Is this the Ultimate Budget Travel Tripod combo?

[Canonized]

a)
f) I guess not many users in those links are as demanding as me. The ability of a ballhead to lock without any subsequent movement is fundamental to me.

First, I must say some years ago, I was looking for an affordable alternative to Arca Swiss and Arcatech and RRS were the front runners - until I read a few very detailed and very positive reviews of the Markins Q10. I was about to pony up for a Kangrinponche equivalent but when I discovered that the Markins was about the same price but there were far more positive reviews, I got the Markins instead. In actual fact back then I could not find any positive reviews of the Kangrinponche although two of my friends swore that they were great. For me, its the best Chinese made ballheads but the price is quite high in comparison to its competitors.

In any case, going back to your PC-33NS - When you mention the ability to lock without camera movements after, are you referring to vibration or creep? Vibration dampening has to do with many factors - not just the weight capacity of the head but also the ballhead size, the horizontal extension length of the camera and lens etc. The vibration frequency of the tripod also plays a part. If the head is able to lock tight but the movement is vibration, its not a ballhead issue per se. It could be wrong size head and wrong weight capacity of the tripod.

However, if there is creep of the head under its full capacity, then its a different issue. If so, I personally would go back to the retailer and show them the problem of the ball head not locking with the load under 30Kg. I did not realise that this was your problem (I did not see it in your earlier post). This I would agree to be totally unacceptable.

I recall PhotoClam gives a 3 year warranty (longer than any other ball head I know) as to quality and this sounds to me its a quality problem with the head they sold you. Again, mine does not creep and if it did, I would go back to the supplier and demand a swop. If they did not, the whole of the photographic internet community should hear of it.

I hope you will proceed to seek redress for the problems to your ballhead. The retailer's response or support should be of interest to others here looking and considering this brand.

 

[doodah]

OK, I have emailed Gin Studio (distributor) and will wait for their reply.

 

[Canonized]

I just discovered this page and thought that some may be interested to read the Photo Clam Catalogue.

Download a PDF Catalogue of Photo Clam Products from this link

 

[An drew]

I paid $280.

I also own a Kangrinpoche NB3-B. Thought I will replace it with the Photoclam ballhead 'cos I find the panning knob on the NB3-B a little tight.

I am honestly shocked that anyone will actually compare such shoddy mechanical built to a Markins ballhead. Ewww.... Guess I am better off with my current NB3-B.

Conclusion: NOTHING can replace Gitzo and Markins. One gets what one pays for.

I also uses the NB3-B and I find it very good and suitable for my needs, although it is slightly less smooth than a Q3T. $280 is not exactly cheap and if there are so many issues then one would be better off with a Markins or even Arca-Swiss ballhead, which are quite cheap now over the internet.

 

[daredevil123]

And to add more confusion (apologies for that), the Markins Q3t is also not the Holy Grail. There have been real-life experiences of the ballhead "freezing up" in extreme temperatures of -10 etc vs other ballheads which continue to perform under same conditions.

I personally own a Q3t but would think twice about using one in sub-zero temps. Under normal conditions, it should be fine.

I also used to own an Acratech Ultimate Ballhead which I thought was overhyped. I dropped it (from less than 1 metre height) just once and it was unusable ever since. That's unacceptable for such an expensive product. The latest models might be better but I have no idea.

Hmmm that is interesting to note. I've used my cheapo manfrotto 488rc2 in -25 deg C weather and it worked like a charm with no problems. Could be due to the choice of grease they used in the ballhead.

 

[hkhdbst]

To YinSheng

Total paid $290 plus $80 = $370. Saw someone trying to sell the ballhead for $100 last week in the classified section.

Seems like it is a good deal, if I don't like it maybe can sell for $90. Help to cover all transportation charges :bsmilie:

 

[wildcat]

Since this is becoming a thread for Sirui issues and stuff, thought I might as well just hop on and share an experience I had.

The plate that came with the Sirui ballhead I got apparently has problems sticking to the camera (no matter how hard I tighten with hands - no, I wasn't going to use an allen-key and risk ruining the thread on my camera body). Apparently it's an issue with the cheap plates that comes with the Sirui ballheads, and TK actually has additional screws which are supposed to fix the problem. You can ask them about it if your plate runs loose from your camera body and start panning on it's own.

