Opinion on S3 pro.

[Niccon]

I have been wondering whether to continue sourcing for a used D70 for my cousin or sell mine to him (currently on loan to him). I just learnt that s3 pro will be out this sep. My thought is tinkling to buy s3 pro. I don’t really like D70 (find it light & grip is small). Of course, s3 pro will cost about $4000-5000+. But hopefully it will be like F90x which is more expensive when I bought it; I still like it very much today after close to ten years. From the spec, s3 pro should last me for at least 5 years before I will change for a new dslr (unless there is a sudden vast improvement on other new bodies).

I wish to find out from users of s pro series how they find when compare Nikon dslr to Fuji in term of handling, performance, built & reliabilities. If anyone hears any break through in ccd technology or features implementation on Nikon coming dslr, kindly share. Any other info or opinion on s pro series is welcome.

 

[justarius]

try looking at the reviews in www.bythom.com

 

[koolcat]

had been a s2pro and s1pro user. Good cameras but not build to last. Their body is not as good as canon 1ds or mark 2, nikon d2h or d1x, olympus e1. Shuttle sound after 30000 shots is bad, need to replace.

battery don't last that long. Olympus can last for more then 1200 shots, in fact i never drained out the battery.

good sensor, very good flesh tones. can produce large files as large as 70meg + per raw files converted thru computer by using the appropriate software.

Over all it is just alright, if you are looking for a high mp camera that's the one for you. if not get something that will last longer or have a more promising future...

 

[Niccon]

Shuttle sound after 30000 shots is bad, need to replace.

battery don't last that long.

thanks for the feeback. But does the above problems happen to both s1&2 bodies?

 

[nightpiper]

Of course, s3 pro will cost about $4000-5000+. But hopefully it will be like F90x which is more expensive when I bought it; I still like it very much today after close to ten years. From the spec, s3 pro should last me for at least 5 years before I will change for a new dslr (unless there is a sudden vast improvement on other new bodies).

not to splash cold water but fat chance that the S3 is going to last 5 years. in DSLR, the lower consumer grade is not meant to last anything more than 2 yrs w/o replacing expensive parts. S3 is still based on the F80 body, which is just sheet metal, plastic & glue. also not forgetting the grade of electronic components they used inside is lower. you want something that will last 5yrs, you are looking at D1 series or rather, the high end series.

strangely, so far no nikon mount compatible manufacturer uses the F100 body to make an intermediate grade DSLR. probably its because of better profit from lower grade bodies.

just my 2 cents.

 

[kracker5]

-I'm a S2Pro user
-colours definitely much better than similarly priced DSLR cameras
-build & batteries important, but ultimate you want quality output
-S2Pro delivers that kind of output
-I have blown up RAW to TIFF files up to 12 by 16 inches, quality is good
-S3 Pro will up the ante by improving the dynamic range of colours & introducing specific film modes - a triumph for velvia & reala lovers!

 

[b18]

What sort of photography area you are in ?

I used S2 Pro mostly for landscape work and studio, while my D1H is for sport. To think of it, the D1H overlap most of my S2 functions :think:

S2 Pro is a good cam, and I believe the S3 Pro will be too.
And looking at the body construction spec, I think they will be more robust.

But shutter life wise, as they are build from F80 mechanism.. well ... give n take 50k frames? :dunno:

=bob=

 

[nightpiper]

But shutter life wise, as they are build from F80 mechanism.. well ... give n take 50k frames? :dunno:

=bob=

50k frames tolerance? woa... thats a big tolerence to accept. if all of us gang up & not pay through our noses, the manufacturers will have no choice but to lower their prices. $4k-$5k is a lot of money to me for a DSLR, my expectation definitely is going to be very much higher than a D70... but for a F80 body with a big tolerence to compromise, i will give it a miss.

i have a F80 & its starting to fall apart, so i know what makes a F80. any DSLR that uses a F80 body & charge more than $2k, is a no no for me irregardless of how great the electronics claimed to be.

electronic parts r cheap except for those ASICs & CCD. how many of these exp parts r found inside a DSLR? 3 ASICs maybe & 1 CCD compare to thousands of cheap caps & resistors.

i really hope buyers can be more rationale with DSLR purchases & only then will the manufacturers bring down their prices.

i can safely say even if the manufacturer sells the DSLRs at 40% discount, they still make money. my ex collegue bought a 10D from canon last march last year becos he was doing a promo job for them, canon sold him at $1.5k only!! canon still make a little from $1.5k. so u see, how we as consumers, r being 'strangle' by them.

