Official Sony A7 or A7r discussion thread

[longj49]

Depends on what you are looking for.

IMO, other than the 36mp sensor, the A7r got more issues.
1. Not any better for adapted lenses (in fact often worse); and its hard to avoid adapted lens use for quite a while.
2. Unforgiving on technique to make use of 36mp resolution
3. Unforgiving on lenses (CA, poor edges all get accentuated)
4. No EFC shutter (for faster response shooting);
5. Slower flash sync
6. What is sane for most purposes? (viewing, printing)

Imagine, you run around shooting your kid.
Lots of bad shots for sure.
All 36mp each to vet through.

Think again about street/candids
They don't need to be 36mp for large prints in most cases.
Neither does the dynamism and moving subjects allow 100% pixel viewing perfection all the time.

How big are you printing/viewing anyway?

Get a good quality lens to make use of the 36mp, they are often big and puts you back to square one wrt size of system.

Of course with 36mp, you can work with a downsampling workflow to mitigate the less than perfect technique or realities of subject movement.
You also get more mp to crop and more mp to throw away to mitigate noise.


All are practical considerations.
My few cents.

nice insight bro, very relevant issues to seriously mull over before shelling out the big bucks. really appreciate such helpful feedback from all our better informed bros here.

 

[cowmera]

Vario-Tessar T* FE 24-70mm F4 ZA OSS 定價為 HK$9,390，將於 2014 年 1 月 28 日正式發售。

http://www.dcfever.com/news/readnews.php?id=9746

Don't you guys wish you are in Hong Kong then??? I will go and check if they have it in the Sony Store tomorrow...

Argh…good or bad that i'm leaving HK on 27th Jan?

 

[syke]

Argh…good or bad that i'm leaving HK on 27th Jan?

Maybe you can find shops selling the lens earlier than this date?

 

[tsammyc]

nice insight bro, very relevant issues to seriously mull over before shelling out the big bucks. really appreciate such helpful feedback from all our better informed bros here.

If I want to shoot kids running around, a cheap M43 setup or even a P&S is good enough. I have almost 100% keepers on M43. The full frame sensor is best suited to a more considered, slower technique at shooting. The A7 isn't good at shooting kids either so there's no point going with that. I would use the A7 series for what its good at and if you do that, the A7r's resolution and lack of AA filter gives it a considerable advantage over the A7. To me, it's clearly worth the money.

 

[pinholecam]

If I want to shoot kids running around, a cheap M43 setup or even a P&S is good enough. I have almost 100% keepers on M43. The full frame sensor is best suited to a more considered, slower technique at shooting. The A7 isn't good at shooting kids either so there's no point going with that. I would use the A7 series for what its good at and if you do that, the A7r's resolution and lack of AA filter gives it a considerable advantage over the A7. To me, it's clearly worth the money.

The A7 is a more generalist camera than the A7r.
Not that the A7r cannot be used for all purposes, but know the tradeoffs, pros and cons.
To claim that a FF camera (not just the A7r) is for slow work, is a sweeping statement.


If you think that your family only deserves pns shots?
Thats up to you.


A7 is capable of taking moving kids with the EFC (as can many cameras so long as shutter response is not too bad)
I do it with manual focus and have been doing so on my 5D and Pentax cameras too.
No rocket science, just need to be decisive to know that if it looks sharp, release the shutter.


DSC00564 by jenkwang, on Flickr
The important thing to me is that, the shutter lag must not be too bad.
Very important for EVF cameras since they used to have a bad lag between screen and shot.
A7 has impressed me with its very minimal lag.

There are very important techniques to be gleaned just by taking shots of your own children.

If you can take photos of your moving child, its the same technique you use to take strangers in street/candids.
If you can take street/candids, that technique can be applied for people shots when you are on a tour.
All these techniques are transferable and have a practical purpose.

 

[pinholecam]

nice insight bro, very relevant issues to seriously mull over before shelling out the big bucks. really appreciate such helpful feedback from all our better informed bros here.

Think it over.