My own fix included putting a layer or two of gaffer tape underneath the camera body which will help the plate get a grip when screwed on so that it will not turn. It works with or without the new screws (but of course, I obtained the newer screws from TK also).

I don't expect the world from these tripods and heads. But for the price, it's certainly worth it. Not for those who CAN afford Gitzo and Markins or better, but good for those like me, who does not plan to get a tripod setup more expensive than my 2nd hand camera body.

 

[Canonized]

Since this is becoming a thread for Sirui issues and stuff, thought I might as well just hop on and share an experience I had.

The plate that came with the Sirui ballhead I got apparently has problems sticking to the camera (no matter how hard I tighten with hands - no, I wasn't going to use an allen-key and risk ruining the thread on my camera body). Apparently it's an issue with the cheap plates that comes with the Sirui ballheads, and TK actually has additional screws which are supposed to fix the problem. You can ask them about it if your plate runs loose from your camera body and start panning on it's own.

My own fix included putting a layer or two of gaffer tape underneath the camera body which will help the plate get a grip when screwed on so that it will not turn. It works with or without the new screws (but of course, I obtained the newer screws from TK also).

I don't expect the world from these tripods and heads. But for the price, it's certainly worth it. Not for those who CAN afford Gitzo and Markins or better, but good for those like me, who does not plan to get a tripod setup more expensive than my 2nd hand camera body.

Yet another sad story of tripod brand's ballheads - and in this case QR plates. I did suggest earlier on - if budget provides, avoid the tripod brands and go with ballheads made by ballhead companies - esp those with positive reviews. Photographers need to know that the machining and materials technology for tripods and ballheads are completely different. I would only go for brand names like Manfrotto or Gitzo heads but these brands do not do suitable travel ballheads.

Having said that, this thread is now at risk of becoming like many threads on CS - the location for complaints about matters not raised by the thread starter.

While I support direct and relevant complaints of the subject of the thread itself, digressing to issues and complaints as to unrelated aspects of other products by the same brand is irrelevant to the thread.

I request that discussion, issues, comments and questions be limited on SIRUI T2205X and the PhotoClam PC-33NS - or the related companies.

Even if there are contributors who are willing to share their own views of what is their Ultimate Budget Travel Tripod Combo is welcomed.

 

[Daoyin]

As I mentioned earlier, I bought the ballhead last week after the review and had a chance to evaluate it over the past few days. My copy has no creep with the above setup. Movement is smooth. Panning OK but the reference marker is hard to make out. There is a slight gap as highlighted but I didn't noticed until I read about it here. I bought their plate ( the "69" version) which also seems to work out- no allen key, turn with a coin. Overall, I am contented with it given my criteria.

This is a good product for those moving up to "better" ballheads than the tripod ones BUT not prepared to pay the known higher end prices. I paid for a Toyota and didn't expect a Lexus. Any upside will be a bonus.

 

[blackreplica]

on a somewhat related note...i also came across a Sirui option which is IMO damn good value. The 2204 (CF 4 section instead of 5 section as per TS's tripod) with G-20 (this is the larger and more sturdy version compared to the G10 which comes with the 15xx series tripods), a very nice tripod bag, and universal mounting plate for my 500D is selling at TK for just 310 bucks. Tripod + head comes with 6 yr warranty. IMO this is incredible value

I originally tried the 15xx series tripod a while back with the G10 head at TK, using my 500D + 17-55mm. I wasnt convinced it could handle my setup well. tapping lightly on the tripod head with one finger, i could see the front of the lens vibrate a little. The legs looked a little on the skinny side for my liking, and i didnt think the puny G10 ballhead would stand up to long term (ab)use

No such problems with the much more robust thicker CF leg 2204 tripod and bigger/sturdier G-20 ballhead. Handles my setup with absolute ease and looks like is very overbuilt relative to my humble camera setup. It also has retractable spikes on the base as per the TS's 2205 i'm no pro, but this tripod/ballhead system gets 2 thumbs up from me. Especially at the cost. Never dreamed i could get this kind of quality for just over 300 bucks.