ALL CONSUMERS UNITE!! DON'T GIVE IN TO LOWER GRADE PRODUCT WITH RIDICULOUS PRICING NO MATTER HOW GREAT THE MANUFACTURERS CLAIM THEIR ELECTRONICS TO BE!!

 

[johnyu]

not to splash cold water but fat chance that the S3 is going to last 5 years. in DSLR, the lower consumer grade is not meant to last anything more than 2 yrs w/o replacing expensive parts.

I second you, nightpiper.

Ken Rockwell (of http://www.kenrockell.com) wrote that DSLR should be treated as disposable, not unlike how we treat PCs. (Darn, he's referring to not only consumer grade, but also the D1 series!) While this is something hard to swallow, this is very true, at least as of 2004.

 

[Niccon]

i can safely say even if the manufacturer sells the DSLRs at 40% discount, they still make money.

You are right to say they still make money. For consumer product that last a few years, I am not surprise that the manufacturing cost can be half of selling price since mass production make they cheap. In fact, most of the cost goes to ad & production line setup (so using same body will save some cost on startup).

However, I am more concern about the built in this case, will last a few years only (after spending close to 3x D70 price)? I have heard good reviews about the colour s2 pro produce & more features in the up coming s3 pro. This what make me consider for s3 pro since no news from nikon on the new dslr.

Do photo subject makes a different on CCD? Anyway, I am more on outdoor photography like landscape, nature & sometime street.

How is the software interface, do fuji or third parties provide good support?

 

[johnyu]

Do photo subject makes a different on CCD? Anyway, I am more on outdoor photography like landscape, nature & sometime street.

Yes. CCD is not as good as film handling landscape. Read this: http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/filmdig.htm

But in practice, if you don't often blow the image up, it doesn't really matter.

 

[nightpiper]

However, I am more concern about the built in this case, will last a few years only (after spending close to 3x D70 price)? I have heard good reviews about the colour s2 pro produce & more features in the up coming s3 pro. This what make me consider for s3 pro since no news from nikon on the new dslr.

Do photo subject makes a different on CCD? Anyway, I am more on outdoor photography like landscape, nature & sometime street.

How is the software interface, do fuji or third parties provide good support?

i can only say that the fuji is not worth the price. D70 is so much more advance & faster compare to the aged F80 technologies used in the S3. if you want provia look, go download a custom curve.

i m sure many nikon DSLR users r happy to show u links to galleries of landscape & nature using D70.

just becos' fuji put the word super on their CCD doesn't mean its really super. its a good CCD but not really that great to the extend of $4k+.

look at history of S2. when it was first launch, it cost around $4.5k. then came D100, the price drop to ~$3.8k. shortly came the 10D which kills off everybody, S2 price drop to ~$3.2k & now presently stabilise at ~$2.9k. when fuji sells u at ~2.9k, they still make good money & the shop that sells u also make money. so why pay so much for the upcoming S3?

i read the new features on the S3 as well & frankly, it really doesn't justify the price. why pay $3.2k for F80 when u can get a F100 for $1.5k? u get my analogy? for 3.2k, the next choice will be the F5.

hope i don't sound too offending.

 

[XXX Boy]

i can only say that the fuji is not worth the price. D70 is so much more advance & faster compare to the aged F80 technologies used in the S3. if you want provia look, go download a custom curve.

i m sure many nikon DSLR users r happy to show u links to galleries of landscape & nature using D70.

just becos' fuji put the word super on their CCD doesn't mean its really super. its a good CCD but not really that great to the extend of $4k+.

look at history of S2. when it was first launch, it cost around $4.5k. then came D100, the price drop to ~$3.8k. shortly came the 10D which kills off everybody, S2 price drop to ~$3.2k & now presently stabilise at ~$2.9k. when fuji sells u at ~2.9k, they still make good money & the shop that sells u also make money. so why pay so much for the upcoming S3?

i read the new features on the S3 as well & frankly, it really doesn't justify the price. why pay $3.2k for F80 when u can get a F100 for $1.5k? u get my analogy? for 3.2k, the next choice will be the F5.

hope i don't sound too offending.

