E-M5 Owner - Comments, Critique, Reviews, and what-nots :-)
- Thread starter Oly5050
- Start date
vainqueur
Senior Member
No la. NR and NF affect JPEG and even RAW because for RAW you got the ability to change the settings in Olympus Viewer, there should be an option for you to play around with. All the controls I believe you got the ability to change in Olympus Viewer for RAW. You can even maintain the setting you did in camera if you dont want to change to other settings. For example, you shot RAW with NR to off, but then after that in viewer, you decided you want to on the NR, you can do it. I never touch the NR or NF in viewer before, but I always use viewer to play around with the WB setting, I believe it should be the same throughout meaning other than the usual settings, you can choose to use the setting taken from the camera.
Unless I misunderstand what you were saying. haha... :bsmilie:
If NR involves dark frame subtraction (according to wonglp), then you will not be able to add NR in post-processing. This is because if you shot your long exposure without NR, the camera would not have taken the extra dark frame to subtract off the hot pixels. I am pretty sure the rest can be messed around with in Olympus Viewer.
By the way, Olympus issued an official response to explain the Sound Noise (i.e. the "computer fan whirling noise") you hear on the E-M5: “You are hearing the new 5 axis Image Stabilization system. It uses a type of Magnetic field to keep the sensor assembly suspended so you will even hear it if the IS system is disabled.”
Source: 43 Rumors
Source: 43 Rumors
got the grip yesterday. so i guess i'm now set for adventure, spare battery be damned!
pics of my new setup below, alongside my old gear: (sorry about the backlighting)
the grip feels really nice and makes holding the camera like the most natural thing in the world, like scratching your butt in the morning, er...
kidding aside, it does improve the ergonomics, significantly in my mind
- i don't have to clasp the camera as hard. my hand was cramping a bit even with just the light kit lens
- the shutter button is in a more natural position, and for those who are bothered by the strap loop (i'm not), your finger can now skirt around it
- my pinkie finger now has a place, thanks to the bottom piece of the horizontal grip (even w/o the vertical grip/battery case w/c i left in the box). it used to go under the camera
- the texture is reassuring
- i can turn on the camera one-handed without looking. but still less secure than on the D7K where the index finger is used to power on and the thumb remains a counterpoint
- note that the viewfinders are at the same level, so no big change for me, though i know that the VF-2 sits higher on E-Pxx and some people have commented on that
those with bigger hands, i'm afraid you still might experience some cramping. the grip itself is not very deep, enough for me, but perhaps less so for others.
given the grip depth, i am now wondering if Oly couldn't have built in the grip in the first place. if you look at the photo above and imagine the MMF-3 as a pancake lens, you'll see that the grip doesn't really add more depth to the overall camera dimensions, and hence is not any less pocketable than a bare E-M5 w/ the slimmest pancake attached. i can only surmise that Oly went with styling considerations to better approximate the classic OM looks. not a design trade-off i would've made myself, but i know some would (indignantly) disagree.
Oly thoughtfully included a hideaway place for the rubber tab w/c you need to remove from the bottom of your camera. it goes into the grip handle and will be sandwiched between the grip and the camera body. wish they did the same for the plastic cap that you need to remove from the connector of the grip -- one more little piece of plastic that i'm liable to lose along the way.
of more consequence though is the fact one has to remove the grip to replace the battery. not yet sure if this will be a nuissance for me. for now it seems like the charge will be sufficient for full day shooting so i'll probably just be taking out the battery back at home/hotel. i got about 200 shots from the first charge using Large/Fine JPEG+RAW, 50/50 EVF/LCD. but i was playing a lot with the settings, scrutinizing/deleting photos, and the 200 does not count the numerous times i was just half-pressing the shutter to challenge the focus capabilities. so i imagine with normal use, 350 would be easy, perhaps 400 even. normal use for me now is about 300 shots per day when on holidays. far cry from 1000+ when i first started out with the E-PL1 a couple of years ago. the reduction is partly from me now being more selective, and partly from the improved focus speed and accuracy of newer cameras. but i'm not going to kid myself; this is still far behind the endurance of the D7K. last December i forgot my charger but managed to satisfy myself over 5 days (including lots of long exposures) using the D7K plus a spare battery. on the trip home i had more than enough left on the spare battery to take lots of cloud pictures, and even then didn't manage to deplete it. i'm not sure if i can replicate the same with the E-M5 and deliberately leave the charger at home. regardless, that incident taught me a valuable lesson about being selective without feeling constrained, so i don't think the E-M5 battery life will be an issue for me.
