PrimePhotog
Deregistered
Totally agree.Sometimes, I help my friends get their items sold because they are out of country or some other reason.
Buy and Sell forum: is it allowed for ppl to pull a fast one?
- Thread starter TsQ
- Start date
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i personally just came across one buyer/seller who is totally trying to rip off others
i sold her a second hand lens for less than $60 (actually 2 lenses for $110 )
" links
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=506734&highlight=pfurr - hers
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=499429&highlight=clwjk - mine "
not long after she is now trying to sell off one of lens for $150. stating quote " no low ballers, you think youre very funny, and maybe you are, but i have no time to entertain you" end quote.
totally disgusted by it coz she tried to haggle and bargain with me like a fish market auntie.
so i believe this all boils down on how wicked/ twisted you are inside you. either you are sincere in making the photography community in singapore prosper or you just trying to squeeze ppl dry.
and why dont cs give it a try in adopting similar b/s ways like HW and VR where points/ comments are given to each members for their b/s transactions.
i sold her a second hand lens for less than $60 (actually 2 lenses for $110 )
" links
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=506734&highlight=pfurr - hers
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=499429&highlight=clwjk - mine "
not long after she is now trying to sell off one of lens for $150. stating quote " no low ballers, you think youre very funny, and maybe you are, but i have no time to entertain you" end quote.
totally disgusted by it coz she tried to haggle and bargain with me like a fish market auntie.
so i believe this all boils down on how wicked/ twisted you are inside you. either you are sincere in making the photography community in singapore prosper or you just trying to squeeze ppl dry.
and why dont cs give it a try in adopting similar b/s ways like HW and VR where points/ comments are given to each members for their b/s transactions.
Daedalus Trent
Senior Member
Well, i can understand your disgust (trust me), but she didn't do any wrong did she? :embrass:
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GoheadGostern
Member
hi
mayb her mistake is lack of self-respect and lack of shame maybe?
Cheers
Shaz
mayb her mistake is lack of self-respect and lack of shame maybe?
Cheers
Shaz
exhoml
New Member
damn, I always wanted a cheap zoom, now she's going to spoil the market. :nono:
though she nv do anything wrong, there will be ppl taking her bait, i still have to say "pui"
though she nv do anything wrong, there will be ppl taking her bait, i still have to say "pui"
exhoml
New Member
hard to say, it is much depending on the seller. i saw thread inside say condition 10 come out with lots of scratches on glass. it is about ppl la
probably just shows that pfurr has a more keen sense of business than clwjk. nothing unethical or wrong. once you have agreed to sold the lens it no longer matters if the buying subsequently decides to sell it off at a higher price. you can feel buay song but that's about it.
anyway i think clwjk was too much in a hurry to sell the lens. probably could have got $100 if she had hung on.
anyway i think clwjk was too much in a hurry to sell the lens. probably could have got $100 if she had hung on.
why 'aunty/uncle'? you small boy/girl ah? :dunno:
GoheadGostern
Member
hi
i would agree it is more on ppl. i believe we would all be buay song if the buyer of our item sells off at a higher price after buying. but i guess clwjk buay song was made worse by the fact that i quote from her " not long after she is now trying to sell off one of lens for $150. stating quote " no low ballers, you think youre very funny, and maybe you are, but i have no time to entertain you" end quote.
totally disgusted by it coz she tried to haggle and bargain with me like a fish market auntie."
this i believe is the one tat makes her realli realli buay song.
up to individual. make money by undermining someone and selling off at a high price or sell smth at price where loss is minimalise.
cheers
shaz
i would agree it is more on ppl. i believe we would all be buay song if the buyer of our item sells off at a higher price after buying. but i guess clwjk buay song was made worse by the fact that i quote from her " not long after she is now trying to sell off one of lens for $150. stating quote " no low ballers, you think youre very funny, and maybe you are, but i have no time to entertain you" end quote.
totally disgusted by it coz she tried to haggle and bargain with me like a fish market auntie."
this i believe is the one tat makes her realli realli buay song.
up to individual. make money by undermining someone and selling off at a high price or sell smth at price where loss is minimalise.
cheers
shaz
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ah yes....the "low ballers" part is probably the part most other folks will take offence to. lol...a "low baller" warning off other "low ballers"? :bsmilie:
GoheadGostern
Member
hi.
yeap. a fine example of a pot calling a kettle black
Cheers
Shaz
yeap. a fine example of a pot calling a kettle black
Cheers
Shaz
UchihaItachi
New Member
I destroyed the entire Uchiha Clan without mercy! Like I said before many times, just become like VR zone, give rating. then everything is good. it is allowed for people to pull a fast one, but buyers and sellers can be equally protected by looking at opposite party ratings and comments given by people who deal with them before.I will not hesitate to use http://www.scottusa.com/us_en/product/1668/11813/sportster_p6 on you!
