Pentax K-X for fast moving kids?

[normanho23]

Multi-purpose zoom lens will be good only for outdoor use if you do not intend to use the flash. This is why I bought a Sigma 18-200mm F3.5-5.6 multipurpose zoom lens for my family outings with the kids to the zoo, Sentosa, East Coast part etc. No need flash, no need high ISO also can get good and sharp pictures as long as there are ample sunshine. But if you are an indoor guy and most of the shots are going to be indoor with limited lighting, then you will have to get a good zoom lens or prime lens with F2.8 or below. This is the reason why I have a Pentax 50mm F1.4 and Sigma 30mm F1.4 for indoor shots.

Just 3 weeks ago, I left for Sentosa with my family, my K-x and 2 lens (Sigma 18-200mm + Pentax 50mm F1.4). For most of the day till about 630pm, I was only using the Sigma zoom lens and all shots are taken at ISO 200 without any problem or using any flash. The usual amount of sunlight in Singapore is more than adequte to take any photos (macro, closeups, portraits, landscapes, fast moving vehicles or kids etc) at any zoom range for this particular lens. Set the focusing mode to AFC (Continuous mode) and to continuous shooting mode and you will not be wrong. It was only during my dinner at "Ding tai Fung Restaurant" and later in the evening when we visited Universal Studios then I changed my lens to the Pentax 50mm F1.4 so that I can take proper indoor and low light shots without using flash.

To me, the hassle of changing the lens for photo taking of kids and children is just too much to accept unless I can be like the F1 crew pit who can change tires in 3sec (but hey! they have 3 man to a tire and I have only 2 hands to 2 lens and a camera body). My son (8yrs) and daughter (4yrs) are always on the move so where got time to change lens or "walk and extra" few steps to get closer to the kids for portrait shots if you are using a prime lens? Sometime when you spot an interesting moment or a priceless impression on their face (they are maybe about 10m away) and just want to capture that instant moment, do you have time to change lens, keep the other lens, then move forward or backward to compose and take the shot? What I can tell you is by the time you are ready, the "moment" is long gone my fren. But if you have a 18-200mm or 18-250mm zoom lens, you can literally stay at your spot and zoom in to your object for the shots (say again... outdoor only. Indoor almost not possible unless lighting is super good).

So to me, a 18-200mm or 18-250mm zoom lens is very good, functional and practical for children "outdoor" (I say again.... Outdoor) shots. I dun think I will sell my Sigma 18-200mm lens anytime soon unless Sigma, Tamron or Pentax introduces a multi-purpose lens with F2.8 along the entire focal range. In fact, this Sigma zoom lens will always be attached to my camera for outdoor family outings due to it versatility and functionality coz bottomline is... "Where got time to change lens to capture the priceless moements?"!!!

 

[alantkh]

You already have a top of the line D700. It has a class leading Nikon AF (which is good enough for pro sports) and a good low noise FF sensor. It should be able to give you good shots. Perhaps usage of the long tele at wide apertures is your cause of grief.

I am looking for a second (light) body to mount a tele prime as my D700 has an ultra wide mounted on it. Too lazy to change lens when travelling. Nowadays body is so light, might as well buy one to mount it permanently on the lens.

But I think you are right. I am too fixated in using the widest aperture. It is like you pay for the f2.8 might as well use it maybe the pic will be better at f5.6....

 

[pinholecam]

I am looking for a second (light) body to mount a tele prime as my D700 has an ultra wide mounted on it. Too lazy to change lens when travelling. Nowadays body is so light, might as well buy one to mount it permanently on the lens.

But I think you are right. I am too fixated in using the widest aperture. It is like you pay for the f2.8 might as well use it maybe the pic will be better at f5.6....

Ha..ha.. don't we all.

 

[creampuff]

There is this saying "Cameras don't take photos, people do."
Think about it for a moment. You want to create effective photos, you got to master the craft.
If you wanna shoot great kid photos, the place to start is your technique, not your camera. Most photographers starting out think getting such and such camera and with a lens with a large maximum aperture or a wide zoom range is gonna automatically result in great photos. Getting the right gear can help but only up to a point. The best shots of kids come about because the photographer can visualize the shot and know how to execute it, and do it consistently.