you might be wondering why i keep pitting the E-M5 against the D7K. simple: i'm looking to have the E-M5 as a replacement. E-M5 + 14-54mkII f2.8-3.5 will be my default kit, replacing D7K + Sigma 17-50 f2.8. they're not apples to apples, but in practical use they are equivalent to me. i'll miss some of the DOF and a bit of speed, but i'll have a bit more reach. fine, i can work with that. as for telephoto which i bring maybe 50% of the time, i'll be re-activating my Panasonic 45-200 and shelve the NikkorFX 28-300. again, not a direct comparison (the Nikkor is sharper, wider and longer) but i'll deal with that.
from the pics above, it's apparent my new setup is not that much smaller. some might question my sanity in slapping a big lens on the E-M5 and defeating the portability advantage of m4/3. but to me, size isn't really an issue since i usually bring a bag anyway. and if i really wanted to go small, i have the option of taking the grip off and slapping on a pancake. i don't have such a flexibility with the D7K. beyond size, my main motivation for going m/43 is really about weight:
[table="width: 500, class: grid"]
[tr]
[td][/td]
[td]D7K[/td]
[td]E-M5[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]body w/ battery
[/td]
[td]750[/td]
[td]425[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]horizontal grip[/td]
[td]-[/td]
[td]100[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]normal zoom[/td]
[td]565[/td]
[td]440[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]adapter[/td]
[td]-[/td]
[td]45[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]sub-total[/td]
[td]1315[/td]
[td]1010[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]telephoto[/td]
[td]800[/td]
[td]380[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]total[/td]
[td]2115[/td]
[td]1390[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]
is 300g savings on my default setup worthwhile? my wrist certainly seems to think so. and if i bring along the telephoto for a total savings of 700g, i think my back and shoulders will thank me too. i could also argue that with a lighter setup i could use my Nivelo tripod which is 500g lighter than my 1.1kg Velbon, but i think i'll stick with the Velbon since it goes up to full height and is sturdier. and to be fair, i can use the Nivelo on the D7K+short zoom; it's just the long zoom that the head cannot handle.
now if only Oly would release an m/43 version of the 12-60...
anyway, sorry for long post. hope sharing this perspective might find an audience with others of similar inclination (read: crazy :sticktong )
pics of my new setup below, alongside my old gear: (sorry about the backlighting)
the grip feels really nice and makes holding the camera like the most natural thing in the world, like scratching your butt in the morning, er...
kidding aside, it does improve the ergonomics, significantly in my mind
- i don't have to clasp the camera as hard. my hand was cramping a bit even with just the light kit lens
- the shutter button is in a more natural position, and for those who are bothered by the strap loop (i'm not), your finger can now skirt around it
- my pinkie finger now has a place, thanks to the bottom piece of the horizontal grip (even w/o the vertical grip/battery case w/c i left in the box). it used to go under the camera
- the texture is reassuring
- i can turn on the camera one-handed without looking. but still less secure than on the D7K where the index finger is used to power on and the thumb remains a counterpoint
- note that the viewfinders are at the same level, so no big change for me, though i know that the VF-2 sits higher on E-Pxx and some people have commented on that
those with bigger hands, i'm afraid you still might experience some cramping. the grip itself is not very deep, enough for me, but perhaps less so for others.
given the grip depth, i am now wondering if Oly couldn't have built in the grip in the first place. if you look at the photo above and imagine the MMF-3 as a pancake lens, you'll see that the grip doesn't really add more depth to the overall camera dimensions, and hence is not any less pocketable than a bare E-M5 w/ the slimmest pancake attached. i can only surmise that Oly went with styling considerations to better approximate the classic OM looks. not a design trade-off i would've made myself, but i know some would (indignantly) disagree.