In field use i find the tripod very easy to use and just the right weight. The knobs on the ballhead are comfortable to use, appear well built and well sealed with good tolerances and most importantly, zero creep/lens movement in my field use so far. This is as stable a platform as i will ever need. Besides using it on the beach and getting sand everywhere, I also put the entire tripod in a swimming pool (see pic + 100% crop below) with just the ballhead/camera above the waterline for one of my most recent nightshots and it worked fantastic. Cleaned it off and its 100% as good as new All i had to do later was turn it upside down to the get the water out of the tubes later....lol.

Only drawback is that being 4 section, the collapsed length is a little long if you plan to use the tripod for travel (i plan to use it locally only). In return though you get a more stable platform which is easier to deploy. Also, i notice it does not go low as close to the ground (partially due to the long center post -which also comes with a tripod hook, and because the legs can only be splayed out a limited amount) as compared to other models though IMO it still goes low enough.

I've got pics on my girlfriends camera, if anyone is interested, i can get them from her and post them here

Cant recommend it enough

Here is the unedited pool pic (sharpening at 2 on my canon 500D) i took with my tripod in the pool (17-55mm f/2.8 at 17mm, f/5, 8 second exposure):

Here is an unedited 100% crop of the same image (focus plane is on the bottom portion of the tree trunk in the foreground):

 

[doodah]

Some updates and hopefully useful info for folks:

a) Will meet up with Photo Clam distributor end of the week to discuss the problem

b) Checked different models of Sirui tripods. Removed the tripod center column and scrutinized the clamping mechanism (rubber + flexibile plastic sheet under). Seems that raising & lowering of the center column as the locking knob is turned happens across the board. IOW, regardless of whether you have the T1204X, 1205X, T2204X or T2205X, it happens. It is a basic design thing (flaw). In general, it's no biggie but for a particularly demanding user such as myself, it's a no-no.

Benro tripods are a little stiff but does NOT exhibit such a problem. The clamping design is slightly different.

Gitzo tripods are smooth and also does not have such a problem.

c) Sirui and the upcoming Photo Clam tripods come from the SAME manufacturer. Consider that an insider's info.

d) Markins multi-functional grip also shows free play after tightening. Only Kangrinpoche ball-heads do not have this 'feature'. Tells you something, eh...

e) Cathay Photo provides service for Kangrinpoche ball-heads while TK does the same for Markins stuff. These brand names therefore have MAJOR advantages over their competition in Singapore.

f) One can look up this link on how to maintain one's carbon fiber tripod. Periodic degreasing, cleaning and re-greasing is advocated especially for outdoor lovers like me.

PS: I have just done (f) for a Benro tripod. Wow, it really makes a difference. Nice and smooth again. Coooool.

 

[Canonized]

on a somewhat related note...i also came across a Sirui option which is IMO damn good value. The 2204 (CF 4 section instead of 5 section as per TS's tripod) with G-20 (this is the larger and more sturdy version compared to the G10 which comes with the 15xx series tripods), a very nice tripod bag, and universal mounting plate for my 500D is selling at TK for just 310 bucks. Tripod + head comes with 6 yr warranty. IMO this is incredible value

I originally tried the 15xx series tripod a while back with the G10 head at TK, using my 500D + 17-55mm. I wasnt convinced it could handle my setup well. tapping lightly on the tripod head with one finger, i could see the front of the lens vibrate a little. The legs looked a little on the skinny side for my liking, and i didnt think the puny G10 ballhead would stand up to long term (ab)use

No such problems with the much more robust thicker CF leg 2204 tripod and bigger/sturdier G-20 ballhead. Handles my setup with absolute ease and looks like is very overbuilt relative to my humble camera setup. It also has retractable spikes on the base as per the TS's 2205 i'm no pro, but this tripod/ballhead system gets 2 thumbs up from me. Especially at the cost. Never dreamed i could get this kind of quality for just over 300 bucks.

In field use i find the tripod very easy to use and just the right weight. The knobs on the ballhead are comfortable to use, appear well built and well sealed with good tolerances and most importantly, zero creep/lens movement in my field use so far. This is as stable a platform as i will ever need. Besides using it on the beach and getting sand everywhere, I also put the entire tripod in a swimming pool (see pic + 100% crop below) with just the ballhead/camera above the waterline for one of my most recent nightshots and it worked fantastic. Cleaned it off and its 100% as good as new All i had to do later was turn it upside down to the get the water out of the tubes later....lol.

