An entry level DSLR

[viewwing]

:think: i wonder where's the TS...

Anyway, i draw and analogy... 20 years back people ask....
Which flim is better? Fuji, Kodak or Konica...

in this case the size of the "Sensor" is the same... but do u have preference over certain "brand" or you don't really care over time and just grab the cheapest one available over the counter?

Now the "Sensor" size is slightly different... ask yourself, what's the most important thing that you are looking for? Camera size? Weight? Or just bragging rights?

In the digital world now...You'll need to see whether your LCD is able to reproduce the true colour your camera captures. And if you're printing... then its almost the same as the good old flim days... u have to find the right printer or shop else it'll prob put a frown on your face...

 

[Oly5050]

The D300 comment is not part of the comparison. It's just me wishful thinking. :bsmilie: Sorry for the confusion.

On the note of the 410. I found the viewfinder and LCD to be quite lacking. The 420 is another story with it's interesting features. I just hope Olympus doesn't put that sorry excuse for a LCD on it. On the other hand, Nikon has got some affordable VR lenses that fit quite well with the smaller D cameras.

Bernards, I think I got what u meant the first time around. It was clear u were a 4/3 user, but was distracted by the D300. I think there is no doubt the D300 is a good camera, but I think it would be better compared to the E3 than the E410. Do u guys agree? If u compare 410 with D300, of course D300 would appear better.

 

[Oly5050]

Nikon D40 vs Olympus E-410

Sensor size 23.7 x 15.5 mm (Nikon DX) 4/3 " (18.00 x 13.50 mm)

I'm not a pro shooter but based on just the sensor size between the cameras, can I say the D40 has an edge because it's sensor is way larger than the E-410?

I wanted to say that u have an unhealthy obsession with sensor size. But I dun blame you. Many photographers are and this is ALWAYS one of those things that they will say when they talk about the 4/3 system ----- that the sensor size is small, and that the image is thus noisy with low dynamic range, and that it is a crop factor of 2. Sigh.....

I think what they should judge is the system, the functionality, and the image results that they can get. So one of the suggestions to use ur own cards and try out all the cameras and review the images at home is a good idea.

 

[windwaver]

first off, this is very diplomatic; but you're new, perhaps forgiven. definitely camera groups are not "exclusive" but these are more catered for discussions pertaining to the system itself, comparisons are best avoided.

the best part is, you came into the 4/3 corner, where most of the viewers will be 4/3 users, i.e. olympus mostly. and you ask if nikon will be better. that's like well, a tourist walking into old trafford during a home game and asking if arsenal is better, for instance.

next time, post such queries in the newbies or general corner - believe me, nikon and olympus users do browse those sections too. i'll let the 4/3 people answer the part about how a smaller sensor doesn't necessarily mean inferior. besides, a camera is a lot more than just pure image quality; similarly, image quality has a slight correlation with the camera body, but there are other factors such as lens quality, etc as well.

cheers.

Oh hi! Opps, I'm not so sure where to post but it seems that ppl here are experienced. I'm indeed new to a DSLR. All I have is what I read from books about how everything works but my head hurts when I tried to research on an entry level DSLR to buy.

And I guess I'm right! People here are indeed experienced cos only then one can tell if specs or simply books just points out the truth i.e. larger sensor is better. I'm sure I've read more than 1 book that says that.

In fact, my head hurts from deciding between Nikon and Olympus, Cannon's entry level's a little out of my budget . I prefer taking close ups like flowers, etc, so a macro lens will be great. I'm also of thinking of using the DSLR to take family photos too.

Anyway, I'm still very new in DSLR, hopefully the pros here can forgive me if I've posted anything wrong :sweatsm:

 

[viewwing]

In fact, my head hurts from deciding between Nikon and Olympus, Cannon's entry level's a little out of my budget

Whats ur budget like? the E-510 is going for $1299 listed price... prob can get it lower... a fellow CSer got his E-420 for less then $900. With a kit lens

I prefer taking close ups like flowers, etc, so a macro lens will be great. I'm also of thinking of using the DSLR to take family photos too.

