Near Focusing using RF

[Vinnievinyl]

Dear all,

I have purchased my first rangerfinder cam on last Christmas, and yes, the image quality of those M lenses are just beyond what the SLR/DSLR can ever reach.

But I now have a problem which seems to be unique on rangefinder camera, especially the M9.

At near distant, the focusing is out by like 1". If I follow what the viewfinder's info when the double image stack nicely, there is no way I could get the 90mm f2 to have a sharp image at 1~2M.

Anyone have the same problem?

 

[Kenr1ck]

Erm. If i am not wrong, this Is due to the range finders weakness in close focus.

 

[Vinnievinyl]

At first I also thought the same, but it doesn't make sense when all of the images from Noctilux at this range and probably up to 3M are all wash out as well.

Wideangle hasn't got any prolem though, like my 2/28 and 1.4/35.

I have surfed the net and found this to be a common problem of M9 and need adjustment, but leica need 6 weeks for the adjustment. Some in the leica forum has self trained to do their own adjustment,
I wish to know if anyone who has this problem and solved the problem, like a 3rd party workshop who can do it.

 

[Cactus jACK]

Dear all,

I have purchased my first rangerfinder cam on last Christmas, and yes, the image quality of those M lenses are just beyond what the SLR/DSLR can ever reach.

But I now have a problem which seems to be unique on rangefinder camera, especially the M9.

At near distant, the focusing is out by like 1". If I follow what the viewfinder's info when the double image stack nicely, there is no way I could get the 90mm f2 to have a sharp image at 1~2M.

Anyone have the same problem?

there are a few variables that you have to isolate here, user; lens; and camera.

user : as you have assured, you have lined up the rangefinder patch nicely... there are focusing techniques, but i shall not dwell upon them, but try to use a stationary setup and one can also consider using a magnifier help.

lens : test on a couple of RF bodies, preferrably bodies that you know have no issues with front / back focusing. if the focusing is still consistently off, your lens may be off.

camera : test different lenses on the same body, preferrably lenses that you know are on the money. if the focusing is still consistent off, then your rangefinder in your body could be off.

hope this helps.

 

[Vinnievinyl]

I can confirm it is the cam. Back focus on 50mm Noct 0.95(New), 2/90 apo. same amount of focus drift.
I only notice it when I was using the 90 and 50 few days back, I've shooting with the 35mm and did not notice the issue. Only when I put on the 50 Noct and setting of f0.95 is the obviously reason buying this lens, so the problem surface....

"De camera consultant" has confirm with me this is a unique M9 issue, but he's advice is to send it back to Germany for a 6 weeks or more holiday.

I just need to know if this is the only option to go for....

 

[Anxin]

I had same problem with my M9. Noct and Lux both back-focused a bit at 1m.

Calibrated my M9 (the DIY way, took me some 40 min.) Now both lenses are spot on (nearest distance and 20m).
Technically speaking, it's safer to send it back to Germany for RF calibration (As usual, the "expert at Leica SG would ask you to send in the lenses as well. Few months later, IF every done properly over there, you should have accurate focusing (probably until you buy another new lens....)

IMHO, one needs a lot of luck to get spot on focusing on M9 out of the box.

I can confirm it is the cam. Back focus on 50mm Noct 0.95(New), 2/90 apo. same amount of focus drift.
I only notice it when I was using the 90 and 50 few days back, I've shooting with the 35mm and did not notice the issue. Only when I put on the 50 Noct and setting of f0.95 is the obviously reason buying this lens, so the problem surface....

"De camera consultant" has confirm with me this is a unique M9 issue, but he's advice is to send it back to Germany for a 6 weeks or more holiday.

I just need to know if this is the only option to go for....

 

[Vinnievinyl]

I had same problem with my M9. Noct and Lux both back-focused a bit at 1m.

Calibrated my M9 (the DIY way, took me some 40 min.) Now both lenses are spot on (nearest distance and 20m).
Technically speaking, it's safer to send it back to Germany for RF calibration (As usual, the "expert at Leica SG would ask you to send in the lenses as well. Few months later, IF every done properly over there, you should have accurate focusing (probably until you buy another new lens....)

IMHO, one needs a lot of luck to get spot on focusing on M9 out of the box.

You do it the "Julian Thomson" way as in Leica forum?

 

[Anxin]

Similar, but not exactly.

He started with infinity and then near distance. For me, nearest distance is more important for the Noct/Lux so I go for the min. first and then try to fine-tune with a distance target (that is the door plate of my opposite block, about 20+m from my window. LOL) Reason is that infinity is not a practical distance and off a bit can cause a big error for the near range. 20+m has got more room for find adjustment.

This is a 2-DOF kindof adjustment so it would take a few iterations (depending on your experience also.) This explains why those expert/consultant are reluctant to take on such job (charge you high u not happy, charge low bo hua. might as well tell u cannot do lor).

If game enough, just do it! (warranty na void mai kow bei hor)

 

[Vinnievinyl]

Dear all,

After witnessing the quality and magic produce by the M lenses, I too, was poisoned into buying my first Ranger finder.