Only drawback is that being 4 section, the collapsed length is a little long if you plan to use the tripod for travel (i plan to use it locally only). In return though you get a more stable platform which is easier to deploy. Also, i notice it does not go low as close to the ground (partially due to the long center post -which also comes with a tripod hook, and because the legs can only be splayed out a limited amount) as compared to other models though IMO it still goes low enough.

I've got pics on my girlfriends camera, if anyone is interested, i can get them from her and post them here

Cant recommend it enough

Thanks very much for sharing your thoughts and photos of your new combo! Congrats on your new setup and am glad to hear that you are satisfied with them.

Also, I found it most reassuring because you crystallised a lot of my own thoughts when I was looking at the other models esp the 15XX series from Sirui. I did see the T2204 and had also the same thoughts but in the end, I had to remind myself that I am getting the legs for travel and as the T2205X was smaller and more compact, and did not loose out too much in stability, it was the compromise I was willing to accept. The good news is that there are these options for people to consider.

I must say I am quite impressed with your use of the combo. Too many times I found myself/others making the mistake of not willing to use the gear in such situations. They are tools that are meant to be used and not mothered. I plan for such use/abuse on my travel which makes it so much easier knowing its not an expensive $1k plus set up.

 

[Canonized]

Some updates and hopefully useful info for folks:

a) Will meet up with Photo Clam distributor end of the week to discuss the problem

b) Checked different models of Sirui tripods. Removed the tripod center column and scrutinized the clamping mechanism (rubber + flexibile plastic sheet under). Seems that raising & lowering of the center column as the locking knob is turned happens across the board. IOW, regardless of whether you have the T1204X, 1205X, T2204X or T2205X, it happens. It is a basic design thing (flaw). In general, it's no biggie but for a particularly demanding user such as myself, it's a no-no.

c) Sirui and the upcoming Photo Clam tripods come from the SAME manufacturer. Consider that an insider's info.

d) Markins multi-functional grip also shows free play after tightening. Only Kangrinpoche ball-heads do not have this 'feature'. Tells you something, eh...

Hi Doodah
Thanks for the update on the distributor response. Look forward to hearing what happens.

I am not sure what problem you have with the centre column of your tripod. I checked mine and it does not rise up on tightening. I wonder if anyone else has your problem. In any case, if there was a miniscule rise in the centre column when tightening, I wonder how this would affect your photography.

You made mention that the coming new tripods from Photo Clam is made by the same people who produces SIRUI? How can that be the case when Photo clam is made in KOREA and SIRUI is made in CHINA? Will Photoclam be re-badging their tripods from China?

As for the "free play" of the ballhead knob - I checked my Photo clam and Markins and there is a very slight movement after tightening. However, I am quite stumped at why this is a issue. There is a danger of missing the wood from the trees here. The point of such tools is its performance. If the Benro, Kangrinponche and any other ballheads are able to provide the zero free play, does it mean it does not creep or does it mean that the head is able to hold up the gear without problems and risks? I have had the Markins Q10 for more than three years years now and its been zero problems where its performance is concerned. As for the Photoclam, so far I have used it at least twice a week for my shoots, has proven to be a great ballhead with no issues in its performance.

Having said that, I find it most useful that there is someone who has such a fine eye for details to see where the ballhead and tripod has issues where the others are not able to see. I am sure if the brands will value your feedback and improve on their products if you are willing to let them know of it. I am sure these small aspects of finish are easily solvable issues in production.

 

[Canonized]

As I mentioned earlier, I bought the ballhead last week after the review and had a chance to evaluate it over the past few days. My copy has no creep with the above setup. Movement is smooth. Panning OK but the reference marker is hard to make out. There is a slight gap as highlighted but I didn't noticed until I read about it here. I bought their plate ( the "69" version) which also seems to work out- no allen key, turn with a coin. Overall, I am contented with it given my criteria.

This is a good product for those moving up to "better" ballheads than the tripod ones BUT not prepared to pay the known higher end prices. I paid for a Toyota and didn't expect a Lexus. Any upside will be a bonus.

