Newbie issues with Hasselblad 500cm

[regit]

Dear all, I recently bought a Hassy 500cm w/ 80/2.8 from a forum member. However, it seems to have 2 issues. Since I am totally new to MF and Hasselblad, I am hoping that there were something that I did wrongly, and need not to send it back for repair/servicing. Please advice on the following, thank you:

1) Focusing issue.
After pulling 5 rolls, I consistently get a back focus issue. I thought that there may be a calibration issue with the mirror or focusing screen... Seller suggested that this may be a issue with the magazine and suggested to change another back. Before that happens, I thought of getting some feedback here as well:

2) Partial frame exposure at high speed.
When shooting at 250 or 500, I only get partial exposure to the entire film. At first I though the mirror is not returning quick enough. But looking at these, seems like only the middle bit is expose, which may suggest that the rear curtain is not opening fast enough.

 

[starvingjack]

these seems pretty bad to me, if it wasn't stated, are you able to get a refund?

 

[sprewell]

i think you should ask for refund...

 

[Shawn]

I agree, totally ask for a refund. Seller should have tested the camera with a roll of film before selling.

 

[hondasleeper]

I think the issue here is with the lens and nothing to do with the body

On the hasselblads, they use leaf shutters, which are in the lens itself. And there might be a chance the shutter blades might be sticking a little. Your back focusing issue is probably something with the lens, got nothing to do with the back or your focusing screen.

I would either get a refund or send the camera in for servicing and get the seller to pick up the bill for it. And if that still doesn't solve the problem get a full refund.

Without actually holding the camera, it is kind of hard to figure out exactly what the problem is. You could try bringing the camera down to the Camera Workshop and see if they can figure out what the problem is.

 

[regit]

Thank you for the comments. The seller is a nice chap and he is as confused when he saw the partially exposed exposures. As agreed, I'll try out the other back and if that does not work, he will do a refund.

I'll report back to see if indeed another back can resolve the issues.

 

[regit]

I think the issue here is with the lens and nothing to do with the body

On the hasselblads, they use leaf shutters, which are in the lens itself. And there might be a chance the shutter blades might be sticking a little. Your back focusing issue is probably something with the lens, got nothing to do with the back or your focusing screen.

I would either get a refund or send the camera in for servicing and get the seller to pick up the bill for it. And if that still doesn't solve the problem get a full refund.

Without actually holding the camera, it is kind of hard to figure out exactly what the problem is. You could try bringing the camera down to the Camera Workshop and see if they can figure out what the problem is.

I would think that there is some truth in what the seller is saying. if the film plane is off affecting the lens register, wouldn't that leads to front/back focusing. So, instead of moving the lens group forward and backward, a not well-tension film back may have the same effect. I am now using the new back for test, waiting for the film to dry so I can scan and verifiy.

As for the partially exposed film, if the leaf shutter is sticking, it would probably lead to overexposure rather than what I am observing. In any case, I can confirm that it is either the mirror or the rear curtain and not the leaf shutter in the lens, I did a pre-release (which release the mirror and rear curtain, I got a fully exposed frame (as seen from the wet negatives).

 

[regit]

I've scanned the negs done with the new backs and the focus does seems to improve somewhat, though it is still a tad off (now within 10-15cm as opposed to previously of 1/2 metre). For once I am able to see some reasonable shots ...

A larger crop of the above. Note that the focus is on the eyes, but a the critical focus is somewhat behind...

Nonetheless, I will ask for a refund as I suspect, the back would not do miracle to the partially exposed frame issue. I did pair shots with and without pre-release and I can see that it is either the mirror or the rear shutter (since they are the ones that got released in pre-releasing).

Now, I need to look for another good set ...

 

[catchlights]

focusing issue could be the focusing screen does not fix properly, could the pressure plate lose.

the lens is leaf shutter, if the shutter or aperture blade do not function well, you will have inconsistent exposure.

and from the partial black out image you shown, the problem is not on the lens, I think is either the mirror or the rear plate (more likely since it is top and bottom part of the image affected) does not function well.
http://www.urmonas.net/manuals/500cm/500cm-14.jpg

hope this help.

