Leica 58mm/1.5 Sonnar LTM


Has anyone seen this before?
It is stated as a Leica 58mm/1.5 Sonnar in LTM
http://cgi.ebay.com/Leica-ltm-Sonna...iewItemQQptZCamera_Lenses?hash=item1c1069a963

From the look, it looks like a Zeiss Sonnar 50 1.5 LTM but I could be wrong. Maybe Gommy, Benny and Hacker can shred some light?

Dealt with the seller before. Bought my Canon 50 f1.5 LTM from him. He's an ok guy.
 

dun think is a rangefinder coupled lens? :)



///
 

From the look, it looks like a Zeiss Sonnar 50 1.5 LTM but I could be wrong. Maybe Gommy, Benny and Hacker can shred some light?

Dealt with the seller before. Bought my Canon 50 f1.5 LTM from him. He's an ok guy.

Same here, bought my Canon 50/1.5 from him too;p
 

The seller is an honorable chap. My Canon IIb with matching Serenar 5cm f/1.9 LTM was from him. Beautiful!

As for the 5.8cm f/1.5 and the common associated 6cm f/1.5 Sonnar lens, it's often debated.

We know for sure that Leica does not use the Sonnar optical design and hence will not mark the lens as such. So the "Leica" Sonnar 5.8cm f/1.5 lens should be avoided if you are particular about authenticity. It is also marked "Sonnarex" on some lenses. Incidentally, the lens on auction carries a "V" marking instead of "T" marking.

The use of aluminum parts on the barrel/mount is often indicative of eastern european origins, where many other bogus offerings also originates. A search on fake 5cm sonnar makes an interesting read for those interested.

In addition, Marc James Small, a respected author on LTM copies/replicas, cannot ascertain that Carl Zeiss Jenna did in fact produce the 5.8cm and 6cm Sonnar lenses. He retracted his earlier assumption that these lenses were of CZJ origins and indicated that the factory records cannot give evidence to their existence at all.

It is speculated that these odd ball lenses could have been hand built by skilled technicians in the Eastern Bloc to raise hard currency. Hence it's not impossible for some of these lenses originally meant for the M42, Exakta or Praktina mounts to be 're-presented' in the LTM format. And the nature of their underground operations could be the reason for the absence of a brand/origin marking.

Here's a Japanese page that shows the 5.8cm f/1.5 lens side by side with the 5cm f/1.5 lens.

If you just want to play with a vintage odd ball (Sonnar!) lens, by all means go for it! You might just find an optical treasure. Collectors should obviously stay far away from this one base on the (lack of) information available.

Hope the information is helpful.

Cheers,
 

While the debate rages on, Hacker holds the view that the 5.8 and 6cm copies are *not* genuine. Of course, if you can get a 7.5cm Biotar in LTM, that is a different story. I will buy from you... ;p. That is genuine.
 

We know for sure that Leica does not use the Sonnar optical design and hence will not mark the lens as such.

That was the reason Leica went the Xenon (a derivation from the Schneider version) ==> Summarit route. Intellectual property rights issues with its competitor.
 

The seller is an honorable chap. My Canon IIb with matching Serenar 5cm f/1.9 LTM was from him. Beautiful!

As for the 5.8cm f/1.5 and the common associated 6cm f/1.5 Sonnar lens, it's often debated.

We know for sure that Leica does not use the Sonnar optical design and hence will not mark the lens as such. So the "Leica" Sonnar 5.8cm f/1.5 lens should be avoided if you are particular about authenticity. It is also marked "Sonnarex" on some lenses. Incidentally, the lens on auction carries a "V" marking instead of "T" marking.

The use of aluminum parts on the barrel/mount is often indicative of eastern european origins, where many other bogus offerings also originates. A search on fake 5cm sonnar makes an interesting read for those interested.

In addition, Marc James Small, a respected author on LTM copies/replicas, cannot ascertain that Carl Zeiss Jenna did in fact produce the 5.8cm and 6cm Sonnar lenses. He retracted his earlier assumption that these lenses were of CZJ origins and indicated that the factory records cannot give evidence to their existence at all.

It is speculated that these odd ball lenses could have been hand built by skilled technicians in the Eastern Bloc to raise hard currency. Hence it's not impossible for some of these lenses originally meant for the M42, Exakta or Praktina mounts to be 're-presented' in the LTM format. And the nature of their underground operations could be the reason for the absence of a brand/origin marking.

Here's a Japanese page that shows the 5.8cm f/1.5 lens side by side with the 5cm f/1.5 lens.

If you just want to play with a vintage odd ball (Sonnar!) lens, by all means go for it! You might just find an optical treasure. Collectors should obviously stay far away from this one base on the (lack of) information available.

Hope the information is helpful.

Cheers,


Agreed that the seller is reputable. However, I did have some issues with his description which was not accurate. I did ask him after I've received the lens and he admitted his omission due to the many lenses he sells on ebay and was willing to refund or return. I rejected the refund and kept the lens.
 

While the debate rages on, Hacker holds the view that the 5.8 and 6cm copies are *not* genuine. Of course, if you can get a 7.5cm Biotar in LTM, that is a different story. I will buy from you... ;p. That is genuine.

and hacker will sell to me....:bsmilie:;p...hacker is the best....
 

That was the reason Leica went the Xenon (a derivation from the Schneider version) ==> Summarit route. Intellectual property rights issues with its competitor.

A different discussion altogether... but nevertheless interesting as it eventually evolved into the Summilux that many of you guys have grown to love. From that point onwards, Leica is no longer second fiddle to Zeiss.

Cheers,
 

if you can get a 7.5cm Biotar in LTM, that is a different story. I will buy from you... ;p. That is genuine.

I can get. :bsmilie:

Cheers,
 

What is the issue here? Is the issue with "brand" (ie, Zeiss or Leica don't make them in 5.8cm or 6cm) or "optical design" (ie, they are not sonnar design)?:dunno:
I have seen several of them even one branded "Leica". Always, tempted to get one to try...maybe one day...
 

Last edited:
Reference from Thiele: "Those 58 and 60mm Sonnars are from that Sonnar sourge in the 1980's, built to puzzle Leica collectors, they are 100% trumped up, billed as Leica Sonnar's, built up from Russian optics and fake CZJ rims/rings added, (I think they originated in Poland)".

CAVEAT EMPTOR!
 

interestingly, such sonnar fakes do have some alluring effect on me..
I reckon the images will resemble that of a J-3. No?
 

Back
Top