With 3.2k, I rather get a used Leica M6 and I can be dead sure that it will last me for at least another 20 years of good use. Why bother to keep changing cameras just becoz of the mega-pixel count?

 

[nightpiper]

aiyah, mr niccon is probably interested in the SR superCCD sensor & not so much of the mega pixels lah. fuji claimed their extra R pixels can bring a much higher dynamic range compare to conventional ones.

so far what i read was that its only so-so. the biggest gain from dynamic range for S3 comes from the 14bit ADC instead of the common 12bit type. if you think 14bit is worth $4k+, then nobody is going to stop u from splurging. don't forget we r now into 64bit computing & even for 16bit DSP, is kind of old in the their own world.

yes, u cud get a leica but we r comparing nikons & nikon compatibles here. so a $3.2k shud get u a F5 which is far better then F80. thats my analogy for S3 & D70. why pay a high price for something thats old? not unless its an antique, but F80 is not.

 

[Niccon]

You are right; I am interested in dynamics range. After more reading, realise new improvement isn’t worth that much (I don’t think the production cost is any much higher than s2 pro since modification is more on electronics & some development). The improvement more or less is blown out of proportion. I think s2 pro 2900 + new improvement 300 = s3 pro price 3200 (my wishful thinking). I guess I will wait till reviews are out or nikon announce new dslr before deciding.

 

[ST1100]

Just how much more dynamic range does the S3pro boast?

 

[nightpiper]

fuji claimed it rivals film. i think the DEE function from nikon is another cheaper option.

only when the real product is out can we see its true 'prowess'.

 

[yowch]

You don't really get more dynamic range. At 24 bits, it is still 256 colours per channel. Even with higher bits (32 bits, 48 bits), the colour you see isn't going to be much more. What Fuji is selling is that you can capture more shadow detail and less blown out highlights. The trade-off is that you have reduced mid tones. The good news is that, with the Super CCD SR II, you can mix the proportion of the two types of CCDs on the chip. The effect is a claimed sensitivity of 400% over normal CCDs, but the output is still limited by your monitor, inkjet printing or photo lab printing. More shadow details, less blown highlights, but narrower mid-tones, but that's tha Velvia is about, right?

And $4k? If I have the money, YES! I value final image quality. But I don't have the money, so I have just gave up waiting and paying and bought a 2nd hand S2pro instead. I suppose th3 S3pro will be great for those shooting outdoor portraits professionally.

 

[Niccon]

What Fuji is selling is that you can capture more shadow detail and less blown out highlights. The trade-off is that you have reduced mid tones. The good news is that, with the Super CCD SR II, you can mix the proportion of the two types of CCDs on the chip. The effect is a claimed sensitivity of 400% over normal CCDs, but the output is still limited by your monitor, inkjet printing or photo lab printing. More shadow details, less blown highlights, but narrower mid-tones, but that's tha Velvia is about, right?

Some articles claimed two-stop but I disagreed. Cant measure by stop. It just gave more detail under bright light condition especially on contrast & shadow as mentioned above.

 

[nightpiper]

More shadow details, less blown highlights, but narrower mid-tones, but that's tha Velvia is about, right?

my impression of velvia is colour saturation, not narrow mid tones. in fact velvia mid tone is too saturated for skin tone use. i have tried scanning a velvia & reducing the saturation, the skin tone comes out very good!

if i have $4k to buy a DSLR, i will make sure its really durable & reliable. pic quality wise, in today digital advancement, i wouldn't worry too much. any brand & model u pick looks very good & can be further enhanced.

so make your purchase carefully & objectively. money is hard to earn & even harder to save. u really don't want to see a $4k camera send for major operation in less than 2yrs.