Its not cruel.we just wanna make sure we get a good picture

[Knighthunter]

It takes me a good couple minutes to find fact about blowie after reading blowfish floating up due blowing itself with air since I am not animal expert, it turn it's completely misleading statement.
Blowie ingested water to blow itself underwater and it ingest air when it was put outside water. If the blowie floating to surface due ingested air underwater it must be the diver force the regulator into blowie it to blow it up. That's what I call cruel man!

Source taken from Wiki:

The puffer's unique and distinctive natural defenses help compensate for their slow locomotion. Puffers move by combining pectoral, dorsal, anal, and caudal fins. This makes them highly maneuverable but very slow, and therefore comparatively easy predation targets. Their primary defense mechanism is to fill their extremely elastic stomachs with water (or air when outside the water) until they are much larger and almost spherical in shape. A hungry predator may suddenly find itself facing what seems to be a much larger fish and pause, giving the puffer an opportunity to retreat to safety. Out of water there is a risk that puffers inflate with air. This may result in injection with tetrodotoxin, making them an unpleasant, possibly lethal, meal for any predator. This neurotoxin is found primarily in the ovaries and liver, although smaller amounts exist in the intestines and skin, as well as trace amounts in muscle as larger fish, but it can kill humans.

 

[night86mare]

I am wonder whether you read the news last time, they consider to put this tiger for good but then again we are living in Singapore. If we killed the tiger do you think they can get replacement by scouting jungle in Bukit Timah for god sake? It just a convinience decision.

don't know which version of the news you read..

maybe you thought someone's blog was the news? :angel:

from the straits times:

http://wildsingaporenews.blogspot.com/2008/11/cleaner-killed-by-tigers-at-singapore.html

The zoo, which had to stop the tram ride and prevent visitors from entering during the incident, said yesterday that it would close the white tiger exhibit temporarily as a precautionary measure. It did not say how long the closure would last.

It said the tigers, which are nine years old and were brought in from Sumatra in 2001, would not be put down as they had acted naturally.

or did you think i would not bother to check if my memory was correct?

every article that i have seen that cries for the white tigers to be put down is the opinion of online people talking, not the zoo.

 

[Knighthunter]

why is 'scolding, accusing, or shaming' completely out of the context when there is no sign or remorse or admission of guilt for the action? the said picture had a comment that said it was cruel to harass the puffer fish. and the reply seemed a bit flippant in that there was:

1) denial of accusation (it's not cruel)
2) justification of action (we just wanna make sure we get a good photo)

Even after it was pointed out that the action harmed the fish, the said diver then commented he/she will shake the fish instead of poking it in the future to make it puff up. Showing that

1) he/she does not think it's wrong
2) he/she will do it again in the future

In this instance here, the thread goes not only to so-called shame/scold/accuse (not that i think it has happened here since we don't know the person's name and he/she probably does not visit this forum and hence nobody to accuse/scold/shame in the first place), but also to educate divers on how not to interact/touch/harass marine life.

Plus the thread also has provided people with an idea where some divers stand on certain issues as well as certain useful information is posted. (ie. how a pufferfish can die from 'puffing' up)

Bro please see my reply, there is something seriously wrong with the fact preseted here.

 

[Knighthunter]

don't know which version of the news you read..

maybe you thought someone's blog was the news? :angel:

from the straits times:

http://wildsingaporenews.blogspot.com/2008/11/cleaner-killed-by-tigers-at-singapore.html



or did you think i would not bother to check if my memory was correct?

every article that i have seen that cries for the white tigers to be put down is the opinion of online people talking, not the zoo.

Analyse, article said it would not to be put dowm --> mean they consider to put down but it not. Why??? do I need to explain again, tiger is not something that we can catch in Bukit Timah.

 

[night86mare]

Analyse, article said it would not to be put dowm --> mean they consider to put down but it not. Why??? do I need to explain again, tiger is not something that we can catch in Bukit Timah.

oh, so if i say that i would not rape a chicken, it means that i actually considered raping it?

your logic is amazing. :thumbsup: or are you just insisting on interpreting things your own way?

why they write that is simple, people cry for the tiger to be put down, but they will not put it down. it is simple, nothing to do with what you are saying. stop trying to come up with your own unique set of logic - our tigers are not even caught in singapore, for crying out loud. if the zoo puts down the white tiger, they would have to procure a new white tiger from overseas if they so choose to replace it. if the animal has gone violent and frequently attacks humans on its own accord without being provoked, that's when you put it down. nothing to do with how expensive or how rare it is.

