Scratches. Slides & KT

[woosy]

hi hi,

pardon some of my potential stupid questions... see if you could help here?

1) How do you tell who's at fault if your negative get scratched? Mine has a straight line across, sometimes 2 lines. 1 entire roll of film has it and the other only affect a few pics.

2) Slides to print - Do you advise them to color correct or not? I like what i see on the slide itself but this is the first time i'm using it, so want to be sure. Esp after the developer at penisular screw up some color of my neg prints. I've to ask them to redevelop it again. Its a waste of time.

3) Developer - there's a lot of good reviews about KT digi print. I wonder if anyone try printing their slides there? How's the results and $, say 4R? Do you have any other suggestions?

4) Do you scan your slides before you print or do you just print?

Thanks,
woosy

 

[hyun]

i have a similar question also. your scratches are on negative. mine are on slides. bulk-rolled, processed by Ruby.

the lines are pretty consistent, on all rolls. i don't know if they're at the exact same positions but it's almost identical.

the question is this: how much "rolling" motion is involved in slide development by the lab? what are the steps? if the lab does not do much rolling - it probably isn't their fault. but if the lab rolls the film into reels like in home b&w development, there might be some likelihood it is indeed the lab.

i've dropped mention of this to ruby on 2 occasions but every now and then scratches are found. i wonder if it's the result of bulk-rolling.

 

[woosy]

i just discovered my slides has scratches too when i sent it to colorlab for prints. The guy (think boss) check my slides and found (fine?) scratches and water stain. Think he just want make sure i won't come after him. Anyway I told him to print see if it appear if the scratches will appear. If not i'm lucky (finally). The slide was process by RGB.

Think you better post another thread... I'm not getting much reply on this. Getting tired.. been running around checking my prints, requesting for reprints, checking and going after my scratches.

Good luck

 

[sriram]

Could be dust on the felt in the canister, or in the camera itself, specially if it is bulk rolled film. I suspect this since you have straight lines across the entire roll.

 

[woosy]

Could be dust on the felt in the canister, or in the camera itself, specially if it is bulk rolled film. I suspect this since you have straight lines across the entire roll.

Can i ask the service center to check for me? I already sent in my camera to get the shutter replace. Can explain about the bulk rolled film part? Don't quite understand. Thanks.

By the way, one shop told me if the scratch appear on prints as white lines then i should be my fault, but if its color lines then its the lab's. Wonder how true...

 

[Azure]

3) Developer - there's a lot of good reviews about KT digi print. I wonder if anyone try printing their slides there? How's the results and $, say 4R? Do you have any other suggestions?

Give them a call lor... 6538-1422. However note that they do not process slides.

As for your difficulty with the negs and scratches, suggest you settle down with 1 (ONE) good lab and work with them. There are several recommended labs used by Clubsnappers. Pick one, go down and show them what you want, and talk to them about how they can serve your needs.

Running around several labs and getting frustrated with different problems each time isn't going to do you nor your prints/negs/slides any good. Some of the really good labs will take the time to go thru with you and to find ways to add value to their price/service. Explain to them your experiences and ask that they check for you - good labs will do that. Then give them some space/time to deliver the service that you want.

My 2 cents.

 

[hyun]

i do not know the entire process of bulk-rolling, so please correct me if i'm off.

scratches might get on the entire roll if:
some dust gets on the felt of the canister before bulk rolling starts. when the film is being fed into the canister, the dust scratches the entire roll.

if dust didn't get into this part, the next step where dust can enter is: when the lab pulls out the leader and feeds the film into the machine, through the felt opening again.

if the dust still doesn't get into these steps, then it should be quite safe, since after that, the machine develops, the thing comes out to dry and doesn't come into contact with dust that can scratch the entire roll along its length.

Does this sound right?

 

[woosy]

Azure, i've always stick to one lab until this recent experience. feel that they not sincere and when i did a search on lab in CS found that pple has problem with them too. It belong to one of the recommended ones until recently...so now i've to try find another reliable one again. until then i guess its some running around.
Hyun, thanks for explaining... sounds right? well i dunno much.. so is there a way to tell how the scratch happens by looking at the neg/slide/print? like i mentioned earlier, some say the color of the scratch line, straight or jagged lines...

thanks again

 

[Azure]

U r welcome, Woosy. And my sympathies... I empathise with your frustration, as I've been on the receiving end of it a year back.

Sometimes improper handling can also lead to scratching of your negs. This can be by the operator at the lab you print. Normally, they are supposed to handle with glove or at least blow clean the negs before and after scanning them.

You can try KT (ask for Michelle) or Beautiful Memories. The former, do mention me to them. The latter - well, customer satisfaction just can't be matched.