Instead of discussing the merits of whether lens A vs lens B is better at taking photos of kids, you would be better off spending your time to research how photographers who shoot kids for a living go about doing it. Know their tips and techniques on how to engage children to get the best out of them (eg. give them a toy/prop to keep them preoccupied).

People who ask "what's the best lens for shooting kids" or "what's the the best camera for shooting kids" are asking the wrong question. That lens or camera alone can't help if you don't know how to go about using it.

Here's a shot of a kid speeding on a bike. That kid was zipping by pretty fast. The shot was taken at 1/40 sec at f/8 at ISO 100. Now just about any DSLR can achieve this exposure combination... Camera was the K20D with FA 77mm.

 

[molecule]

Yes yes, nice shot. That's the point, hence i'm now venturing into DSLR so I can start practising. But defintely want to do my homework and get recommendations since some cams are better for certain types of shots. To be honest, it may take me some time to 'master' the craft. I would hope to get some short term satisfaction of better (not necessarily perfect) photos.

For a guy who has been using PnS all my life from 3MP days till now.. and I dun even peer thru the viewfinder, using LCD all the way, it's a BIG step. Reading thru these forums and websites, I dun understand half the jargon being mentioned at first.. kekeke. I'm learning and it's interesting.

 

[snapnut]

I have 2 active sons and this is my take.
The K-X and FA 50mm f1.4 works great indoor.... but you still need to get it right.

You will need some light... natural from window works best.
Shuttle speed to be 1/30 at least.. best at 1/125 or more
I set F2.0 and ISO <= 400 to try to get the high shuttle speed... as well as the right DOF.
I wait till they stop moving and look at the camera... than fire 3-5 shots.
I get 1 I like out of about 20... if I am lucky ;p

If you think you can resist buying lenses :bsmilie::bsmilie:
The Kit and the 50-200mm is the best bang for the bucks.
Get a good bag... fast access, space for your kids stuff etc... so your hands are free.

 

[seefei]

Yes yes, nice shot. That's the point, hence i'm now venturing into DSLR so I can start practising. But defintely want to do my homework and get recommendations since some cams are better for certain types of shots. To be honest, it may take me some time to 'master' the craft. I would hope to get some short term satisfaction of better (not necessarily perfect) photos.

For a guy who has been using PnS all my life from camera with 3MP days till now.. and I dun even peer thru the viewfinder, using LCD all the way, it's a BIG step. Reading thru these forums and websites, I dun understand half the jargon being mentioned at first.. kekeke. I'm learning and it's interesting.

i think you miss creampuff point - "Cameras don't take photos, people do."
since you have been shooting since 3MP days , you are not really a newbie in photography. :think: just a change of equipment for better one should improve your chances of nailing the shot that you want. relax and dont get too worked up with the jargons....

shoot more, experience more and i am sure everything will fall into place. welcome to the dslr club. i like shooting kids too and we can exchange note on this topic... :bsmilie:

 

[joycegian]

Multi-purpose zoom lens will be good only for outdoor use if you do not intend to use the flash. This is why I bought a Sigma 18-200mm F3.5-5.6 multipurpose zoom lens for my family outings with the kids to the zoo, Sentosa, East Coast part etc. No need flash, no need high ISO also can get good and sharp pictures as long as there are ample sunshine. But if you are an indoor guy and most of the shots are going to be indoor with limited lighting, then you will have to get a good zoom lens or prime lens with F2.8 or below. This is the reason why I have a Pentax 50mm F1.4 and Sigma 30mm F1.4 for indoor shots.

Just 3 weeks ago, I left for Sentosa with my family, my K-x and 2 lens (Sigma 18-200mm + Pentax 50mm F1.4). For most of the day till about 630pm, I was only using the Sigma zoom lens and all shots are taken at ISO 200 without any problem or using any flash. The usual amount of sunlight in Singapore is more than adequte to take any photos (macro, closeups, portraits, landscapes, fast moving vehicles or kids etc) at any zoom range for this particular lens. Set the focusing mode to AFC (Continuous mode) and to continuous shooting mode and you will not be wrong. It was only during my dinner at "Ding tai Fung Restaurant" and later in the evening when we visited Universal Studios then I changed my lens to the Pentax 50mm F1.4 so that I can take proper indoor and low light shots without using flash.