 

[Knighthunter]

oh, so if i say that i would not rape a chicken, it means that i actually considered raping it?

your logic is amazing. :thumbsup: or are you just insisting on interpreting things your own way?

why they write that is simple, people cry for the tiger to be put down, but they will not put it down. it is simple, nothing to do with what you are saying. stop trying to come up with your own unique set of logic - our tigers are not even caught in singapore, for crying out loud. if the zoo puts down the white tiger, they would have to procure a new white tiger from overseas if they so choose to replace it. if the animal has gone violent and frequently attacks humans on its own accord without being provoked, that's when you put it down. nothing to do with how expensive or how rare it is.

Yes, using word "would" is blunt statement, not a strong statement. I won't go into details, last time I read that article with full interest and it raised lots of questions in my head. The reason act naturally statement is similar like saying freak strom in every 50 years.
Nothing is natural for animals in the zoo, why the this guys mauled by tiger is either ZOO doesn't have proper procedure for safe workplace or he is someone who was taking shortcut to do his job. White Tiger is rare and it's not so easy to get it, this only think came to my mind why this animal was not put to death. I can accept if you say they will have to spend time and $$$ to train new tiger, this is do-able but why not? It boil back to convinience (not worth the effort). Agree?

 

[night86mare]

Yes, using word "would" is blunt statement, not a strong statement. I won't go into details, last time I read that article with full interest and it raised lots of questions in my head. The reason act naturally statement is similar like saying freak strom in every 50 years.
Nothing is natural for animals in the zoo, why the this guys mauled by tiger is either ZOO doesn't have proper procedure for safe workplace or he is someone who was taking shortcut to do his job. White Tiger is rare and it's not so easy to get it, this only think came to my mind why this animal was not put to death. I can accept if you say they will have to spend time and $$$ to train new tiger, this is do-able but why not? It boil back to convinience (not worth the effort). Agree?

no, the guy was a deliberate suicide. did you read my link or not?

he worked at the zoo, and he went into the compound, went across the moat and swung his broom at the tigers.

i don't see how the zoo could have done anything at that time. that is like saying that hdb can stop all the people jumping off buildings.

you don't really "train" tigers in zoos, the singapore zoo is not really a circus, you know. keeping them in an enclosed area and feeding them domesticates them somewhat, though of course, they remain wild.

 

[Knighthunter]

Same article may create different view this is taken from you artcle linked:

"In a flash, two of the extremely rare white tigers were on him" --> extermely rare tigers involved

"Also deployed were two zookeepers armed with rifles and live ammunition, but these were not used, said the zoo's assistant director of zoology, Mr Biswajit Guha." --> which one is more precious human live or extremely rare animals? Shot all the tigers he may still alive. I prefer human life than tiger.

 

[night86mare]

nice selective quoting, i guess you also didn't bother to read the whole article to realise that by the time the keepers had reached the place, the tigers had retreated back into their dens.

anyways, i guess this is a waste of my time. this isn't a discussion, it's me talking, and you indulging in a monologue. sort of explains all of your replies, incidentally. have a nice day.

 

[Knighthunter]

nice selective quoting, i guess you also didn't bother to read the whole article to realise that by the time the keepers had reached the place, the tigers had retreated back into their dens.

anyways, i guess this is a waste of my time. this isn't a discussion, it's me talking, and you indulging in a monologue. sort of explains all of your replies, incidentally. have a nice day.

Nice quote to you too with big font, thanks for linking the article...G'day.
SHould stop here as well OT too much.

 

[antacid]

oops you're right..i made a mistake. puffers dont inflate with air (where would they find air underwater?). even so, there are cases where puffers were unable to deflate after that causing death

 

[howeikwok]

Bro please see my reply, there is something seriously wrong with the fact preseted here.

Don't know which reply you're referring to. But your previous replies are really difficult to understand in terms of the usage of english. I presented no facts, just stating my opinions on the issues here which of course you seem not to agree with but that's ok i think others here do.

