Another discussion on "requesting for budget photography services"

[catchlights]

a thread posted in Service Wanted section rising some discussions on low price photography service.

the original service request post is at post #2,


feel free to post your views and comments,
please keep the discussion civil and constructive,
we are here to help to make this photography community a better place for everyone.

 

[CloverKG]

Dear all,


Looking for a photographer on 7/30 afternoon, Fort Canning, at 3:45pm sharp. After ROM, we will head towards Raffles Hotel for a short banquet and some shoots. Everything ends before 7:45. Price is 200.
Please contact 8518 4448 with your portfolio, thanks.

 

[Redsun]

thats like tomorrow?
good luck

 

[Skydew3]

Congrats TS on your ROM. All the best in finding the right photographer for your ROM. Goos luck

 

[red eye]

Dear all,


Looking for a photographer on 7/30 afternoon, Fort Canning, at 3:45pm sharp. After ROM, we will head towards Raffles Hotel for a short banquet and some shoots. Everything ends before 7:45. Price is 200.
Please contact 8518 4448 with your portfolio, thanks.

4 hours of work for $200, and some more its tomorrow.. GOOD LUCK!

for those willing to take this job, consider the amount of time you have edit your photos, your transport and the responsibility of getting the photos right

learn the proper way and not spoil market... let them learn their lesson, thinking the photography and video is the last in their priority... if it is then they may as well just ask one of the brothers or friends take it for them.. they dont need to spend $200

still ask for portfolio for this price? you expect a world class photographer ?

 

[catchlights]

My reply is for anyone who are new and keen into photography business, the "you' as in collective, I'm not pinpointing any individual here.



when you shoot for money, be it full time or part time, it is a business.
Do you people really know how much is the cost of running a photography business?

If you are into business, first thing is to price your service to be profitable, so your business is sustainable, you will be very happy to wake up every morning and go to work.
even if you don't get enough assignments, you still know you are not losing money.

but if you price your service so cheap to get more assignments, the more jobs you do, the more money you lose.
in the end, you will quit, because you lost money, you burnt out, you hate what you do, you hate your customers, you hate everyone including yourself.



Even you are only shooting for fun, making some extra pocket money for funding your hobby, you also need to price yourself right,
because when you holding a DSLR standing in front of the wedding couples,their family members and guests.
They don't see you as a hobbyist, they see you as a professional, because you collect money and they expect you to deliver results.
The have no ideal that photographers will charge $700 to $1000 for a 4 hours wedding event shoot.

If you think an assignment like this 200-300 is good enough for you, do you know what kind of impression you give to the 100 people you will serve?
they will think that all the photographers charging $700 to $1000 for a 4 hour shoot are day light robbery, don't you think this is really unfair to those making a living with their skills and craft?
and do you think you want to do this for long term? or how long can you sustain with this kind of pricing?

If you really can't do it right, than please don't make a mess and leave the problems behind.
and please don't tell me; "so many people are doing this, there is no different whether I'm doing it or not?"

Please ask yourself, what can you do to make this photography community a better place for everyone today?

 

[tommyk]

Guys, lets give him benefit of doubt . Maybe his photographer last minute pull out.

or what our bro meant was $200 is just for being there to shoot the photograph, and he will pay -
$10 for each 4x6
$30 for each 8x10
full transport reimbursement up to $100
Angpow from his family members
And a chance to shake hands with dignitaries
Etc.......

 

[mnjohar]

Guys, lets give him benefit of doubt . Maybe his photographer last minute pull out.

or what our bro meant was $200 is just for being there to shoot the photograph, and he will pay -
$10 for each 4x6
$30 for each 8x10
full transport reimbursement up to $100
Angpow from his family members
And a chance to shake hands with dignitaries
Etc.......

nicely put

 

[red eye]

Guys, lets give him benefit of doubt . Maybe his photographer last minute pull out.

or what our bro meant was $200 is just for being there to shoot the photograph, and he will pay -
$10 for each 4x6
$30 for each 8x10
full transport reimbursement up to $100
Angpow from his family members
And a chance to shake hands with dignitaries
Etc.......

are you really this naive?

 

[atsui]

To the TS, CloverKG,
- is the below what you are offering?
- Did you authorise tommyk to make an offer on your behalf?

Please clarify.