No right or wrong choice.
All depends on what you need and want

 

[sagiluck]

Using MF is easier when i shoot my dogs running around .. gt plenty of keepers. Tried the AF tracking with kit lens... the green box indeed very responsive to my dog movement,was really impressed and took quite a number of shots but strangely most shots are oof.. maybe i used it wrongly. =(

 

[tsammyc]

The A7 is a more generalist camera than the A7r.
Not that the A7r cannot be used for all purposes, but know the tradeoffs, pros and cons.
To claim that a FF camera (not just the A7r) is for slow work, is a sweeping statement.

The A7 may be a more generalist camera than the A7r, but neither A7 or A7r is a good choice for shooting kids running around. With the right technique, like the manual focus you describe for shooting kids, you can probably do anything, but it is that much harder. I used a NEX-6 with Sony's PDAF since it's launch and cannot rely on it's poor implementation of PDAF to shoot kids with. Reminds me of Pentax PDAF.

If you think that your family only deserves pns shots?
Thats up to you.

The family deserves A7r shots, but "kids running around" usually isn't a creative effort, your gymnastics shot not withstanding. Since you have a 5D, wouldn't you rather bring that to shoot your kid flying in the air?

A7 is capable of taking moving kids with the EFC (as can many cameras so long as shutter response is not too bad)
I do it with manual focus and have been doing so on my 5D and Pentax cameras too.
No rocket science, just need to be decisive to know that if it looks sharp, release the shutter.

Coming from the KX and K5 and moving to the OMD-EM5 and NEX-6, I discovered that it is quite easy to shoot moving kids with AF on the OMD. However, the yield was very low with Sony's PDAF on the NEX-6. If you are trying to advise someone on what camera to choose to shoot moving kids, would you advise them to get an A7? I would say the OMD EM-5 or EM-1 is a much better choice.

The important thing to me is that, the shutter lag must not be too bad.
Very important for EVF cameras since they used to have a bad lag between screen and shot.
A7 has impressed me with its very minimal lag.

There are very important techniques to be gleaned just by taking shots of your own children.

If you can take photos of your moving child, its the same technique you use to take strangers in street/candids.
If you can take street/candids, that technique can be applied for people shots when you are on a tour.
All these techniques are transferable and have a practical purpose.

Isn't what you describe, the "considered, careful technique" I said is required for a full frame sensor?

Also when I said full frame sensor, I was referring to the A7/A7r, not making a sweeping statement covering Nikon and Canon SLRs which everybody knows are used for sports photography....

 

[pinholecam]

You cannot and want to over rely on your gears does not mean other ppl cannot.


I better go back to posting more photos......

The A7 may be a more generalist camera than the A7r, but neither A7 or A7r is a good choice for shooting kids running around. With the right technique, like the manual focus you describe for shooting kids, you can probably do anything, but it is that much harder. I used a NEX-6 with Sony's PDAF since it's launch and cannot rely on it's poor implementation of PDAF to shoot kids with. Reminds me of Pentax PDAF.


The family deserves A7r shots, but "kids running around" usually isn't a creative effort, your gymnastics shot not withstanding. Since you have a 5D, wouldn't you rather bring that to shoot your kid flying in the air?


Coming from the KX and K5 and moving to the OMD-EM5 and NEX-6, I discovered that it is quite easy to shoot moving kids with AF on the OMD. However, the yield was very low with Sony's PDAF on the NEX-6. If you are trying to advise someone on what camera to choose to shoot moving kids, would you advise them to get an A7? I would say the OMD EM-5 or EM-1 is a much better choice.



Isn't what you describe, the "considered, careful technique" I said is required for a full frame sensor?

Also when I said full frame sensor, I was referring to the A7/A7r, not making a sweeping statement covering Nikon and Canon SLRs which everybody knows are used for sports photography....

 

[spinworkxroy]

This might be a silly question but i keep reading that it's possible to do timelaspe via the playmemory app in camera..
i search and search but can't seem to find this feature.
How do you actually do timelaspe on the a7?
Can do it via the smart control app on the phone?
The in camera play memories..don't have timelaspe app option.
Googling also can't find any help..
Anyone knows?