To me, the hassle of changing the lens for photo taking of kids and children is just too much to accept unless I can be like the F1 crew pit who can change tires in 3sec (but hey! they have 3 man to a tire and I have only 2 hands to 2 lens and a camera body). My son (8yrs) and daughter (4yrs) are always on the move so where got time to change lens or "walk and extra" few steps to get closer to the kids for portrait shots if you are using a prime lens? Sometime when you spot an interesting moment or a priceless impression on their face (they are maybe about 10m away) and just want to capture that instant moment, do you have time to change lens, keep the other lens, then move forward or backward to compose and take the shot? What I can tell you is by the time you are ready, the "moment" is long gone my fren. But if you have a 18-200mm or 18-250mm zoom lens, you can literally stay at your spot and zoom in to your object for the shots (say again... outdoor only. Indoor almost not possible unless lighting is super good).

So to me, a 18-200mm or 18-250mm zoom lens is very good, functional and practical for children "outdoor" (I say again.... Outdoor) shots. I dun think I will sell my Sigma 18-200mm lens anytime soon unless Sigma, Tamron or Pentax introduces a multi-purpose lens with F2.8 along the entire focal range. In fact, this Sigma zoom lens will always be attached to my camera for outdoor family outings due to it versatility and functionality coz bottomline is... "Where got time to change lens to capture the priceless moements?"!!!

How much did you buy your Sigma 18-200mm F3.5-5.6 ??

 

[darrrrrrrrrr]

You will need some light... natural from window works best.
Shuttle speed to be 1/30 at least.. best at 1/125 or more
I set F2.0 and ISO <= 400 to try to get the high shuttle speed... as well as the right DOF.

shuttle

shutter

 

[molecule]

i think you miss creampuff point - "Cameras don't take photos, people do."
since you have been shooting since 3MP days , you are not really a newbie in photography. :think: just a change of equipment for better one should improve your chances of nailing the shot that you want.

Thanks, I do understand his broader point of skill vs equipment. Just frustrating with the number of blurred pics with kids indoors. Thes best pics I've taken are always on the beach on a sunny day haha! Although I've owned 4 PnS from 3-5-8-10MP with increasing tech like IS & higher ISO capability, i didn't really think about any specific skills. It was always easy to just take a picture mostly on Auto. Mainly people posing and structures/scenery.

It's like Tiger Woods. He probably can hit all kinds of shots with a single iron - high-low, left-right, at will. Me, I need all the equipment help I can get for a particular shot right now. :bsmilie:

relax and dont get too worked up with the jargons....

aperture, shutter speed, ISO, bokeh, depth of field, focal length, dry cabinet, different types of flash, this mm - that mm, all those numbers and decimals etc etc!!! talk about confused. in the past they were just english words to me... well not all looked english.

 

[normanho23]

How much did you buy your Sigma 18-200mm F3.5-5.6 ??

$430 from SLRR if I am not wrong. IQ is very good for this lens under bright sunshine. Hardly miss any shots with it. Fast, precised, compact and not very heavy. Even at max 200mm with F5.6, you still can get at least 1/100 shutter speed at ISO200 and this is good enuf for fast moving kids definitely.

 

[detritus]

$430 from SLRR if I am not wrong. IQ is very good for this lens under bright sunshine. Hardly miss any shots with it. Fast, precised, compact and not very heavy. Even at max 200mm with F5.6, you still can get at least 1/100 shutter speed at ISO200 and this is good enuf for fast moving kids definitely.

??? is there any lens that CANNOT achieve 1/100 shutter speed under the conditions u described?

 

[normanho23]

??? is there any lens that CANNOT achieve 1/100 shutter speed under the conditions u described?

Precisely... this is basically my point. Any multi-purpose zoom lens is good enough for any kind of shots as long as there is ample light. IMO, the Sigma 18-200mm lens is good enuf to take photos of "fast moving kids" or even "faster moving vehicles" during the day and it allow you to take both wide landscape and close up portraits all by a single lens. Like what I have mentioned, when I go for outdoor trips with my kids, this lens will be the main weapon as it saves me the time of changing lens while handling all the "barang barang" with the kids.