 

[hoppinghippo]

hyun: you're right in identifying where the film could get scratched. however while I don't know anything about colour of the scratch giving info on who's at fault BUT I always believe that one simple way to tell is that if its a consistent scratch like one line across your row of negs or slides or a similar scratch in every frame, then its likely its the camera or film but if every frame is ok except for just a few which have SMALL scratches then I think its the lab who's careless with the handling. I'm also at a loss for good labs to dev slides, have tried 2 big name ones before, and still had bad experiences, mounted slides have the neg badly fitted and bulge out (which speaks volumes about how much effort went into mounting if I could just open the box right in front of the shop fella, take a glance thru and immediately pick out the spoiled slide), slides have scratches here and there (ironically for one of the rolls, all the frames were ok except for one particular one that I really liked that had a scratch! sob!!!). anyone has any good labs to reccomend?

 

[hyun]

Yes, i wonder if straight or wavy scratch lines might tell a story as to how it occured.

Camera:

which part of the camera can cause scratches? The film take-up spool? That just winds film round and round, it doesn't sound like it can scratch.

Dust collecting on the film BACK area? film does slide across it (and i suppose comes into contact?) so if you close the film compartment door with some dust still attached, i suppose it can do damage. but i did check my film back before closing. nothing there.

the FRONT of the film compartment? in SLRs that's the shutter area and the area around the shutter. the shutter doesn't come into contact with the film. but the frame around the shutter, i suppose, like the film back, does touch. again i make sure there's no dust there.

dust getting INTO the film compartment, or existing dust flying around? still, these newly-introduced dust particles need to settle somewhere to cause damage, and looks like the film FRONT and BACK areas in the compartment are the only places it can do so.

dust flying inside, landing onto the felt? and then causing scratches during the winding/rewinding?

and frankly, how much damage can one speck of dust do? not sand, but just the tiny dust particle.

well i sent a roll to Colour Lab at Adelphi to see if the scratches materialise. Trying to chase down the fault still.

 

[hoppinghippo]

hyun, I agree, I think unless you're shooting near the sea or desert or something, else it's hard to say a sand particle got into the camera, I"ve shot several times out on reef flats but was careful not to change lens or film there and I didn't get any scratch probs with my film. I am just guessing but I think the usual dust particles we would get normally can't scratch film?

I think you could experiment by shooting 2 rolls at the same time and same place, then give one to ruby and one to another lab and then see the result? and yeah its interesting to note that not many shops wear gloves when handling negs.

 

[woosy]

hyun, I agree, I think unless you're shooting near the sea or desert or something, else it's hard to say a sand particle got into the camera, I"ve shot several times out on reef flats but was careful not to change lens or film there and I didn't get any scratch probs with my film. I am just guessing but I think the usual dust particles we would get normally can't scratch film?

i was shooting in the desert! one roll did has scratches but not all the desert rolls. ironically, no scratches appear before i clean the camera with a blower when i was back in the hostel... still trying to recall how did it happen. i am always been careful, sea or desert. guess we all playing investigators?! kekeke maybe one of us should open our own developing shop. how much start up har? jus dreaming lah...
hyun my slide are with colorlab too, i'm collecting on sat to see if it materialise on the prints. Also waiting for service center to come back with my camera check up report. Let you all know what's the verdict, not so soon for the latter though...

 

[hoppinghippo]

woosy maybe when you opened up to blow blow the camera, you actually blowed more sand from the exterior or the lining seals into the cam?

 

[hyun]

heh woosy, i also collecting mine on saturday, probably about 1 pm. just 1 roll, but sigh, not cheap, $9 mounted. some people gave bad reviews of the general quality of colour lab's output but i dun really have any reliable information on their slide dev/mounting service. *fingers crossed*

changing lenses shouldn't introduce too much dust but u're right - the dust gets into the front compartment, and when u snap fotos, the mirror flicks up, the shutter opens, there is air exchange, it can communicate. maybe that's why i might have dust even though i tried to be careful during loading of film.

will update u guys on my findings once i see the results on saturday.

 

[hoppinghippo]

hahah hyun, you used "COMMUNICATE" ... hahahahhahahahahahahaa the medical fella in you coming out again eh? have you sterilised your camera today?

 

[woosy]

ya hor i suspect also... maybe next time i blow blow blow, click click click, and blow blow blow more times so more air exchange mayb will get all things out. who knows maybe its still the lab!!!
i think what i did as a ritual everyday (well almost) is i blow compartment cuz dust kept getting in for some reason.(even when i don't change my lens). i didn't blow the back, maybe only once but i cant trace the date...
hyun, see if i can make it that time then can exchange scratches...i sent mine to RGB no mount, but still got scratch lah, water mark also.. think my luck run out. see what the colorlab boss says..

 

[hyun]

yeah let's exchange scratches heh.
some1 also mentioned before about RGB's water marks and scratches. i think i've experienced scratches before, unmounted. but i didn't notice water marks.

i hear if u send to ruby to send to "Fuji" to do it, it'll cost more but will be better.

 

[woosy]

was told RGB is pro lab and its cheap lor... how much ruby charge?
initially intended to send to some slides prints to ruby and colorlab to test and i wanted white border all round. ruby charge extra 5 cents per print so i went colorlab instead. otherwise the price is the same $1 4R, $0.60 3R. i didn't notice the scratches or water marks until colorlab point out to me.. sob