About LEICA......
- Thread starter Halfmoon
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Halfmoon
Senior Member
Red Dawn said:What better way to read up on the system than Leica's website itself?
http://www.leica-camera.com/index_e.html
Another good read about the system is:
http://www.butzi.net/reviews/leicam6.htm
I did find the product site.... but did not fin much info on it... maybe I did not search well.....
Thanks for your websites link....
This is your dad's camera isn't it? http://www.pbase.com/cameras/konica/ee_matic_deluxe
Here's the manual. http://www.butkus.org/chinon/konica_ee-matic/konica_ee-matic.htm
Here's an idea of what the camera is selling for. Should be in USD. It's an online shop price. http://www.goodwinphotoinc.com/35mm/RangeFinders_Fixed_Focus/rangefinders_fixed_focus.html#miscrf
Those should be the actual prices of the cameras. Many shops and EBAY prices are really over inflated.
It looks like the camera has a selenium photocell meter. You would have to take the cap off to do metering. Selenium meters don't age well if they have been exposed to light all these while. And that camera has been around since the 1960's. Looking at the manual, only the aperture dial seems to be adjustable. The shutter speed is fixed. The aperture dial can be set to auto which makes it into a fully manual camera or adjustable from F2.8 to F22. Filter size of 49mm.
an example of another selenium photocell meter would be the canon canonet 19. http://www.photoethnography.com/equipment.html Click on My Classic Camera Collection and scroll a little down to Canon Canonet 19. And anyway, Karen's site is a good source of useful info with good links.
Usual places to repair these fellas would be camera hospital at sunshine plaza, camera workshop and cam-x. Steven at camera hospital would be able to tell you alot more about your camera or whether it has any fungus growth on the lense or whether it is mouldy.
Here's the manual. http://www.butkus.org/chinon/konica_ee-matic/konica_ee-matic.htm
Here's an idea of what the camera is selling for. Should be in USD. It's an online shop price. http://www.goodwinphotoinc.com/35mm/RangeFinders_Fixed_Focus/rangefinders_fixed_focus.html#miscrf
Those should be the actual prices of the cameras. Many shops and EBAY prices are really over inflated.
It looks like the camera has a selenium photocell meter. You would have to take the cap off to do metering. Selenium meters don't age well if they have been exposed to light all these while. And that camera has been around since the 1960's. Looking at the manual, only the aperture dial seems to be adjustable. The shutter speed is fixed. The aperture dial can be set to auto which makes it into a fully manual camera or adjustable from F2.8 to F22. Filter size of 49mm.
an example of another selenium photocell meter would be the canon canonet 19. http://www.photoethnography.com/equipment.html Click on My Classic Camera Collection and scroll a little down to Canon Canonet 19. And anyway, Karen's site is a good source of useful info with good links.
Usual places to repair these fellas would be camera hospital at sunshine plaza, camera workshop and cam-x. Steven at camera hospital would be able to tell you alot more about your camera or whether it has any fungus growth on the lense or whether it is mouldy.
The body covering, RF window and controls seems really similar to my Seagull. No meter on the chinese body though.
http://rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=8113
http://rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=8113
Halfmoon
Senior Member
GC1 said:
Hi GC1.....
Cool sia..... This is the model!!!! I cannot believe that you can find the pic out there.... I suck in search... hahaha........
Since 1965???? That was way before I was even born.... and now, it is 2005.... 40 yrs old camera???? WOOW!!!! :bigeyes:
Is sunshine plaza the best place around??? I seen many talk about this place..... The cam is keep in the drawer away from the light.... think the shutter is stuck.... cannot shoot......
Any idea how to check the meter condition??? But it is worth to repair???
Thanks for all the link... it is very informative!!!
Halfmoon
Senior Member
GC1 said:
Most design looked similar..... and quite solid bodies too..... sliver with black bodies.....
Imagine 40 yrs from now... and I bet no one is using digital cam we are using now..... most prob... sensor is out cold... unlike film, that can survive so long... if have parts....... I think...... :think:
Halfmoon said:Hi GC1.....
Cool sia..... This is the model!!!! I cannot believe that you can find the pic out there.... I suck in search... hahaha........
Since 1965???? That was way before I was even born.... and now, it is 2005.... 40 yrs old camera???? WOOW!!!! :bigeyes:
Is sunshine plaza the best place around??? I seen many talk about this place..... The cam is keep in the drawer away from the light.... think the shutter is stuck.... cannot shoot......