If you're into macro, why not look at blurboiboi's collection he has got a lot of nice macro short lots of insects shots.

For family photos, if its more for indoor shots you might wanna consider getting a ext flash to give u that extra light. outdoor shots will be no problems at all... kit lens can do the job too. Look at this thread to see the picture posted here.

http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=241790

 

[dorts]

Oh hi! Opps, I'm not so sure where to post but it seems that ppl here are experienced. I'm indeed new to a DSLR. All I have is what I read from books about how everything works but my head hurts when I tried to research on an entry level DSLR to buy.

And I guess I'm right! People here are indeed experienced cos only then one can tell if specs or simply books just points out the truth i.e. larger sensor is better. I'm sure I've read more than 1 book that says that.

In fact, my head hurts from deciding between Nikon and Olympus, Cannon's entry level's a little out of my budget . I prefer taking close ups like flowers, etc, so a macro lens will be great. I'm also of thinking of using the DSLR to take family photos too.

Anyway, I'm still very new in DSLR, hopefully the pros here can forgive me if I've posted anything wrong :sweatsm:

Go try out the cameras at the stores. See which one of them fits your hand the nicest.

But the Nikon D40(x) doesn't have an AF motor built-in, so you cannot AF with some lenses. That's a disadvantage.

 

[drakon09]

Oh hi! Opps, I'm not so sure where to post but it seems that ppl here are experienced. I'm indeed new to a DSLR. All I have is what I read from books about how everything works but my head hurts when I tried to research on an entry level DSLR to buy.

And I guess I'm right! People here are indeed experienced cos only then one can tell if specs or simply books just points out the truth i.e. larger sensor is better. I'm sure I've read more than 1 book that says that.

In fact, my head hurts from deciding between Nikon and Olympus, Cannon's entry level's a little out of my budget . I prefer taking close ups like flowers, etc, so a macro lens will be great. I'm also of thinking of using the DSLR to take family photos too.

Anyway, I'm still very new in DSLR, hopefully the pros here can forgive me if I've posted anything wrong :sweatsm:

Heh, don't sweat it - nobody here's going to eat you alive! And you can count on the *ahem* moderators to err... moderate eeheheheh.

All modern DSLR systems are extremely capable, you really cannot go wrong with any brand. That said, there are those small differences that defines the various systems. Also, it may be worthy to understand the features of both large and small sensors. Note that I used the word "features" - for it's wrong to imply in any way that big is better, or small is inferior. They are just different.

 

[windwaver]

Whats ur budget like? the E-510 is going for $1299 listed price... prob can get it lower... a fellow CSer got his E-420 for less then $900. With a kit lens


If you're into macro, why not look at blurboiboi's collection he has got a lot of nice macro short lots of insects shots.

For family photos, if its more for indoor shots you might wanna consider getting a ext flash to give u that extra light. outdoor shots will be no problems at all... kit lens can do the job too. Look at this thread to see the picture posted here.

http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=241790

:bigeyes:. brand new E-420?

 

[dorts]

:bigeyes:. brand new E-420?

Yes. :bigeyes:

A E-520 might be on the horizon to replace the E-510. ;p

 

[olymac]

.........In fact, my head hurts from deciding between Nikon and Olympus, Cannon's entry level's a little out of my budget . I prefer taking close ups like flowers, etc, so a macro lens will be great. I'm also of thinking of using the DSLR to take family photos too.

Anyway, I'm still very new in DSLR, hopefully the pros here can forgive me if I've posted anything wrong :sweatsm:

2 points against the D40X;

1. Check out the jpegs specs/quality you can get fr straight fr the camera. I spend some time with a D40X - IMHO, the only way to get great quality shots were with RAW. For a casual shooter, you'll prob waste too much time doing PP.