Oly thoughtfully included a hideaway place for the rubber tab w/c you need to remove from the bottom of your camera. it goes into the grip handle and will be sandwiched between the grip and the camera body. wish they did the same for the plastic cap that you need to remove from the connector of the grip -- one more little piece of plastic that i'm liable to lose along the way.
of more consequence though is the fact one has to remove the grip to replace the battery. not yet sure if this will be a nuissance for me. for now it seems like the charge will be sufficient for full day shooting so i'll probably just be taking out the battery back at home/hotel. i got about 200 shots from the first charge using Large/Fine JPEG+RAW, 50/50 EVF/LCD. but i was playing a lot with the settings, scrutinizing/deleting photos, and the 200 does not count the numerous times i was just half-pressing the shutter to challenge the focus capabilities. so i imagine with normal use, 350 would be easy, perhaps 400 even. normal use for me now is about 300 shots per day when on holidays. far cry from 1000+ when i first started out with the E-PL1 a couple of years ago. the reduction is partly from me now being more selective, and partly from the improved focus speed and accuracy of newer cameras. but i'm not going to kid myself; this is still far behind the endurance of the D7K. last December i forgot my charger but managed to satisfy myself over 5 days (including lots of long exposures) using the D7K plus a spare battery. on the trip home i had more than enough left on the spare battery to take lots of cloud pictures, and even then didn't manage to deplete it. i'm not sure if i can replicate the same with the E-M5 and deliberately leave the charger at home. regardless, that incident taught me a valuable lesson about being selective without feeling constrained, so i don't think the E-M5 battery life will be an issue for me.
you might be wondering why i keep pitting the E-M5 against the D7K. simple: i'm looking to have the E-M5 as a replacement. E-M5 + 14-54mkII f2.8-3.5 will be my default kit, replacing D7K + Sigma 17-50 f2.8. they're not apples to apples, but in practical use they are equivalent to me. i'll miss some of the DOF and a bit of speed, but i'll have a bit more reach. fine, i can work with that. as for telephoto which i bring maybe 50% of the time, i'll be re-activating my Panasonic 45-200 and shelve the NikkorFX 28-300. again, not a direct comparison (the Nikkor is sharper, wider and longer) but i'll deal with that.
from the pics above, it's apparent my new setup is not that much smaller. some might question my sanity in slapping a big lens on the E-M5 and defeating the portability advantage of m4/3. but to me, size isn't really an issue since i usually bring a bag anyway. and if i really wanted to go small, i have the option of taking the grip off and slapping on a pancake. i don't have such a flexibility with the D7K. beyond size, my main motivation for going m/43 is really about weight:
[table="width: 500, class: grid"]
[tr]
[td][/td]
[td]D7K[/td]
[td]E-M5[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]body w/ battery
[/td]
[td]750[/td]
[td]425[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]horizontal grip[/td]
[td]-[/td]
[td]100[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]normal zoom[/td]
[td]565[/td]
[td]440[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]adapter[/td]
[td]-[/td]
[td]45[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]sub-total[/td]
[td]1315[/td]
[td]1010[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]telephoto[/td]
[td]800[/td]
[td]380[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]total[/td]
[td]2115[/td]
[td]1390[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]
is 300g savings on my default setup worthwhile? my wrist certainly seems to think so. and if i bring along the telephoto for a total savings of 700g, i think my back and shoulders will thank me too. i could also argue that with a lighter setup i could use my Nivelo tripod which is 500g lighter than my 1.1kg Velbon, but i think i'll stick with the Velbon since it goes up to full height and is sturdier. and to be fair, i can use the Nivelo on the D7K+short zoom; it's just the long zoom that the head cannot handle.
now if only Oly would release an m/43 version of the 12-60...
anyway, sorry for long post. hope sharing this perspective might find an audience with others of similar inclination (read: crazy :sticktong )
silence
Senior Member
thanks for the wonderful comparison. I have almost the same D7k setup as you... Yep... to me, getting the OM-D is more about reducing the "weight" but maintaining good photo IQ and speed. Looking forward to my silver set in mid May.. Meanwhile, I will still be lugging my D7k setup(lucky got 2 "helpers" to help me carry other things) for my trip tomorrow =)
Great user review on the grip. Totally agree with you on the vastly improved ergonomics and the blockage of the battery cover. And thanks for that tip on storing the rubber piece. I totally missed that.
