[Numnumball] Rain, Shine and Sunrays!! At Bedok Reservoir this morning~!

[Yapster]

Yapster, i am using Aperture 3 with CS4 btw.. And i am aware of the high dynamic range FX have to offer..

But i used any sort of fill light technique in post, mostly is straight out of the cam, i only make the WB warmer.. Applied GND and spot through the clear portion of the GND..

Thanks for sharing your post processing workflow.. loss for words..haha.

Its very very informative and guess i still have a long way to go to attain that kinda level u n nightmare had attained

Thks alot for taking your precious time off in writing the above..i hope to improve more~! And shoot with u oneday~!!

Oh... I have no experience with Aperture and CS4 (was on CS2 and changed to CS3 recently due to change of platform). That's why i said "i guess".

There are many tweaking/setting that may affect that halo unnatural look.

If it is straight out of cam, and based on what you mentioned, then maybe this is what happen.

Your spot meter for the foreground and if i am not wrong, overexpose already (with reference to the background, retained by the GND). This may be why some are saying, your foreground is brighter than your background.

And personally, when i use GND, i go Matrix metering. Since i am using the GND to balance the whole scene, i might as well meter for the balance of the whole scene. Then i bracket to retain overall highlights and expose shadows and clean up later.

There is nothing wrong with spot metering though. Some do like to expose for different subject or foreground/background individually and blend them. That is why some don't need GND if they don't mind more work in blending.

But the exposure for the individual subject better be accurate or take a few bracketed shots to play safe. If not, one will go home to see his/her foreground 3-5 stops brighter than the sky...

As to when to use GND/what metering to use, it is all based on experience, trial and error and preference. We all do know there is no magic setting/setup for a particular scene by now la.

And err, night86mare's experience, knowledge and skill is much higher than mine. His eye for landscape composition and understanding of lighting condition is something i can only try harder to learn.

You are welcome. I am just trying to express my views with further explanation (and long winded) to why i see them this way.

You (guys) will improve one la. Just keep trying and sometimes, can take a break to view others' photos (there are tonnes online) and get some inspiration.

 

[Yapster]

*starts jotting down notes furiously*

Must pay copyright hor. :bsmilie:

Joking.

Just try to think through and make it part of what you will consider when you go shoot ba. Easier that way.

And my views no guarantee correct hor. Don't flame me. :nono:

:bsmilie:

 

[wildcat]

I made the same mistake recently too. (wildcat should know.)

Must pay copyright hor. :bsmilie:

Joking.

Just try to think through and make it part of what you will consider when you go shoot ba. Easier that way.

And my views no guarantee correct hor. Don't flame me. :nono:

:bsmilie:

I need to improve my stalking skills :embrass:

Generally this was a recce trip, so I should have run along with NNB when he was running all over the place finding primary elements. I am generally quite slow in my CPU one, so need (at least) 3-4 trips back to same place before I "geddit". I also need to go home before can "think thru" - related to the slow CPU issue mentioned above. Hope I got enough info for this field trip to think through thoroughly before the next one!

There's a lot of good stuffs in the things you write.. need to read and re-read (no need to mention about the slow CPU anymore, call it low wattage bulb if you want )

 

[Yapster]

I need to improve my stalking skills :embrass:

Generally this was a recce trip, so I should have run along with NNB when he was running all over the place finding primary elements. I am generally quite slow in my CPU one, so need (at least) 3-4 trips back to same place before I "geddit". I also need to go home before can "think thru" - related to the slow CPU issue mentioned above. Hope I got enough info for this field trip to think through thoroughly before the next one!

There's a lot of good stuffs in the things you write.. need to read and re-read (no need to mention about the slow CPU anymore, call it low wattage bulb if you want )

You "stalked" me before i edited my reply. :bsmilie:

I edited because it may be pretty confusing regarding the overcast. You can show Bryan the link to what night86mare and i discussed about the overall lighting.

Ya la, but some location really don't have suitable foreground and stuff for shooting. I dumped quite many shots from fruitless trips (except to enjoy the sunset with my eyes) and they never made it for posting. But once a while, i go back to see see and look for new perspective again. Hahaha.