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GoheadGostern
Member
hi
im sorryy. im nt sure where you are getting at? is it your cheap way of advertising?
Cheers
Shaz
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Here's my take on BNS, not just here but in any forum for any products as well:
1) Limitations of various systems
There are many types of buyers and sellers. Some are obviously out to make a living. There are flaws to every system.
i) Implement Ratings:
Abusers can create multiple accounts. Hard to enforce.
ii) Start a Ban list?:
Abusers can also create another account
iii) Limiting buy/sell posts:
Denies a geniune seller the opportunity to sell off his/her entire collection of lens at one go. He/she may be jumping on another opportunity to buy a 2nd hand lens of classic proportions and have only a day to raise the cash!
2a) Irresponsible Advertising I
Some don't bother to give a good rating as per the guidelines which I find to be very comprehensive and should be highly promoted.
2b) Irresponsible Advertising II
Have we ever come across a used-car advertisement with the following:
2 year old BMW 325 selling for $XX,XXX.
Had 5 accidents before but repaired to mint condition
Car was parked in underground parking when a water pipe burst and caused the car park to be flooded. No signs of damage thus far.
Mileage 12,000KM, hardly used over 2 years as it was mostly parked in underground car park.
Condition of Car: Mint
Warranty Remaining: 48,000KM out of 60,000KM or 1 out of 3 years (whichever comes first) or "Brand New" because the car importer did not stamp the date of the warranty so warranty is brand-new. (which brings me to point 3a)
3a) Unfair Advantages I
Camera shops don't bother to "date-stamp" the warranties for regulars and this creates an opportunity for products being advertised in BNS with "New" rating. The product could have been bought many months ago but used several times. It may be hard to check if the equipment does not have any noticible signs of use.
3b) Unfair Advantages II
Other sellers, I notice, buy from overseas and sell them in Singapore for a profit. Knowing full well that there is a shortage of a particular product in Singapore. Take for example, the PS3 and the iPhones before it was released in Singapore. If you had the chance to travel to another country and buy yourself one PS3 before it was released in Singapore, you may be tempted to bring in another set for sale and why not? But it does annoy me personally if the same seller continues to advertise more than 1 item of the same product because that is outright profiteering. While CS defines a personal seller as "individuals who are offering goods or services to other members. Typically, personal sellers will only have one or at most two of the same items to sell, and those goods have been opened and used." Why would an indivdual have 2 of the same lens? In such cases, I prefer not to deal with such sellers but I may have mistaken them for they could be travelling to the same country for work regularly and hence, are doing fellow CSsers a service by helping to increase the supply.
4a) Demand and Supply I
Some buyers, after buying a particular product (e.g. Lens) from this forum and using it for a few days felt that they don't like it and decides to sell it off. Do they deserve to sell at a lower price because it is "a few days older" or "used a little more" than the original price it was sold at?
4b) Demand and Supply II
Consider this scenario to illustrate 4a, A bought a house for $400K during the peak of housing prices. 2 years later, A sold the house to B for $250K when house pricing were cheaper and his neighbours were selling the same types of houses in the area for around $230K - $260K. 3 months later, B advertised the same house for $300K because the prices of houses in the same area had experienced an increased demand. B subsequently sold the house for $295K to C.
4b(i) If you were A, it may be acceptable for you to complain that you had sold off too cheaply. However, no one can foresee the market conditions. If we can, we will be making $$$ from the stock market.
4b(ii) If you were B, you do not owe it to A or the society to sell your house at a price lower than what you had purchased it for.
4b(iii) If you were C, you had your chance to buy it from A at $250K but you missed out on the deal. You do not owe it to C to give you a lower quote just because he got the deal cheaper 3 months ago.