2. Check out the lens compatibility chart of the Nikon system (available here http://nikon-asia.com/kdb/EN/2007/5211/camlens_compatibility.pdf ) Then check the price of the Nikkor lens you think you might be buying. Then think again. Key points here; the better Nikkor lens may not be compatible for the D40. And Nikkor lens are not cheap nor the best around.

D40? I'll say hunt for a second hand D70/80 at least or budget not limiting, get the D300 ..... if you are serious about dSLR and wants to be part of the Nikon system. Or get something else.

Happy shopping!

 

[olymac]

Nikon D40 vs Olympus E-410

Sensor size 23.7 x 15.5 mm (Nikon DX) 4/3 " (18.00 x 13.50 mm)

I'm not a pro shooter but based on just the sensor size between the cameras, can I say the D40 has an edge because it's sensor is way larger than the E-410?

2 points here:

1. Buying just based on sensor alone is a little like buying a car just based on the engine. Best value here? Maybe a cement truck or the double decker buses who surely have bigger engines than the usual BMWs/Merc/Volvo/Accords/Lexuses/Minis etc.

2. Consider the E-510, or the appearing very, very soon E420.

 

[microcosm]

It just me wishing I plonked my cash on the D300 instead.

Sorry to hear that...

 

[microcosm]

When someone pull the D300-E3 thingy out of the closet, this is when "expansion of the system" comes into play... and that is when the lenses comparisons starts... and ends... Zuiko Digital wins hands down... and when someone starts looking at Pro Level lenses and makes a comment like cost, then really, I would not even bother to start an argument. The typical answer these days is : "Have you tested the Canon G9 or the Ricoh GRII? Nice images out of the camera..." What's the point of talking about Pro Level lenses when one has the mentality of a Point and Shoot buyer?

Just like a kid walking into a Leica speciality shop and then make comments about Leica lenses being expensive... or the favourite analogy using cars... walking into a BMW dealership and start talking about the price of Cheery cars prices versus BMWs... laughable mentality. For lenses in the thousands category, what is a few hundred difference?

This is why I avoid partaking into that lengthy, useless conversation and discussion when it comes to this...

Sharing this same story that I had experienced myself at a shoot... someone with 5D (the largest sensor in DSLR class bodies) and a Canon L lens was beside me when I commented that I brought out the wrong lens for portraiture shooting (35-100mm with E3) and he gave me the "wicked eye" look... and when we opened up the image in the viewfinder and zoomed in (considering how crap E3 screens are), he could not believe that I could capture all the fine lines around the eyes while he desperately hope to be able to do the same on his super-set up (5D, L lens)... enough said...

Sticking to Olympus for now, and the system works for me. Some guys who likes "auto fall off" would choose the "full 135 frame" camera, that is his choice and his money.

For me, now I am dreaming about 645 cameras with digital backs... but the wallet is telling me to stay calm... stay calm... :bsmilie:

 

[microcosm]

To sum it all up... honestly these days, all entry level cameras are pretty much the same... the kit lenses are pretty much of the same build quality with Olympus having that slight edge but Nikon is catching up fast offering better lenses... Canon's can and should be a doorstop. Sony is a little pricey but they offer some serious lenses worth mentioning. But the Sony entry camera bodies... that is a different thing altogether.

Body wise, if one is shooting jpg and wants to use images out of the camera, Olympus is the obvious winner.

Build quality and choice of third party lenses, Nikon wins hands down.

Olympus has a final edge... price.

Dual kit lens and one E-4xx, 5xx can be bought at about S$1,000 or less these days... Something to think about.

Hope the TS has a good time shopping. And buy something that you like... but if you want to be safe, and sleep well in case you cannot handle friends saying "Why Olympus? Why not this brand, that brand?"... you are better off with a Canon or Nikon... usually you draw envy from the people around you... "Wah! You got a new N/C camera!! Nice!"

All depends on what you are looking for...

If you are still unsure what kind of images a newbie photographer can produce with a entry level Olympus camera, check out the Olympus gallery in this section and lookout for a member "adrewine" images... let the images do the talking.