Observing weather is something i am also learning. Sometimes, the noon sky is like, so cloudy.. But end up, during sunset, the clouds disappeared or the light shining through the clouds (not those super dense type) produce beautiful lights... So end of the day, must really go to location and try your luck.

I understand the pain of slow CPU, especially when running Photomatix. I just changed my computer after my 4.5 years old laptop cannot tahan anymore. :bsmilie:

 

[wildcat]

I understand the pain of slow CPU, especially when running Photomatix. I just changed my computer after my 4.5 years old laptop cannot tahan anymore. :bsmilie:

I not referring to my physical computer hardware. That one has no problem, top of the line stuff. It's the internal photographer who is the low wattage bulb... i.e. me.

 

[Numnumball]

Ya, i was suggesting, maybe you can control the blending a bit, if not, it may look like HDR. Unless that is what you want.

Hmm, here's the earlier link i have use for learning.

Digital Blending

There are 3 methods mentioned (actually 2 because the last one you will need to pay for some action).

I chose the easier one previously (2nd one, Layer Mask) but realise i am not good in controlling the "Gaussian Blur" part.

So i went for this by David Clapp recently (I have saved the link quite some time back, but only after re-organizing my favourites bookmarks then i realised i have it.:bsmilie

Exposure Blending Basics

But he don't encourage GND. This part, subjective. I will still use the GND unless there is some composition limit.

I think there are more methods online that can be found. Whatever method it is, as long as one is comfortable and satisfied with the output, can liao.

Terribly sorry for the late reply, bugged by work till quite late last night..

Thanks for showing me the link, the one from luminous landscape is where i picked up digital blending as well~1 But i am only on it for 6 mths whereabts..

i am using the layer Masking method also~!! .. still need to polish up my processing skills :sweat:

The one by David Clapp, seriously i find it to be a gd read.. Although i swear by my beloved GNDs most of the time i have to agree with him that GND has its limitations when it comes to buildings/other background elements that form part of ur sky.. so Blending still the way to go.

I still considered myself as a novice in landscape photography..looks like i must 拜你为师 liao =D

 

[Numnumball]

If it is straight out of cam, and based on what you mentioned, then maybe this is what happen.

Your spot meter for the foreground and if i am not wrong, overexpose already (with reference to the background, retained by the GND). This may be why some are saying, your foreground is brighter than your background.

And personally, when i use GND, i go Matrix metering. Since i am using the GND to balance the whole scene, i might as well meter for the balance of the whole scene. Then i bracket to retain overall highlights and expose shadows and clean up later.

But Yapster, wont matrix metering take into the account of the entire frame? including the denser portion of the GND...? in that case, we might get partial compensation..

Ok, thks for sharing ur workflow, i might be wrong somehow, maybe i try ur method one of these days.. hee

There is nothing wrong with spot metering though. Some do like to expose for different subject or foreground/background individually and blend them. That is why some don't need GND if they don't mind more work in blending.

But the exposure for the individual subject better be accurate or take a few bracketed shots to play safe. If not, one will go home to see his/her foreground 3-5 stops brighter than the sky...

As to when to use GND/what metering to use, it is all based on experience, trial and error and preference. We all do know there is no magic setting/setup for a particular scene by now la.

And err, night86mare's experience, knowledge and skill is much higher than mine. His eye for landscape composition and understanding of lighting condition is something i can only try harder to learn.

You are welcome. I am just trying to express my views with further explanation (and long winded) to why i see them this way.

You (guys) will improve one la. Just keep trying and sometimes, can take a break to view others' photos (there are tonnes online) and get some inspiration.

Yup, agreed with u GND is good to have (though can make do without) as these can be easily replicated post with more work if u really determined to do..

Normally i will meter for BG then FG and determine the strength of the GND i need between the 2.. I might have miscalculate for this one ( sometimes when u see such a wonderful scene, u have the tendency to get kancheong and freak out..haha)

And Thanks for tips for that 'prudent" approach in bracketting.. which is what i normally do nw if i decided that the scene is worth a keeper so i can still go bk and blend/play ard to make a better output.. hee..