I am one of those that is happy that Oly did not integrate the grip into the camera. I prefer it to be as small as possible, and to build it up bigger as needed. I like the OMD the way it is now. But u are right, the grip does not really add more in terms of thickness to the camera.
Oh, and one more thing, if u are using the 14-54 mark II on the OMD, you are actually not maximizing the benefits of the system in terms of bulk, weight and AF speed. The 14-54 although lighter and smaller than 12-60 is still much heavier and bigger than the 12-50. The OMD is just sweet with the 14 2.5 pancake lens and does real well with the 12-50 kit. I just feel that it is a camera that sort of gets out of the way of the photographer and lets you take pictures rather than you take pictures because of it. I hope this is understandable. I shot like more than 2000+ photos already, and I find that I shoot because I have something to shoot rather than because I wanna use the camera. The novelty does wear off quite quickly but is replaced by something better.
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"The Olympus OM-D E-M5 is the best Micro Four Thirds camera we've tested. It's got a top-notch stabilization system, is fully weather sealed, can shoot in all types of light, and ships with a sharp and versatile kit lens. Add it all up, and you have our new Editors' Choice for high-end compact interchangeable lens cameras." :gbounce:
I received an E-M5 from my camera dealer yesterday afternoon. I charged the battery for one hour, then shot almost 600 images in the evening. So far, I agree with everything "PC Mag" said. :lovegrin:
Sorry I can't post links here yet. :nono: I have posted this same information with a link to this review on dpreview Micro Four Thirds Talk forum and several other camera forums. :think:
I received an E-M5 from my camera dealer yesterday afternoon. I charged the battery for one hour, then shot almost 600 images in the evening. So far, I agree with everything "PC Mag" said. :lovegrin:
Sorry I can't post links here yet. :nono: I have posted this same information with a link to this review on dpreview Micro Four Thirds Talk forum and several other camera forums. :think:
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ShaneKua
Senior Member
Not sure if this helps. Just did a sunrise shoot this morning, if only the weather not so cloudy. I turned off NF, and on NR as previously on other Pen, hot pixels gets in the way rather fast, personally, prefer to have noise reduction on just in case it kills my long exposure shot. Vivid color mode. Sharpness is set to +1 for all, as 9-18 is good but not that sharp a lens. Maybe when I have a little more time, i can check out how sharpness differs on the RAW file using oly viewer 2.
Did about 20 shots of 20sec, 5 shots of 60secs. No hot pixels, so it good news
Here's a shot to share from this morning. C&C welcome.
9mm, F11, iso 200, 60s. NF off, Sharpness +1, NR on. PP from Aperture on curves, levels, etc. Black card technique with 3 stops ND filter.
I think some cloudiness = good. This way you get nice, dramatic sky patterns. I work for a architectural concept art company - when we go and take photos of skies we usually aim for skies with fast moving cloud formations.
Certainly a good combination, 14-54II is an excellent sharp lens, plus weatherproof, dustproof (if you are using mmf3). Used it for quite a while before I moved to primes. Still miss optical qualities though not the weight and size.
Totally agreed, was trying to do that actually but was limited by 60s (max setting) on manual mode and I forgot to bring my shutter release, thanks for the comments
Just realized I posted black card, but actually was GND hard edge, confused with some other shots which I used black card technique.
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I had a check on Oly viewer 2 yesterday, NR is actually editable from RAW file, bro Vainquer is correct. Although pretty sure NR is also dark frame subtraction.
Can refer to here: Night Shooting - Stop the Noise
Extracted
"Long exposures can cause bright or hot pixels to appear in digital images, a phenomenon called Fixed Pattern Noise. Olympus Noise Reduction technology cancels this noise. Noise reduction doubles the exposure time in order to create a second exposure equal in time to the original exposure. The second exposure is immediately captured after the initial exposure with the shutter closed resulting in a black image. Any bright noise is visible against the black exposure. Noise reduction then cancels the corresponding bright pixels on the original exposure to result in a final image that is virtually noise-free. "
So kinda confused now, i seldom use OV2, so not sure what impact it gives on my picture coz there's no hot pixels to start with
We (vainquer & a few of us) had a thread discussing on this terminology of NR & NF, it's confusing