Guys, lets give him benefit of doubt . Maybe his photographer last minute pull out.

or what our bro meant was $200 is just for being there to shoot the photograph, and he will pay -
$10 for each 4x6
$30 for each 8x10
full transport reimbursement up to $100
Angpow from his family members
And a chance to shake hands with dignitaries
Etc.......

 

[xtremeonline]

Dear all,


Looking for a photographer on 7/30 afternoon, Fort Canning, at 3:45pm sharp. After ROM, we will head towards Raffles Hotel for a short banquet and some shoots. Everything ends before 7:45. Price is 200.
Please contact 8518 4448 with your portfolio, thanks.

Hello, can people like you stop thinking that Clubsnap's service wanted section is the place to find cheap photography?
It's really annoying to see everyone is on a tight budget and offering cheap price.
And all aiming for student. Student who carrys a 5Dmk3 also need money to buy that DSLR.
What make you think that student = cheap.

If you pay me that price, I'm gonna use my Canon G15 to take for you.
Pay for what you get.

 

[Lighthouse]

Since this section is moderated, the only way to stop this section from becoming a place to shop for cheap photography is not to let this ad goes online. But then it is not easy for the mod to determine the 'right' price for the job.

I wonder is it possible for the moderator to do something? I know there are lots of implications but....I guess that is the only way.

 

[nanof4]

Wow ... raffles hotel leh ... veri high class venue ..

 

[catchlights]

Since this section is moderated, the only way to stop this section from becoming a place to shop for cheap photography is not to let this ad goes online. But then it is not easy for the mod to determine the 'right' price for the job.

I wonder is it possible for the moderator to do something? I know there are lots of implications but....I guess that is the only way.

Why do people come here to look for free and cheap photography?
Simply we allow them in the first place, because we are giving them what they want, the free and cheap photography.

we have already taken some small steps, implementing all service wanted thread need to indicate payment details.

but how do we determine what is "reasonable" rate? FYI, do you know we might get into trouble by instigate photographers to do "price fixing" on our services?


the "right" price has to be work out by photographers themselves, they have to find out their operating cost, variable cost, material cost, labour cost, the perceive value of their talent/skills/branding, and plus the profit they intent to make.
but what I see here is everyone just copy from other photographers' price list, add some discount and paste into their own site, they just think this is the so call "market rate", without considering will they able to cover all their own expenses or not.

so if every photographers want to stop people from coming here to look for free and cheap photography,
every photographers have to do their parts, charging a right price, let our customers understand the value of our services.
If the customers don't understand this, value our services, they are NOT our customers, just let them go,
We CAN'T and DON'T HAVE TO serve every customers who walk into our doors.
We only need a handful of customers who appreciate our services and willing to pay the price we are asking.

and don't feel bad about some customers "can't afford" our photography service,
we need to understand this, photography services is a luxury item, is not a essential item,
nobody need photography services, they just want photography services.


So, are we willing to start to do our parts now?

 

[fooj]

Why do people come here to look for free and cheap photography?
Simply we allow them in the first place, because we are giving them what they want, the free and cheap photography.

we have already taken some small steps, implementing all service wanted thread need to indicate payment details.

but how do we determine what is "reasonable" rate? FYI, do you know we might get into trouble by instigate photographers to do "price fixing" on our services?


the "right" price has to be work out by photographers themselves, they have to find out their operating cost, variable cost, material cost, labour cost, the perceive value of their talent/skills/branding, and plus the profit they intent to make.
but what I see here is everyone just copy from other photographers' price list, add some discount and paste into their own site, they just think this is the so call "market rate", without considering will they able to cover all their own expenses or not.

so if every photographers want to stop people from coming here to look for free and cheap photography,
every photographers have to do their parts, charging a right price, let our customers understand the value of our services.
If the customers don't understand this, value our services, they are NOT our customers, just let them go,
We CAN'T and DON'T HAVE TO serve every customers who walk into our doors.
We only need a handful of customers who appreciate our services and willing to pay the price we are asking.

and don't feel bad about some customers "can't afford" our photography service,
we need to understand this, photography services is a luxury item, is not a essential item,
nobody need photography services, they just want photography services.


So, are we willing to start to do our parts now?