U r too modest, It very inspiring looking at ur works, it give me the drive to work as hard as u do.. Really take my hat off u and nightmare in ur dedication to landscape photography.. putting in so much effort in "perfecting" that shot That's worth posting
:thumbsup:

 

[Numnumball]

Must pay copyright hor. :bsmilie:

Joking.

Just try to think through and make it part of what you will consider when you go shoot ba. Easier that way.

And my views no guarantee correct hor. Don't flame me. :nono:

:bsmilie:

Har, mus pay hwr? i ard printed out and frame them and pasted on the wall liao :sweatsm: :bsmilie:

 

[Numnumball]

I need to improve my stalking skills :embrass:

Generally this was a recce trip, so I should have run along with NNB when he was running all over the place finding primary elements. I am generally quite slow in my CPU one, so need (at least) 3-4 trips back to same place before I "geddit". I also need to go home before can "think thru" - related to the slow CPU issue mentioned above. Hope I got enough info for this field trip to think through thoroughly before the next one!

There's a lot of good stuffs in the things you write.. need to read and re-read (no need to mention about the slow CPU anymore, call it low wattage bulb if you want )

:bsmilie:

U need to start gym training with me liao bor.. i tell u ..i guaranteed u can run twice as fast in 3 weeks time..

 

[Numnumball]

I not referring to my physical computer hardware. That one has no problem, top of the line stuff. It's the internal photographer who is the low wattage bulb... i.e. me.

wah kaoz.. how old are u only.. U senior member, not senior citizen leh brother... we are only few yrs apart.. wont tt make me old as well?? :dunno: :bsmilie:

 

[wildcat]

U need to start gym training with me liao bor.. i tell u ..i guaranteed u can run twice as fast in 3 weeks time..

*scared* :sweat::sweatsm::bheart:

 

[Numnumball]

*scared* :sweat::sweatsm::bheart:

I give u free trial oneday den we tok abt pricing.. lol

 

[Yapster]

But Yapster, wont matrix metering take into the account of the entire frame? including the denser portion of the GND...? in that case, we might get partial compensation..

Ok, thks for sharing ur workflow, i might be wrong somehow, maybe i try ur method one of these days.. hee

Oh yea, this part, depends on what mode one is using.

I assumed you are using Manual Mode.

Metering of any kind is a rough gauge when we are using Manual Mode. The shutter speed and aperture is still determine by us.

For accuracy, some uses histogram instead to judge.

The reason why i choose Matrix is, ya, take into account of the entire frame.

I make use of the meter bar on the top LCD to see how much i have to adjust and then i adjust my shutter speed according to the whole frame (metering sometimes also not accurate, got to tweak 1/2-1 stop base on what i want).

As long as the sun is up, contrast is high, i will use the method i mentioned earlier (turn away or wait etc etc).

Personally, i always try to wait for that "golden" moment these days. After sun rise/ Before sun set, i will shoot away from the sun if possible.

There is nothing wrong with the spot metering method you mentioned you use, but must be careful lor.

If you just spot meter for the rock with say Aperture priority/Manual Mode, and you stick/adjust to the setting/meter gauge it gave you, then hmm, there may be chance the camera miscue.

Again, no right or wrong method as long as one is comfortable la. But for me, i try as much as possible to adjust base on what i see on the LCD (it can be deceiving sometimes, that's why some don't trust it) and bracket to play safe (for recovery and retaining).

 

[Yapster]

And Thanks for tips for that 'prudent" approach in bracketting.. which is what i normally do nw if i decided that the scene is worth a keeper so i can still go bk and blend/play ard to make a better output.. hee..

Ya, i did this to play safe with the exposure. I'm not a "one shot one kill" kind when it comes to landscape.

Sometimes our eyes also hay wired esp after a period of looking into the sun and then look near our LCD on our camera (near the foreground).