5) Research
Nothing beats doing your own research. It is the same regardless of what we want to buy/sell. How many times have we heard of banks profiteering from borrowers who are unable to keep up with the loan repayments and selling the house/car at depressed prices. Or from Expats who have little time but to get rid of their assets within a month because they are leaving the country? Or from unscrupulous agents telling you that there is an "offer" by another interested party and you may get the deal if you increase your asking price?
6) Conclusion
Bottomline is: this forum provides an avenue for all of us buyers and sellers of various background and purposes, to trade our wares. I know it sounds repetitive and very annoying (especially in this forum), but the word is "caveat emptor".
Disclaimer: I am not trying to support/put down any group or anyone with this post. Just posting my humble point of view. I am also a firm beliver of karma. Sow thy seeds of good, not evil.:angel:
1) Limitations of various systems
There are many types of buyers and sellers. Some are obviously out to make a living. There are flaws to every system.
i) Implement Ratings:
Abusers can create multiple accounts. Hard to enforce.
ii) Start a Ban list?:
Abusers can also create another account
iii) Limiting buy/sell posts:
Denies a geniune seller the opportunity to sell off his/her entire collection of lens at one go. He/she may be jumping on another opportunity to buy a 2nd hand lens of classic proportions and have only a day to raise the cash!
2a) Irresponsible Advertising I
Some don't bother to give a good rating as per the guidelines which I find to be very comprehensive and should be highly promoted.
2b) Irresponsible Advertising II
Have we ever come across a used-car advertisement with the following:
2 year old BMW 325 selling for $XX,XXX.
Had 5 accidents before but repaired to mint condition
Car was parked in underground parking when a water pipe burst and caused the car park to be flooded. No signs of damage thus far.
Mileage 12,000KM, hardly used over 2 years as it was mostly parked in underground car park.
Condition of Car: Mint
Warranty Remaining: 48,000KM out of 60,000KM or 1 out of 3 years (whichever comes first) or "Brand New" because the car importer did not stamp the date of the warranty so warranty is brand-new. (which brings me to point 3a)
3a) Unfair Advantages I
Camera shops don't bother to "date-stamp" the warranties for regulars and this creates an opportunity for products being advertised in BNS with "New" rating. The product could have been bought many months ago but used several times. It may be hard to check if the equipment does not have any noticible signs of use.
3b) Unfair Advantages II
Other sellers, I notice, buy from overseas and sell them in Singapore for a profit. Knowing full well that there is a shortage of a particular product in Singapore. Take for example, the PS3 and the iPhones before it was released in Singapore. If you had the chance to travel to another country and buy yourself one PS3 before it was released in Singapore, you may be tempted to bring in another set for sale and why not? But it does annoy me personally if the same seller continues to advertise more than 1 item of the same product because that is outright profiteering. While CS defines a personal seller as "individuals who are offering goods or services to other members. Typically, personal sellers will only have one or at most two of the same items to sell, and those goods have been opened and used." Why would an indivdual have 2 of the same lens? In such cases, I prefer not to deal with such sellers but I may have mistaken them for they could be travelling to the same country for work regularly and hence, are doing fellow CSsers a service by helping to increase the supply.
4a) Demand and Supply I
Some buyers, after buying a particular product (e.g. Lens) from this forum and using it for a few days felt that they don't like it and decides to sell it off. Do they deserve to sell at a lower price because it is "a few days older" or "used a little more" than the original price it was sold at?
4b) Demand and Supply II
Consider this scenario to illustrate 4a, A bought a house for $400K during the peak of housing prices. 2 years later, A sold the house to B for $250K when house pricing were cheaper and his neighbours were selling the same types of houses in the area for around $230K - $260K. 3 months later, B advertised the same house for $300K because the prices of houses in the same area had experienced an increased demand. B subsequently sold the house for $295K to C.
4b(i) If you were A, it may be acceptable for you to complain that you had sold off too cheaply. However, no one can foresee the market conditions. If we can, we will be making $$$ from the stock market.
4b(ii) If you were B, you do not owe it to A or the society to sell your house at a price lower than what you had purchased it for.
4b(iii) If you were C, you had your chance to buy it from A at $250K but you missed out on the deal. You do not owe it to C to give you a lower quote just because he got the deal cheaper 3 months ago.
5) Research
Nothing beats doing your own research. It is the same regardless of what we want to buy/sell. How many times have we heard of banks profiteering from borrowers who are unable to keep up with the loan repayments and selling the house/car at depressed prices. Or from Expats who have little time but to get rid of their assets within a month because they are leaving the country? Or from unscrupulous agents telling you that there is an "offer" by another interested party and you may get the deal if you increase your asking price?