EDIT: Nmind..i just found out that you need to set your region to USA or Europe and there will be a time laspe LE app which is NOT free.
Somehow there are many other paid apps that you can't see on SG apps portal from Sony...no timelaspe for me then...

 

[coolhirako]

This might be a silly question but i keep reading that it's possible to do timelaspe via the playmemory app in camera..
i search and search but can't seem to find this feature.
How do you actually do timelaspe on the a7?
Can do it via the smart control app on the phone?
The in camera play memories..don't have timelaspe app option.
Googling also can't find any help..
Anyone knows?

EDIT: Nmind..i just found out that you need to set your region to USA or Europe and there will be a time laspe LE app which is NOT free.
Somehow there are many other paid apps that you can't see on SG apps portal from Sony...no timelaspe for me then...

You thought it is FREE ? LOL

 

[silvermoon1407]

You thought it is FREE ? LOL

$10usd or buy a intervalometer, u choose.

 

[coolhirako]

$10usd or buy a intervalometer, u choose.

Can buy few K dollars camera+lens but cant buy $10 apps haha

 

[spinworkxroy]

You thought it is FREE ? LOL

Because it was mentioned it was FREE online..I didn't even know Sony had paid apps since the SG site never listed anything that needed payment.
I don't even know if we can buy if we browse the US portal.
US10 isn't expensive...but i don't do timelaspes as yet..never have done it before...but since i thought it was free no harm trying out the app..If i have to pay for it, i'll only pay if i really want to do time laspes...and not just to try once for fun.

Here's where i saw it said it was free http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52797601

And no, it's not that i can't afford a $10 app...$10 can't even pump my petrol..but i don't buy things i won't use.

 

[Errz]

u have to select Australia. USA does not have the LE.


Time-Lapse LE by Errz, on Flickr

Because it was mentioned it was FREE online..I didn't even know Sony had paid apps since the SG site never listed anything that needed payment.
I don't even know if we can buy if we browse the US portal.
US10 isn't expensive...but i don't do timelaspes as yet..never have done it before...but since i thought it was free no harm trying out the app..If i have to pay for it, i'll only pay if i really want to do time laspes...and not just to try once for fun.

Here's where i saw it said it was free http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52797601

And no, it's not that i can't afford a $10 app...$10 can't even pump my petrol..but i don't buy things i won't use.

 

[silgt]

Vario-Tessar T* FE 24-70mm F4 ZA OSS 定價為 HK$9,390，將於 2014 年 1 月 28 日正式發售。

http://www.dcfever.com/news/readnews.php?id=9746

Don't you guys wish you are in Hong Kong then??? I will go and check if they have it in the Sony Store tomorrow...

Am I reading this right? 5 aspheric and 1 ED elements in this lens?

If so, then will be bloody impressed

 

[coolhirako]

Because it was mentioned it was FREE online..I didn't even know Sony had paid apps since the SG site never listed anything that needed payment.
I don't even know if we can buy if we browse the US portal.
US10 isn't expensive...but i don't do timelaspes as yet..never have done it before...but since i thought it was free no harm trying out the app..If i have to pay for it, i'll only pay if i really want to do time laspes...and not just to try once for fun.

Here's where i saw it said it was free http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52797601

And no, it's not that i can't afford a $10 app...$10 can't even pump my petrol..but i don't buy things i won't use.

Sure you can afford it, i was joking.
Btw, the free one is time-lapse LE , u might try it out 1st

 

[coolhirako]

Am I reading this right? 5 aspheric and 1 ED elements in this lens?

If so, then will be bloody impressed

And bloody expensive =)

 

[silgt]

And bloody expensive =)

But if it employs such high quality glass elements, then it goes without saying users can expect killer results from this lens? Of course the cost can be rather prohibitive but then again I would rather this direction than just producing a passable product from the Sony & Zeiss, all team in the name of making it affordable.

 

[andrewtansj]

u have to select Australia. USA does not have the LE.


Time-Lapse LE by Errz, on Flickr

managed to download and installed the time-lapse LE app, but it is a 'light' version of time-lapse app, doesn't seem to have any control over the iso and shutter speed...don't seem to be of much use...