Daoyin - congrats on your new tripod setup. Glad to know that it serves you well and are satisfied with the performance. Hope others have the same experience.

BTW Toyotas are very dependable and respected as well!

 

[doodah]

I am not sure what problem you have with the centre column of your tripod. I checked mine and it does not rise up on tightening. I wonder if anyone else has your problem. In any case, if there was a miniscule rise in the centre column when tightening, I wonder how this would affect your photography.

I checked different models in the shop and the rise is not minuscule at all. It's several millimeters. Will it affect photography? ABSOLUTELY. Imagine you have everything perfectly composed in the viewfinder and starts to lock the center column. Woe! The scene in the viewfinder has moved! You'll now need to recompose etc.

Here's the joke: Gitzo is fully aware of this potential issue and they have designed (and copied in the case of Benro) their column head so it does not turn or rise/fall when the locking device is turned. And that was several years ago! Can't imagine a new product exhibiting a well-known potential problem.

Not sure if you know what you're checking. It's so OBVIOUS. In fact, you can use one hand to grip the center column and the other to turn the knob. You'll feel the entire column making dramatic movements... it's unmissable. I do not know if Surui has changed their design, moved their manufacturing plant or you are simply bluffing.

You made mention that the coming new tripods from Photo Clam is made by the same people who produces SIRUI? How can that be the case when Photo clam is made in KOREA and SIRUI is made in CHINA? Will Photoclam be re-badging their tripods from China?

One possibility is the final products are assembled in China and Korea respectively. But the individual parts all come from the same source.

It's also possible that Photo Clam recently decided to outsource some of their parts. And that may explain the huge difference between your copy and the several new copies (all from the same batch) I tested in the shop. I am aware that several shops had run out of PC-33 and I am one of the 'lucky' ones to get hold of a copy from the latest batch.

As for the "free play" of the ballhead knob - I checked my Photo clam and Markins and there is a very slight movement after tightening. However, I am quite stumped at why this is a issue. There is a danger of missing the wood from the trees here. The point of such tools is its performance. If the Benro, Kangrinponche and any other ballheads are able to provide the zero free play, does it mean it does not creep or does it mean that the head is able to hold up the gear without problems and risks? I have had the Markins Q10 for more than three years years now and its been zero problems where its performance is concerned. As for the Photoclam, so far I have used it at least twice a week for my shoots, has proven to be a great ballhead with no issues in its performance.

The Kangrinpoche ball-head locks with little free play and has ZERO creep after that. I've also had it for several years, used it extensively in my hiking trips all over the world: from mountains to beaches to forests and lakes. It was tested VERY thoroughly for camera/lens creep before I bought the ball-head (quite unlike what I did when I got the hopeless Photo Clam ball-head).

You are correct this free play has no impact on functionality. HOWEVER, it is indicative of either poor mechanical design or workmanship. I showed the device to mechanical engineer friends who work in optics company and they sneered at the awful design.

On another note, the movement of the ball head upon tightening of the pan-head locking screw or multi-functional grip is TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE. ;( :angry:

Another update:
I mention in the above post I cleaned my Benro tripod. After that, I thought I could try to see if I could do the same to the Sirui tripod. I unscrewed a section of a leg and it came off very smoothly. But, lo and behold, one of the THIN plastic bushings on a leg was cracked! Sigh.... the tripod still functions flawlessly of course, but....

When I showed my mechanical friend the super thin plastic bushing in the center column, we had a good laugh at the ridiculous construction. It was totally thin and flimsy. The same thing in Gitzo and Benro tripods is extremely sturdy.

I will upload photos of the ridiculous construction at some point.

Bottom-line:

If I need to save on cash and don't mind some inconveniences, I will rather pay $50 for a simple tripod than to shell out all that cash for a stupid ballhead and tripod that won't lock without moving the mounted camera/lens.

 

[blackreplica]

I'll try extending the centre column and tightening it on my 2204 and let you guys know how it goes. I was never a fan of using it, and havent had a reason to do so yet

Canonized, truth be told i only use the hell out of my tripod because at 300 bucks i am not afraid to break it! If i had a Gitzo/Markins, which i did consider getting, i would not be so reckless. So its another plus point for getting the sirui...for me at least. Even the best tripod in the world is worthless if you are afraid to (ab)use it

 

[weixing]

Hi,

I checked different models in the shop and the rise is not minuscule at all. It's several millimeters. Will it affect photography? ABSOLUTELY. Imagine you have everything perfectly composed in the viewfinder and starts to lock the center column. Woe! The scene in the viewfinder has moved! You'll now need to recompose etc.