Any idea how to check the meter condition??? But it is worth to repair???
Thanks for all the link... it is very informative!!!
Thank you. But it was not that hard really. Just copied and pasted the model and searched from Yahoo. Links will appear.
Regarding the problems which you might have mentioned, the oil used to lubricate the leaf shutters might have turned into gunk and jammed it up. As for most mechanical cameras of that era, it should be able to work without a battery. The battery is used for metering. This guy here also had a stuck shutter. http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=113527#post113527 If the steps to attempt to rectify the problem seem terrifying, it would be good to just send it to a technician for servicing. Or if you are brave enough to attempt it yourself (I strongly suggest otherwise, taking apart a camera is alright, but do you know how to put it back together?) you could ask help from Greyhound man on Rangefinder forum.com
He's really good at fixing cameras.
My 1960's Yashica was bought from him.Here's a list of things to check for in your camera:
-check RF dirtyness/haze and its alignment, vertical and horizontal (easiest at infinity, safest via a testing with film)
-winding/cocking should be smooth
-shutter should not stick
-lenses clean
-metering correct
-setting aperture to different values should be visible, if it's always looking like wide-open, you have a problem
-check battery compartment for signs of corrosion (leakage of old batteries).
Usual charges for doing a CLA on a rangefinder should be around S$80 to S$120 at either cam-X at peninisula plaza or at camera hospital. As for whether it's worth while, it's really up to you to answer that. Do you have the desire to use the camera? Will you use it? Take it as you are getting a new camera for S$80 to S$120. It's a cheap, durable, bring everywhere camera for avaliable light and daylight use. If it's taken care of properly, it can last you many years more. Only you can justify the cost. What anyone else says really has no bearing on your final decision.
Most rangefinder cameras are not in production anymore. Those in production are those like the newer voigtlander series, the upcoming zeiss ikon, and some leicas. The Hexar RF is a great camera too. But those are of a different class from fixed lens rangefinders. Much more expensive but much more capable and versatile.
Halfmoon
Senior Member
GC1 said:Usual charges for doing a CLA on a rangefinder should be around S$80 to S$120 at either cam-X at peninisula plaza or at camera hospital. As for whether it's worth while, it's really up to you to answer that. Do you have the desire to use the camera? Will you use it? Take it as you are getting a new camera for S$80 to S$120. It's a cheap, durable, bring everywhere camera for avaliable light and daylight use. If it's taken care of properly, it can last you many years more. Only you can justify the cost. What anyone else says really has no bearing on your final decision.
Most rangefinder cameras are not in production anymore. Those in production are those like the newer voigtlander series, the upcoming zeiss ikon, and some leicas. The Hexar RF is a great camera too. But those are of a different class from fixed lens rangefinders. Much more expensive but much more capable and versatile.
Hi GC1....
Thanks for your suggestion... but I doubt I want to risk that.... especially after my many failed experiences in tearing stuffs apart... hahah....
I have checked with my dad and he seems to not mind getting it fixed... problem was he did not think there's shop around to fix it... since it is OLD antique..... He might have another spoil camera... not sure if that is around still.....
I think I will go to X cam to try get it fixed... I believe it have lots of sentimental value to my parents too.....
My only worry is the one you hightlighted to me about the metering.... if that is find, it should work since this is a camera that is mechanical..... not so much failable parts like D-slr......
Perhaps a more in depth intro on leica from a pragmatic point of view. This is not soley directed to the originator of the thread, but as general reading as a whole.
Firstly, the worst thing you can do is surf the leica web site or read any of those reviews most users post (like that luminous-landscape example. That guy needs a boot stuffed in his mouth.)
The leica mystique, as they call it, as merely a human factor. A camera is still a camera, no matter how you look at it. Yes, it's top notch quality, yes it's hand built, but that does not mean that you have to buy three types of bodies that does the same thing, which namely is to open the shutter curtain or wind film.
Or buy tons of lenses with the same aperture because of some unique aspects that some guys swear upon their mothers make leica a set from the rest. Nocti-loonies (Noctilux fans) fall into this category.
That may be a bit stern, but that's to provide backdrop so you won't turn into a leica gear nuthead. There is ENOUGH as there is already.
So why do people still invest in a leica? Namely, as what one photojournalist I met in melbourne puts it: 'It's good , it's silent, and the optics are fantastic. Oh, and a elephant can sit on it and it still works. That's it.' I would say that's the main rationale for mine as well. While a SLR and a rangefinder could do the same job pretty much, and there are cases a SLR could outperform a rangefinder in some respect, such as macro work,action photography and telephoto work.