 

[snapnut]

shuttle

Woah ! That's fast moving indeed... pentax is really good.
OK... I got it.. shutter.. not shuttle :bsmilie:

Those considering All-in-1 may also want to consider the DA 18-250mm (or the Tamron 18-250mm). But I would go for 2 piece ... a good kit and a nice zoom (for me, a Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 and DAL 55-300mm)

 

[detritus]

Precisely... this is basically my point. Any multi-purpose zoom lens is good enough for any kind of shots as long as there is ample light. IMO, the Sigma 18-200mm lens is good enuf to take photos of "fast moving kids" or even "faster moving vehicles" during the day and it allow you to take both wide landscape and close up portraits all by a single lens. Like what I have mentioned, when I go for outdoor trips with my kids, this lens will be the main weapon as it saves me the time of changing lens while handling all the "barang barang" with the kids.

In that case, I would conclude that any lens can take such pictures though a superzoom would be at the bottom of my list.

Sorry lah. Just my preference. Prefer a fast prime for portraits any day.

Lighter, faster, sharper. Bokeh is nicer too :lovegrin:

 

[molecule]

To be fair I can imagine and relate to the situation Norman described and can picture myself in the same boat. All-in-1 here goes beyond phototaking to having eyes/hands free to handle the kids plus carrying lots of additional stuff fr food containers to diapers to spare clothing, and yet be ready to shoot. I guess it's different when photo kids without needing to look after them at the SAME time. The comments here are really giving me good different viewpoints.

Switching to prime when finally sit down in restaurant indoors and hv hands a bit free. I do switching too when alternating between my camcorder and digicam. Difficult swapping equipment back & forth even when I hv both in my bag.

 

[stuck]

Precisely... this is basically my point. Any multi-purpose zoom lens is good enough for any kind of shots as long as there is ample light. IMO, the Sigma 18-200mm lens is good enuf to take photos of "fast moving kids" or even "faster moving vehicles" during the day and it allow you to take both wide landscape and close up portraits all by a single lens. Like what I have mentioned, when I go for outdoor trips with my kids, this lens will be the main weapon as it saves me the time of changing lens while handling all the "barang barang" with the kids.

just trying to play devil's advocate here... pls don take offence! ;p

if you're so busy handling your kids that changing lens is a problem.. why not consider a good compact instead? for the price you paid for the superzoom ($420??) u can get a very decent compact camera with a good zoom range that can match if not exceed the 18-200mm. no?? :dunno: just my 2 cents worth...

 

[normanho23]

just trying to play devil's advocate here... pls don take offence! ;p

if you're so busy handling your kids that changing lens is a problem.. why not consider a good compact instead? for the price you paid for the superzoom ($420??) u can get a very decent compact camera with a good zoom range that can match if not exceed the 18-200mm. no?? :dunno: just my 2 cents worth...

Aiyo... use compact so many yrs liao so decided to move to SLR for a try mah. Though it is tough to handle kids and camera at the same time but I have not regretted my decision at all coz a SLR is so versatile. I believe most compact camera can compete with SLR in terms of photo quality when you are taking outdoor shots but trust me... once indoor, the playing field is not level anymore.

Anyway, I am planning to get the waterproof Sony TX5 soon. Tried it and will highly recommend to anyone who only wants a small and sleek PNS camera. Best thing is that it is drop and water proof (Not water resistant). Can use it during raining days! Haha...

 

[detritus]

Aiyo... use compact so many yrs liao so decided to move to SLR for a try mah. Though it is tough to handle kids and camera at the same time but I have not regretted my decision at all coz a SLR is so versatile. I believe most compact camera can compete with SLR in terms of photo quality when you are taking outdoor shots but trust me... once indoor, the playing field is not level anymore.

Anyway, I am planning to get the waterproof Sony TX5 soon. Tried it and will highly recommend to anyone who only wants a small and sleek PNS camera. Best thing is that it is drop and water proof (Not water resistant). Can use it during raining days! Haha...

its great that u enjoy the superzoom so much... i just don't see it in my setup. its just not my thing.

and a dslr is capable of MUCH more than a compact... not just for indoor shots, but for outdoor portraits / scenery / macro / etc etc etc... as well. we are only limited by our creativity and technique.

try as i might, i have never been able to reproduce the same boken on a compact, whether indoor or outdoor. and this is just 1 straightforward example.

 

[normanho23]

Yup.... enjoy coz of the convenience of not changing the lens when I am busy. Anyway, someone is selling a Tamron 18-200mm Pentax mount lens in the BNS section! Price very good.