 

[regit]

focusing issue could be the focusing screen does not fix properly, could the pressure plate lose.

the lens is leaf shutter, if the shutter or aperture blade do not function well, you will have inconsistent exposure.

and from the partial black out image you shown, the problem is not on the lens, I think is either the mirror or the rear plate (more likely since it is top and bottom part of the image affected) does not function well.
http://www.urmonas.net/manuals/500cm/500cm-14.jpg

hope this help.

Thank you for the input, which reinforce my thoughts to hondasleeper. Both the seller and I are still scratching our heads on the partial frames issues. As he noted, if indeed it is the rear plate, wouldn't the "blocked" parts be horizontal along the long side of the film rather than vertical? Hmmm... :think:

 

[catchlights]

Thank you for the input, which reinforce my thoughts to hondasleeper. Both the seller and I are still scratching our heads on the partial frames issues. As he noted, if indeed it is the rear plate, wouldn't the "blocked" parts be horizontal along the long side of the film rather than vertical? Hmmm... :think:

the film for Hasselblad travel vertically, not like 35mm SLR camera, and the rear plate have two pieces, top and bottom.

 

[singscott]

Hi there here your problems.

First the back focus problem is either your focusing screen is not fix properly or your film back mag's pressure plate is out of order but the mostly likely fault I guess is your 80mm lens need to be re-calibrate.

Second black lines fault is that the 500cm body rear curtains or shutters is faulty. Some might be puzzle, indeed hasselblad V system 500 series body have a shutter or a curtains as well as the leaf shutter on the lens. These body shutters needs to fully open before proper exposure can be made.

Anyway services are definite need before the full potential of this great camera can be utilities

 

[chiif]

Hi there here your problems.

First the back focus problem is either your focusing screen is not fix properly or your film back mag's pressure plate is out of order but the mostly likely fault I guess is your 80mm lens need to be re-calibrate.

Second black lines fault is that the 500cm body rear curtains or shutters is faulty. Some might be puzzle, indeed hasselblad V system 500 series body have a shutter or a curtains as well as the leaf shutter on the lens. These body shutters needs to fully open before proper exposure can be made.

Anyway services are definite need before the full potential of this great camera can be utilities

Scott is spot on...

But one question.. did you use a A24 back?

 

[regit]

Scott is spot on...

But one question.. did you use a A24 back?

Indeed!!! How would you know? :think:

 

[chiif]

Indeed!!! How would you know? :think:

Well.. that's the reason...

The pressure plate on the A24 back is different from the A12 back. Reason being that the 120 film has a paper backing and the 220 film which uses the A24 back doesn't. Most people ignored this subtle difference. You will only notice it when you blow up. Hence the back focus problem you are facing.

The film back pressure plate will affect your image sharpness. That is why, we have always been advice not to touch the pressure plate of the camera.

As for the half image, it's nothing to do with your lens. Scott is correct in saying the rear curtain is faulty or not in sync. Usually, the rear "flap" curtain should hold open longer than your lens leaf shutter. If it closes earlier, then there is a problem with your 500CM.

Usually when we shoot, we will hold on to the shutter a while longer. Not snap the shutter, hence, we will never experience the "half frame" problem that you are seeing. When the shutter is release, the flap returns to the close position. Nevertheless, there could be a problem with the body.

Hope that helps...

 

[singscott]

Wow seen like Chiif is the real hassy pro here using a 120 film on a 220 mag do shift the pressure plate on the film mag.

 

[chiif]

Wow seen like Chiif is the real hassy pro here using a 120 film on a 220 mag do shift the pressure plate on the film mag.

Aiyo... I don't even shoot for a living... how can be pro?

I just love cameras... and most of the hassey stuff I learnt from HUG, people like you & from the old man... :bsmilie:

 

[beyond]

Chiff, I find your explaination helpful. Thanks for sharing.

 

[regit]

Usually when we shoot, we will hold on to the shutter a while longer. Not snap the shutter, hence, we will never experience the "half frame" problem that you are seeing. When the shutter is release, the flap returns to the close position. Nevertheless, there could be a problem with the body.

Hope that helps...

I believe this only affects slower shutter speed. As the issue happens only in 250 and 500 (somewhat in 125), I think there is indeed an issue with the rear shutter. The seller will check the camera out with a reputable repairer on Sat, then all will be revealed