What lures most people (who aren't blinded by the Leica glow ) into a leica range finder is essentially just one reason that is a bane of most photojournalists: Low light non flash work. When I meant low light, I REALLY mean low light. We're talking speeds of 1/30, to even some cases 1/4 of a sec, handheld, full aperture. A range finder could handle at least two (or in the case of very steady hands, even 3) stops below an SLR . Dim lighting condition are very common in bars, (where I take pictures of jazz concerts up stage nowadays), conferences and stages, where a flash would simply distract the proponents , or even a big SLR could be downright intimidating.
Shutter silence, as much as not many others think, is also VERY important in this line of work. Don't tell me to get a zeiss ikon or a bessa to take pictures of some unknowing personality in a bar. Not that I think they're inferior (in fact, they may be just as good as the leica), but a metal shutter to me is a definate NO NO, especially in places where photographers actually aren't allowed. Photojournalists (the real good ones) often find ways to sneak into places under the nose of authorities. That's how Robert's Kennedy's assasination got photographed. A slap of that metal shutter and it's a dead give away. And that's what exactly happened some time ago when my leica was in CLA. Last time I'm going to use a damn r2. I rather use a zorki or a fed rangefinder than those bessas or ikons.
So in order, if you are really thinking of getting a leica, really ask yourself these:
1. Does a silent shutter matter in most of my photography work?
2. How often do you do low light work?
3. How important is telephoto or zoom to your photography. Cause if it is, it's better to stick
to a SLR. All rangefinders lenses are fixed focus, and mainly wide angle. You got to get
in close. VERY CLOSE.
Mainly, it's a specialist tool, suited almost 100% solely for people photography. That's why you don't see Ansel adams using it, or many people using it as a fact. Not many people are really willing to just specialize in one type of photography.
Anyway, just to give you an idea what a rangefinder would really excel in, here's a picture from one of my projects on Melbourne's night life.
Taken at Flinder's station, Tri X . Equivalent (estimated)exposure of F1.4 1/30 secs. Taken with a 50mm
P.S: Please do not rip.
Firstly, the worst thing you can do is surf the leica web site or read any of those reviews most users post (like that luminous-landscape example. That guy needs a boot stuffed in his mouth.)
The leica mystique, as they call it, as merely a human factor. A camera is still a camera, no matter how you look at it. Yes, it's top notch quality, yes it's hand built, but that does not mean that you have to buy three types of bodies that does the same thing, which namely is to open the shutter curtain or wind film.
Or buy tons of lenses with the same aperture because of some unique aspects that some guys swear upon their mothers make leica a set from the rest. Nocti-loonies (Noctilux fans) fall into this category.
That may be a bit stern, but that's to provide backdrop so you won't turn into a leica gear nuthead. There is ENOUGH as there is already.
So why do people still invest in a leica? Namely, as what one photojournalist I met in melbourne puts it: 'It's good , it's silent, and the optics are fantastic. Oh, and a elephant can sit on it and it still works. That's it.' I would say that's the main rationale for mine as well. While a SLR and a rangefinder could do the same job pretty much, and there are cases a SLR could outperform a rangefinder in some respect, such as macro work,action photography and telephoto work.
What lures most people (who aren't blinded by the Leica glow ) into a leica range finder is essentially just one reason that is a bane of most photojournalists: Low light non flash work. When I meant low light, I REALLY mean low light. We're talking speeds of 1/30, to even some cases 1/4 of a sec, handheld, full aperture. A range finder could handle at least two (or in the case of very steady hands, even 3) stops below an SLR . Dim lighting condition are very common in bars, (where I take pictures of jazz concerts up stage nowadays), conferences and stages, where a flash would simply distract the proponents , or even a big SLR could be downright intimidating.
Shutter silence, as much as not many others think, is also VERY important in this line of work. Don't tell me to get a zeiss ikon or a bessa to take pictures of some unknowing personality in a bar. Not that I think they're inferior (in fact, they may be just as good as the leica), but a metal shutter to me is a definate NO NO, especially in places where photographers actually aren't allowed. Photojournalists (the real good ones) often find ways to sneak into places under the nose of authorities. That's how Robert's Kennedy's assasination got photographed. A slap of that metal shutter and it's a dead give away. And that's what exactly happened some time ago when my leica was in CLA. Last time I'm going to use a damn r2. I rather use a zorki or a fed rangefinder than those bessas or ikons.