I didn't feel the pain in the begining cause I was using the 2.8/28mm lens on it. I started to feel the pain when realizing the Close focals is out from the rangerfinder and the lens, more pain when realizing it is a pretty common "Thing"(cannot be classified as problem) with Leica's Camera, even more pain when knowing the "Thing" may most probably remain after sending the camera for a flight back to Solms.

On a lens like the Apo 2/90mm, 0.95/50mm or even 1.4/50mm, you'll find yourself in greatest pain if you wish to use the lens wide open in near range.

Leica services center also don't seems to be very enthusiastic when I called to say I want to send in the cam for adjustment..... I was talking to Mr. Toh of Cathay photo in Marina Sq, he told me this is normal in Rangerfinder camera and one just has to know the tolerance and "physical body posture and offset" require to get that sharp image. Mr. Toh end his conversation to me with a congratulating note of "Welcome to the Pain of Leica"....

So, To the Leica Users, how do you ease "The pain of Leica"??

 

[pikapig]

Ok i think you are a digital M user..thats why you mentioned Leica here....but in fact, its not just leica..all the RF system has this problem...(the title should be RF pain)

Anything below 1m is considered a bonus, think there are some lenses that can do that...but most of the time, do we really need to go that close? I think a RF is build mainly for photo journalism and street photography where you seldom need to go that close to the subject.

Just ask yourself the objective of owning this M mount lens and the M body...what will you use it for and then decide if you can have a separate camera for another purpose...

For me, i like the build of it and i love using it as a street photography camera mainly with a 35mm and 50mm range.

For tele, wide and macro, i love using my dslr!
and i don mind keeping 2 different system for them...so im happy with my RF!

 

[hydroburn249]

i think what he is talking about is not that he is unsatisfied with the minimum focusing, but that the calibration is off? since he mentioned that he wants to send to Solms for adjustment?

pardon me if i'm wrong.

 

[pikapig]

OPS I might have misread it..thanks for pointing out hydro

 

[Vinnievinyl]

Pikapig,

To some extend you are correct. I"m a Canon(Previous Nikon) & Phase one user. I use Canon for Nature, Mainly Avian, (checK My handle in NPSS and naturescape) and Phase one APtus 12R for Lanscape.

But if you have the best lens from Leica, you'll tend not to use others. Reason I've gone into Leica is because of 3 lenses, 1.4/35mm, 0.95/50 Noct and Apo2/90. I own them and love them but have diffficulty when using Noct and Apo. No other maker can produce lens equal to these three, Not all my Nikon and Canon lens, not even the hasselblad or schneider on phase one.

True issue surfaced espeacially when I use the noct, at 0.95 this is how the aperture this lens should be set and create magic! And this is when you'll need an accurate calibration of the Camera.

I have actually found a way to ease the pain a bit to some extend, that is, mounting the lens on a nex5n with adaptor. Which I can focus right to the dot and have pictures showing the 1/2 potential of this lens.

 

[artspraken]

I feel that for wide, tele and macro, its better to use DSLR.

 

[Davidnikon]

my most painful thing is to bring heavy DSLR around my neck!

no, no pain in M

 

[pikapig]

I like de AF in dslr..its like taking a holiday from work..
After 10 rolls of fast manual focusing..playing with fast af on dslr is quite fun n relaxing too

 

[bolim]

I had the same pain. I decided that it is the photographer who controls the gear rather than the other way. I started to appreciate the "thing" better. Good luck!

 

[cichlid]

For digital M, how about the small and slow LCD pain :sweat:

 

[mamypoko]

Even with some primes (50mm f/1.2L) on a DSLR setup you will get focus shift on closer focus distances.

I shoot with a Canon 50mm f/0.95 on my M film body, and its focus slightly out of place (it was calibrated for the sellers RD-1), focus is off by about 1-2cm but I compensate in the VF by having a bit of image overlap. Not perfect, but it works well for me.

Work with your gear, not for them.

 

[Vinnievinyl]

I've shoot SLR, DSLR my whole life, even got the medium format 645 with Aptus 12, which is similar to an DSLR. Lens I have on the 35mm DSLR from 14mm to 800mm, Lens on 645 from 28mm to 300mm.

But when I saw what the Leica 35mm f1.4 apsh FLE can produce, that's it. I have got to have one, and what happen next is the apo 90, and than the 0.95/50 noct..... I can get the kind of pictures I want no doubt, but the feeling is different when you know that sometime you may get it incorrectly is barking behind. The Leica representative(Solms) in charge of Asia market just send me an email saying "he thinks the sensor position of the M9 is out of tolerance", I'm still thinking to send it back or not.

Problem is it will take 6 weeks of time before I can get it back. With my Leica lenses from 21~35mm range, I can get 100% what I want in term of the image requirement, on the 50mm Noct and apo 90, no problem from 20 meters on wards.
Problem come only when I take wide open with 50mm at 0.95 and apo 90mm at f2, usually at within 1~2 meters where DOF is only 20mm for 50/0.95, especially taking pictures of Kids.... First shot have to "aga-aga", if not sharp take second one, but if you want to take the third shot.... the Kid may not perform for you anymore. I will most probably sent it in to request accuracy at near range, any further distant increase in dof should not be difficult to gauge mentally and infinity is for no brainer. At least now i have a little toy as the spare.