Real photographer, real camera, real images. Enough said....

 

[Oly5050]

When someone pull the D300-E3 thingy out of the closet, this is when "expansion of the system" comes into play... and that is when the lenses comparisons starts... and ends... Zuiko Digital wins hands down... and when someone starts looking at Pro Level lenses and makes a comment like cost, then really, I would not even bother to start an argument. The typical answer these days is : "Have you tested the Canon G9 or the Ricoh GRII? Nice images out of the camera..." What's the point of talking about Pro Level lenses when one has the mentality of a Point and Shoot buyer?

Just like a kid walking into a Leica speciality shop and then make comments about Leica lenses being expensive... or the favourite analogy using cars... walking into a BMW dealership and start talking about the price of Cheery cars prices versus BMWs... laughable mentality. For lenses in the thousands category, what is a few hundred difference?

This is why I avoid partaking into that lengthy, useless conversation and discussion when it comes to this...

Sharing this same story that I had experienced myself at a shoot... someone with 5D (the largest sensor in DSLR class bodies) and a Canon L lens was beside me when I commented that I brought out the wrong lens for portraiture shooting (35-100mm with E3) and he gave me the "wicked eye" look... and when we opened up the image in the viewfinder and zoomed in (considering how crap E3 screens are), he could not believe that I could capture all the fine lines around the eyes while he desperately hope to be able to do the same on his super-set up (5D, L lens)... enough said...

Sticking to Olympus for now, and the system works for me. Some guys who likes "auto fall off" would choose the "full 135 frame" camera, that is his choice and his money.

For me, now I am dreaming about 645 cameras with digital backs... but the wallet is telling me to stay calm... stay calm... :bsmilie:

What is auto-fall off??

 

[night86mare]

Olympus has a final edge... price.

:cry::mad2::complain:

bro.. why you forget my brand

now i very sad.

ok jokes aside, yes, adrewine's shots are very nice. you made me look through the entire oly gallery lor.

 

[noidea]

if you are looking for an entry dslr no doubt the famous dslr in the market now is Olympus E420. It is just release and if you look future down the thread you will see that i make some post abt it.

I own a Nikon D40x b4 but then i sold it b/c it is lack of function. I dunno howmuch is a D40 cost but if your budget is arpund $850 Sing Dollar then i would day Olympus E-420 is on the top of the list.

 

[bousozoku]

...
But the Nikon D40(x) doesn't have an AF motor built-in, so you cannot AF with some lenses. That's a disadvantage.

Actually, I consider that an advantage. You must buy modern lenses.

 

[Jagdeep]

Good day.
There are many many good cameras out there.
I have decided to buy a Sony DSCR1. Sold off my Nikon D40.
I AM a Nikon fan through and through and still have a Nikon F65 (film)
The Nikon D40 is NOT a good starting point.

My personal opinion is to start off with a Nikon D80, nothing less.
If you are really serious, do it once and for all and skip the upgrade path.
In this case, if funds permit, go for the nikon D300 whch is an amazing camera and forget about camera bodies for a long time. And get some good lenses.

If you just want some flexibility in creativity, a point and shoot DSLR like camera with a fixed lens (like my Sony DCS R1) will be hassle free and give you 'good enough' shots.

Nikon have released a new PNS fixed Lens DSLR like camera. It has a decent sensor size and good flexibility.

Hope this helps
Jag

ps
I am not affliated to Nikon or Sony in any way. I just love the Nikons and the Sony configuration is exactly what I need

 

[viewwing]

:cry::mad2::complain:

bro.. why you forget my brand

now i very sad.

ok jokes aside, yes, adrewine's shots are very nice. you made me look through the entire oly gallery lor.

Haahaa... Pentax has an edge... the K20D is weather seal right?

I wonder if the E-520 will be...

If the E-520 has a 100% viewfinder and a weather seal body... i'll upgrade in a flash...