So in order, if you are really thinking of getting a leica, really ask yourself these:
1. Does a silent shutter matter in most of my photography work?
2. How often do you do low light work?
3. How important is telephoto or zoom to your photography. Cause if it is, it's better to stick
to a SLR. All rangefinders lenses are fixed focus, and mainly wide angle. You got to get
in close. VERY CLOSE.
Mainly, it's a specialist tool, suited almost 100% solely for people photography. That's why you don't see Ansel adams using it, or many people using it as a fact. Not many people are really willing to just specialize in one type of photography.
Anyway, just to give you an idea what a rangefinder would really excel in, here's a picture from one of my projects on Melbourne's night life.
Taken at Flinder's station, Tri X . Equivalent (estimated)exposure of F1.4 1/30 secs. Taken with a 50mm
P.S: Please do not rip.
Wisp has mentioned some very important points but i think he got a few things wrong too.
The Noctilux is a lens above others simply because it is F1.0, compared to the 1.4 Summilux and the F2 Summicrons. I am not a big fan of what the noct does to OOF, but the F1.0 advantage is undeniable.
In terms of silence, i think the leica is overrated. I own, and seldom use, an M2 and M3, both CLAd and smooth as hell. I can still hear them loud and clear on the MRT and definitely in concerts. U want sneaky, try any of the leafshutter RFs, Cannonets, etc. or even better, a TLR! A lot of times, it is about timing your shot. In concerts, time it with when the loud instruments are being played, etc.
Reliability, size, built, quality are arguably leica's selling points. But they are not all that great either.
The Noctilux is a lens above others simply because it is F1.0, compared to the 1.4 Summilux and the F2 Summicrons. I am not a big fan of what the noct does to OOF, but the F1.0 advantage is undeniable.
In terms of silence, i think the leica is overrated. I own, and seldom use, an M2 and M3, both CLAd and smooth as hell. I can still hear them loud and clear on the MRT and definitely in concerts. U want sneaky, try any of the leafshutter RFs, Cannonets, etc. or even better, a TLR! A lot of times, it is about timing your shot. In concerts, time it with when the loud instruments are being played, etc.
Reliability, size, built, quality are arguably leica's selling points. But they are not all that great either.
My bad, perhaps a noctilux is a bad example. I should have used the few generations of summicrons that others proclaim have their unique finger print which is probably only very slightly visible if they're enlarged up to 11*12 or so.
It's true that the leaf shutter RFs and the canonnets could be pretty much more silent than the leicas, but I have to take into account availability of equipment. Most of these rangefinders either have fixed lens of a certain focal length, or the lenses for the rare few aren't that easy to find with prime glass, unless you want to count in the russian lenses. M-mount glass, however is available easily from all 3 manufacturers, of good quality (New Leica lenses are overrated, I'll admit, for their price).
But as said, the leica m isn't the only tool for the job. It's just one of those tools that happened to do its job well as a rangefinder. I still borrow the QL-7s and the old voigtlander leafshutters (SLRs and Rangefinders) once in a while, when I just feel as if I'm missing out something after some heavy duty use with a leica.
By the way, perhaps somebody could tell me where to find a red dot ? ;/ . I knocked my red dot off my 90 elmarit during a rally sometime ago, and I find trying to figure the spot to lock the lens in a night time gig is a pain in the ass when I'm trying to fit the lens in a hurry.
It's true that the leaf shutter RFs and the canonnets could be pretty much more silent than the leicas, but I have to take into account availability of equipment. Most of these rangefinders either have fixed lens of a certain focal length, or the lenses for the rare few aren't that easy to find with prime glass, unless you want to count in the russian lenses. M-mount glass, however is available easily from all 3 manufacturers, of good quality (New Leica lenses are overrated, I'll admit, for their price).
But as said, the leica m isn't the only tool for the job. It's just one of those tools that happened to do its job well as a rangefinder. I still borrow the QL-7s and the old voigtlander leafshutters (SLRs and Rangefinders) once in a while, when I just feel as if I'm missing out something after some heavy duty use with a leica.
By the way, perhaps somebody could tell me where to find a red dot ? ;/ . I knocked my red dot off my 90 elmarit during a rally sometime ago, and I find trying to figure the spot to lock the lens in a night time gig is a pain in the ass when I'm trying to fit the lens in a hurry.
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