Strongly agreed what catchlights had said. For those who just gotten your DSLR and wanted to have a sting being a photographer, please price yourself correctly. Probably after one try being a photographer, you discovered that this job is not for you, but when you did accepted the overly low paid rate of $200 to cover a 5-6 hours event, you are setting professional photographers up. Imagine the client's devilish smile when they tell their friends that the photographer was found in Clubsnap forum and they paid so cheap for the service. Next time everyone will flock to Clubsnap to look for such service. Super sad right.

If you are new and does not know how to shoot an event, please do not offer free service to build portfolio. Because you will not learn anything from it, let along build a portfolio from it. You should tag along a season photographer instead.

If you have little experience in covering event, start to price yourself at $60 or $85 per hour rate.

 

[catchlights]

Wow ... raffles hotel leh ... veri high class venue ..

this is exactly shows what I'm saying,

people don't need photography services, if it does come cheap, they don't mind having it.

and for something that they really want it, they will find a budget for that.

 

[sjackal]

Strongly agreed what catchlights had said. For those who just gotten your DSLR and wanted to have a sting being a photographer, please price yourself correctly. Probably after one try being a photographer, you discovered that this job is not for you, but when you did accepted the overly low paid rate of $200 to cover a 5-6 hours event, you are setting professional photographers up. Imagine the client's devilish smile when they tell their friends that the photographer was found in Clubsnap forum and they paid so cheap for the service. Next time everyone will flock to Clubsnap to look for such service. Super sad right.

If you are new and does not know how to shoot an event, please do not offer free service to build portfolio. Because you will not learn anything from it, let along build a portfolio from it. You should tag along a season photographer instead.

If you have little experience in covering event, start to price yourself at $60 or $85 per hour rate.

And there are some swallow people (some, and not necessary referring to TS or anyone) who thinks all cheap services means the people are beneath them and they can bully upon, the same type of people who bully cashiers, waiters, cleaners and they will extend this courtesy to the cheap photographer.

 

[red eye]

Why do people come here to look for free and cheap photography?
Simply we allow them in the first place, because we are giving them what they want, the free and cheap photography.

we have already taken some small steps, implementing all service wanted thread need to indicate payment details.

but how do we determine what is "reasonable" rate? FYI, do you know we might get into trouble by instigate photographers to do "price fixing" on our services?


the "right" price has to be work out by photographers themselves, they have to find out their operating cost, variable cost, material cost, labour cost, the perceive value of their talent/skills/branding, and plus the profit they intent to make.
but what I see here is everyone just copy from other photographers' price list, add some discount and paste into their own site, they just think this is the so call "market rate", without considering will they able to cover all their own expenses or not.

so if every photographers want to stop people from coming here to look for free and cheap photography,
every photographers have to do their parts, charging a right price, let our customers understand the value of our services.
If the customers don't understand this, value our services, they are NOT our customers, just let them go,
We CAN'T and DON'T HAVE TO serve every customers who walk into our doors.
We only need a handful of customers who appreciate our services and willing to pay the price we are asking.

and don't feel bad about some customers "can't afford" our photography service,
we need to understand this, photography services is a luxury item, is not a essential item,
nobody need photography services, they just want photography services.


So, are we willing to start to do our parts now?

Maybe can do categorized jobs? under $500 or above $500 jobs? dont know if thats possible?

or maybe say jobs for newbies? or jobs for more pro something like that just so you can differentiate somehow?

 

[red eye]

during film times, before they actually become photographers, they are apprentices, thats how they learned

nowadays, buy camera, yay i'm now a photographer! i should start charging and offering my service! i'll just copy what people do online can already! lol

 

[JasonB]

I did a search on this CloverKG's postings and threads.

And found out that he is offering wedding photography services himself:
http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/phot...55-acidacidgrass-photography.html#post8306728

If he is looking for a photographer for his own wedding for such rates, it clearly shows he don't appreciate the value of this field nor respects his peers, nor see any importance in his own work or his own wedding.

If he is looking for a photographer to shoot his work for him, such actions hints at a manipulative nature against other photographers, dishonesty against his own wedding clients, or his unreliability in flaking out at the last minute, or just plain incompetence.

I looked at the quality of his 'work', sorry, cannot make it, still a point and shoot guy playing with photoshop effects. Pity the wedding couples. If you aim this kind of price, you get this kind of work and this kind of result.

I have nothing good to say for this person. Sorry.

I am sorry if my post hurts any feelings. I am sorry.