6) Conclusion
Bottomline is: this forum provides an avenue for all of us buyers and sellers of various background and purposes, to trade our wares. I know it sounds repetitive and very annoying (especially in this forum), but the word is "caveat emptor".
Disclaimer: I am not trying to support/put down any group or anyone with this post. Just posting my humble point of view. I am also a firm beliver of karma. Sow thy seeds of good, not evil.:angel:
Last edited:
Shin Howard
Senior Member
Wow, I almost got fooled into buying a 35L today. I was searching for this lens on B&S for a while.
Then I saw these posts by:
CKWEE - http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=508989&highlight=35mm $1650
QUQUQU - http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=509063&highlight=35mm $1750
Pm CKWEE, he told me his lens is sold. Then I Pm QUQUQU, he told me that many are bidding for his lens. He ask for $1850 but I offered $1820, and he excepted.
He told me the lens condition is 10/10, so I meet him to deal. Inspected the lens and found that there's a knock on the bottom of the lens before. A point of paint peel and 2 other niks. Some scratches on the plastic next to the red band too.
Ask him about the condition and he was telling me that the lens condition was 10/10, the small dent must have been his careless-ness from yesterday shoot.
I tested the lens, sharpness was ok but unhappy with the exterior condition so rejected the lens as I don't want to reduce the price.
Seller says nvm then call off deal, after leaving and a while later seller msg me say he can lower the price by $50. But I still rejected cause I'm a bit picky.
Some details I noted from his Lens was bought from Hong Kong Camera Store Tin Cheung last August as stated on the purchase receipt and the price was HKD $9650.
After that I came home to search on 35L again, went through CKWEE details and found that he actually bought his 35L from HK Tin Cheung Camera Store in last August @ HKD $9650.
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4295714#post4295714
Seems like the description of CKWEE 35L is the same as QUQUQU, as stated on CKWEE post that the lens has a small point scratch on the lens.
Other than that I also found on this QUQUQU seller that 2 weeks ago he has a post that he is selling or trading his 17-55 IS for 24-105L or 35L.
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=502200
How could he wants to trade for 35L when he claims that he's the 1st owner of the lens he wants to sell me today???
So I Pm CKWEE, and he replied me that he sold his 35L for $1650.
So I guess the Answer is obvious now...:sweat:
Then I saw these posts by:
CKWEE - http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=508989&highlight=35mm $1650
QUQUQU - http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=509063&highlight=35mm $1750
Pm CKWEE, he told me his lens is sold. Then I Pm QUQUQU, he told me that many are bidding for his lens. He ask for $1850 but I offered $1820, and he excepted.
He told me the lens condition is 10/10, so I meet him to deal. Inspected the lens and found that there's a knock on the bottom of the lens before. A point of paint peel and 2 other niks. Some scratches on the plastic next to the red band too.
Ask him about the condition and he was telling me that the lens condition was 10/10, the small dent must have been his careless-ness from yesterday shoot.
I tested the lens, sharpness was ok but unhappy with the exterior condition so rejected the lens as I don't want to reduce the price.
Seller says nvm then call off deal, after leaving and a while later seller msg me say he can lower the price by $50. But I still rejected cause I'm a bit picky.
Some details I noted from his Lens was bought from Hong Kong Camera Store Tin Cheung last August as stated on the purchase receipt and the price was HKD $9650.
After that I came home to search on 35L again, went through CKWEE details and found that he actually bought his 35L from HK Tin Cheung Camera Store in last August @ HKD $9650.
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4295714#post4295714
Seems like the description of CKWEE 35L is the same as QUQUQU, as stated on CKWEE post that the lens has a small point scratch on the lens.
Other than that I also found on this QUQUQU seller that 2 weeks ago he has a post that he is selling or trading his 17-55 IS for 24-105L or 35L.
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=502200
How could he wants to trade for 35L when he claims that he's the 1st owner of the lens he wants to sell me today???
So I Pm CKWEE, and he replied me that he sold his 35L for $1650.
So I guess the Answer is obvious now...:sweat:
Dude, please make sure you post the correct name. My account is ckwee. never dealed with you before. The one you were dealing with was ckwee18. I noticed him around too.
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