IMHO, most china made alternative will reach 80% of the performance of the more expensive, branded product... basically, what you paid is what you get... there is no cheap and perfect product out there. For those who had a tight budget (like me), these low cost alternative are very welcome... we just need to learn the issue and limitation of our equipment and find ways to overcome it. In this case, if the risen of the central column when locking is an issue, just lock the central column before compose.

Just my S$0.02.

Have a nice day.

 

[Canonized]

Hi,

IMHO, most china made alternative will reach 80% of the performance of the more expensive, branded product... basically, what you paid is what you get... there is no cheap and perfect product out there. For those who had a tight budget (like me), these low cost alternative are very welcome... we just need to learn the issue and limitation of our equipment and find ways to overcome it. In this case, if the risen of the central column when locking is an issue, just lock the central column before compose.

Just my S$0.02.

Have a nice day.

Thanks for your input Weixing.

Agreed - about the use of the center column. I just checked again and found that when I extended the centre column and tighten the lock, there is a slight rise.
I guess I never noticed it before because I did not notice it when I use it AND I do not use the centre column at all for my photography. In fact, I prefer tripods without them. As with you, I lock all the tripod legs and column BEFORE I compose.

Also if one does not lock the centre column before you start composing, there is the risk of the column collapsing down (esp if its on full extension) and thus damage the head or the camera gear.

Anyway, a rise of a few millimeters on locking does not impact on images where the subject is a wide expense of scenery in landscape photography (which I do for travel). (HOWEVER, a ballhead creep of a one degree will show up quite clearly on wide angles)

Cheers

 

[geraldkhoo]

I was at TK looking at some traven tripods and was personally quite impressed with the quality of the Sirui tripods. Apparently, the T series is discontinued, and replaced by the TX series, e.g. T-2205X or T2204X. The TX series are the travel tripod series.

From Sirui's website (http://www.zssirui.com/en/), you have the following... T-1005X (Aluminium), T-2005X (Aluminium), T-1205X (Carbon Fibre), T-2205X (Carbon Fibre) - all 5 section tripods.

The website did not list the T-2204X CF tripod, but I did some comparisons at the shop with the T-2205X. I believe for a travel tripod, size and weight are considerations. The T-2205X weighs 1.2kg with max load of 12kg, and the T-2204X is 1.1kg with max load of 15kg. The 4-section T-2204X is more stable and able to take more load than the 5-section T-2205X. When folded, the T-2205X is slightly shorter than the T-2204X. With the legs fully extended (without the center column up), they are about the same height, but with centre column up, the T-2204X is taller.

The specs for the T-2204X are as follows:
Min height - 140mm
Max height - 1480mm
Folded height - 490mm
Inverted folded legs height - 410mm
Weight - 1.1kg
Max load - 15kg

Both the T-2204X and T-2205X is selling at TK for $370 with the G20 ballhead, and has 6 years warranty. They also come with a shorter center column, and a tripod bag.

The N-series tripods (with a removable leg which becomes a monopod) is taller than the TX series (which are travel tripods).

 

[shelomoh]

Hi people,

I was reading the posts on SIRUI T2205X + PhotoClam PC-33NS.

I currently have a Manfrotto 190XPROB + Manfrotto 390RC2 setup. The combined weight is around 1.9 KG. I find it heavy to lug around and have been looking for a CF tripod.

I was checking out the Benro C-058EX or C-158EX + KB-1A, before I chance upon this thread.

Would need your valuable advices.

1. Do I need to get another tripod and head? As in, would the SIRUI or Benro option improve what I am having right now?

2. How does Benro compares with SIRUI? I generally do not trust China brands because their QC is a big suspect for me.

3. From the posts, I think I can get SIRUI T2205X from TK Photo but where to get PhotoClam PC-33NS?

4. Will SIRUI T2205X + PhotoClam PC-33NS be able to support D700 + 70-200 VR2 (maximum)?

Thanks.