Our eyes can adapt due to our eyes' wide dynamic range (best in the world...:bsmilie but sometimes too slow to react.

Har, mus pay hwr? i ard printed out and frame them and pasted on the wall liao

Joking la. ;p

Such info may be all over the net.

 

[theshooter]

hi sorry for the noob question but what do you mean by base iso? is it the lowest iso found on your cam? ie. 50 or 100?

 

[Numnumball]

Oh yea, this part, depends on what mode one is using.

I assumed you are using Manual Mode.

Metering of any kind is a rough gauge when we are using Manual Mode. The shutter speed and aperture is still determine by us.

For accuracy, some uses histogram instead to judge.

The reason why i choose Matrix is, ya, take into account of the entire frame.

I make use of the meter bar on the top LCD to see how much i have to adjust and then i adjust my shutter speed according to the whole frame (metering sometimes also not accurate, got to tweak 1/2-1 stop base on what i want).

As long as the sun is up, contrast is high, i will use the method i use earlier (turn away or wait etc etc).

There is nothing wrong with the spot metering method you mentioned you use, but must be careful lor.

If you just spot meter for the rock and you stick/adjust to the reading/meter gauge it gave you, then hmm, there may be chance the camera miscue.

Again, no right or wrong method as long as one is comfortable la. But for me, i try as much as possible to adjust base on what i see on the LCD and bracket to play safe (for recovery and retaining).

Thanks Yapster.

Yah right, i on Manual 100 % of the time.. And my workflow is identical to urs.. i will identify the lighting condition first by matrix metering (taken into account the entire frame).. I prioritized retaining highlights details so my “blinkies” are always on.. And once GND applied (after determining the strength required), I then switch to Spot metering, meter through the clear portion and EV accordingly.

1 thing learned from u is to be prudent! I must learn to bracket more shots even if I m doing single exposure with GND.. need to stalk u someday.. and learn more from u..hee

 

[Numnumball]

Ya, i did this to play safe with the exposure. I'm not a "one shot one kill" kind when it comes to landscape.

Sometimes our eyes also hay wired esp after a period of looking into the sun and then look near our LCD on our camera (near the foreground).

Our eyes can adapt due to our eyes' wide dynamic range (best in the world...:bsmilie but sometimes too slow to react.

:thumbsup:

This i totally agreed, so might easily lead to misjudgement at times.. So bracketting is still safer...heee... :sweatsm:

 

[Numnumball]

hi sorry for the noob question but what do you mean by base iso? is it the lowest iso found on your cam? ie. 50 or 100?

Depends on diff cam model..

For D700, is ISO200.

Some cam can go lower than base ISO, in Nikon case, its ISO 100 (Lo1.0) - 1 stop lower than base iso

 

[Yapster]

Thanks Yapster.

Yah right, i on Manual 100 % of the time.. And my workflow is identical to urs.. i will identify the lighting condition first by matrix metering (taken into account the entire frame).. I prioritized retaining highlights details so my “blinkies” are always on.. And once GND applied (after determining the strength required), I then switch to Spot metering, meter through the clear portion and EV accordingly.

Actually, you are more hardworking and detailed than me. :embrass:

I didn't even check the "blinkies". :bsmilie:

I just put the GND (assuming i need one here), matrix meter, adjust, shoot, check. If ok, bracket fire away. If contrast still too high, i wait (unless i want silhouette in foreground).

 

[Numnumball]

Actually, you are more hardworking and detailed than me. :embrass:

I didn't even check the "blinkies". :bsmilie:

I just put the GND (assuming i need one here), matrix meter, adjust, shoot, check. If ok, bracket fire away. If contrast still too high, i wait (unless i want silhouette in foreground).

haa..no lar.. just trying to apply whatever i learn so far outfield..hee.. i tried very hard each time i out there on sunrise (mostly) to study the light present and to get things right within the cam settings itself but couldnt help screwing up sometimes as light changes so fast (still not seasoned yet and cannot react fast enough:sweat

Bro, i wanna shoot with u oneday leh.. we arrange smeday smetime smewhere ok?:lovegrin: