation?

No... APO (Auxiliary Police Force) is not the police force... its kind of an off-shoot of the police, much like a Security Contractor. They handle mostly security issues like Bank security... security of events (music/F1/sporting etc) and also transportation and protect of money for ATM runs...

They don't investigate crimes... which is still the job of the police force... they provide mainly day to day security for business which the Police no longer does.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Certis_CISCO

 

[Nikonzen]

Thanks diver...I see...security guards. Who needs apo when you can just walk into bank pass teller a note and walk out with 30 grand?

I'm being facetious...

 

[Sion]

....Seems like being a cop would be no sweat in SG.

Answer: :bsmilie:

Our cops just need to look pretty.

 

[Nikonzen]

Handcuff me to one that looks like that please...lol

 

[Bukitimah]

if we just sit in the comfort of our office and look at data, we will never know the real answers.

why woukd a taiwanese graduate come here to earn less? because he eats less and has higher survival skills? his strategy is short term and he has more options after 2 years?

would those planners and decision makers take the options they have been talking if they are in the same situation and ask themselves why not.

 

[one eye jack]

if we just sit in the comfort of our office and look at data, we will never know the real answers.

why woukd a taiwanese graduate come here to earn less? because he eats less and has higher survival skills? his strategy is short term and he has more options after 2 years?

would those planners and decision makers take the options they have been talking if they are in the same situation and ask themselves why not.

Your comment is conscientious,to the jaded it's been like this since the colonialists left.
Called it survival instincts, our top brains go for quick and easy solutions and it has worked most of the time.The expression "It's the economy stupid!" seems to justify any action.

Just recall the casino debate,"everybody is doing it,we should not lose out." Of late the casino in sentosa has closed shop.The all in one family "resort" is still operating.Japan has recently amended it's laws and now allow legal casinos,their reasons for it have different agendas.

Not much attention is paid to social implications until it becomes obvious like transport,medical and housing resources and prices rise.

Taking advantage of another's dire situation is just a human condition.If one is a taiwanese graduate
when there are more applicants for a job vacancy,why not.Beats being nagged by parents and society's labelling them as you know what.

The thing is power,when you have it you can be heard louder no matter if it's correct or not.
Police is power but truth be told they are not infallible.The little india incident and some crimes are still unsolved to this day,what you hear are the successful cases.

 

[diver-hloc]

if we just sit in the comfort of our office and look at data, we will never know the real answers.

why woukd a taiwanese graduate come here to earn less? because he eats less and has higher survival skills? his strategy is short term and he has more options after 2 years?

would those planners and decision makers take the options they have been talking if they are in the same situation and ask themselves why not.

Earn less only when compared with local workers doing the same contract... for if I'm not mistaken, or that Taiwanese news and Internet sources isn't bullsh*tting... the average TW Grad have a starting paid of NT$27K... which is $1200(+/-)SGD... so, a starting pay of $2575 SGD (NT$57794 +/-) would be about a 214% increase in salary on what an average grad could get back home...

http://business.asiaone.com/news/average-salary-taiwanese-college-grads-back-1200

http://www.chinapost.com.tw/taiwan/national/national-news/2014/05/31/409035/Graduates-average.htm

http://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/taiwan-youth-struggle-to-find-well-paying-jobs


If anyone coming over and does not have any plan and/or strategy... than that individual might as well stay back home... remember, 不是猛龙不过江, if someone is to leave his homeland and family for a chance of a better life... he/she damn well better have a plan and strategy for next 5-8 yrs... not just 2 yrs.