 

[howeikwok]

for those keen on information on puffers. general sentiment from aquarium keepers and other sources is NOT to puff the fish as repeated stress physically or otherwise will cause the fish to DIE. Oh and if the fish takes air into the system when puffing then it's likely to die from the puffing.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Do_pea_dwarf_puffer_fish_puff_up

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Do_Puffer_fish_die_when_they_puff_up

http://www.fishlore.com/aquariummagazine/nov08/greenspottedpuffer.htm

http://www.pufferfish.net/

 

[Knighthunter]

for those keen on information on puffers. general sentiment from aquarium keepers and other sources is NOT to puff the fish as repeated stress physically or otherwise will cause the fish to DIE. Oh and if the fish takes air into the system when puffing then it's likely to die from the puffing.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Do_pea_dwarf_puffer_fish_puff_up

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Do_Puffer_fish_die_when_they_puff_up

http://www.fishlore.com/aquariummagazine/nov08/greenspottedpuffer.htm

http://www.pufferfish.net/

Don't take aquarium trade as sample as owner of salt water aquarium I realize that fishes & corals are belong to the sea. Somemore this ornamental fish trade is damn more destructive than poking puffer. They use cyanide to knock out fishes and crow bar to harvest corals. I am guilty as charge because I have lots of corals last time in my tank. Now I still have tanks with fishes that already with me for more than 4 years, I don't have heart to release them in Singapore waters it may not survive, If can relese them in Tioman then I will decommission my tank.

 

[howeikwok]

Don't take aquarium trade as sample as owner of salt water aquarium I realize that fishes & corals are belong to the sea. Somemore this ornamental fish trade is damn more destructive than poking puffer. They use cyanide to knock out fishes and crow bar to harvest corals. I am guilty as charge because I have lots of corals last time in my tank. Now I still have tanks with fishes that already with me for more than 4 years, I don't have heart to release them in Singapore waters it may not survive, If can relese them in Tioman then I will decommission my tank.

That is true however they're the best judge in the case as there are no scientific research in this area. What is recommended is a general guideline gained through experience and mistakes made. And so it comes back to same thing about not puffing up the pufferfish.

 

[allenleonhart]

most likely, nope.

the white tigers in the singapore zoo killed a man, but none were put to sleep. why? because they were provoked, and animals will be animals. reasonable people all know that.

when we shoot anything, be it landscapes, cats, birds, even models.. as responsible photographers, you should try to reduce the amount of footprint that you leave there. it is not just out of respect for the subject, there's just something wrong with affecting external parties for your own enjoyment.

so this extends from making sure that you don't dirty the environment when you shoot, if the cat doesn't like cameras then you stop shooting it, no baiting of birds to try to get your shot, and no silly comments that arise from the bottom head than the top because you have a hard-on, etc. the same applies for the puffer fish.

no baiting of birds?:think:
means not allowed to leave food out and let them come to us ar:think:

 

[diver-hloc]

That dog is defendless after becoming pet, try to do the same thing to wild dogs at Charcoal warehouse area and let me know the result. Not double standard the lady done it because she knows the dog will not retailate, if the dog bite her she will never dare to do it the scond time. But it will be sad story for the dog, most likely it will be put to sleep.

So.... its Ok to hit a something/someone as long as they are defendless and/or unable to hit back ?? :think:

So..... you support the killing of Whales and Dolphins too ?? Since they can't hit back at us when we use metal ships and explosive harpoons on them :think:

 

[rainfyre]

if the human is going to jump into the tiger enclosure....intruding with stupid intentions, its the tigers that are stressed. They should not be put down since they didnt jump out and attack others.....but were merely behaving as how they should. just because you put something into an enclosure doesnt mean you eradicate its behaviour.

 

[night86mare]

no baiting of birds?:think:
means not allowed to leave food out and let them come to us ar:think:

http://www.flickr.com/groups/1080089@N22/discuss/72157616039496921/

 

[simmeow]

oh then please go watch the cove and 'discover' for yourself the amount of toxins and heavy metals that top predators take into their system. your sushi/sashimi is full of mecury esp fish like tuna/swordfish etc.

i'm more careful taking such fish now.

I don't like sea food, I like to see food. I don't like to eat fish, I like to see them.